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Having read a few forums and group chats this morning, it would appear that our team for Sunday and the remainder of the season should be : Butland anyone but Tav Anyone but Goldson Souttar or anyone but Souttar an unfit and injured Yilmaz Sterling (as well as playing right back and left back and left wing) anyone but Lundstrum McCausland anyone but Lawrence, Dowell or Cantwell anyone but Silva anyone but Dessers or Silva but possibly Sima

If he has I'm backing Clement, get rid of the players.

Teams seem to have figured us out. Tav and Sterling barely got out our half all match, certainly significantly less than they were a few weeks ago. Other sides realise how important both full backs are to how we attack and have changed tactics to prevent it. We need to have a counter to that. I assume much more was expected of Cantwell and Lawrence last night, creative players capable of producing something that wins you a match. Both were poor, losing possession regularly and slowing us down instead of upping the tempo. Goldson's 'passing' was horrible last night and on Sunday. But, if there's no pass to midfield and no pass to the wings then it's either back to the keeper or across to Souter. Eventually though it goes long. His passing should be better, but the long balls shouldn't be needed in the first place. So many players seem to have lost form at the same time you do wonder if there's an issue we don't know about. A problem in the dressing room, a bug that's swept through the squad and drained players of energy. I'm grasping at straws here because I don't understand how the entire side, with the possible exception of Butland, can collectively lose form simultaneously. Everyone was rotten last night, defenders, midfielders, forwards and subs. Amazingly, despite the collapse, we can still win the league if we win all our games. I mean I don't think we will, anyone with eyes can see we're so far off it. It's massively frustrating, but I can see why Clement is talking things up and putting a gloss on things. He needs to work with the players he's got, throwing them under the bus at this stage won't help.

Have they changed your medication?

The chickens are coming home to roost. NEVER MESS WITH THE JUJU!! @Whosthedado had the title won two weeks ago...

Three points off the top...five games remaining, a cup in play, and it's all hands to panic stations... Am I saying we are gonna run the table? No. But shit man...watch till the credits.

The overriding narrative tonight is that the “old guard” are at fault. It is simplistic nonsense to pin a collapse like this on Tav, Goldson and Lundstram. Fans love a simple answer to a complex problem and that's what they've gone for. The sudden turn in our form since Hearts has been utterly mind boggling and I have no idea what has caused it, but I do know that the simplistic narrative being peddled tonight is not the answer.

I have no idea why people take pressers at face value. No manager tells the absolute truth when facing the press.

We've been playing poorly for weeks and there's no indication we'll improve. The game against them at Ibrox was when we blew it. That was a must win game and we couldn't do it.

Here is a couple of interesting stats Today was Clements 24th league game and he has secured 59 points. That's exactly the same total that Beale collected in 24 league games (only 3 more than Gio did). If we win our last 6 league games this season, we will win the league, however it'll match our points tally for last season. Just reinforces we haven't improved, Celtic have regressed dramatically.

Ridvan and Davies need moved on. Davies another massive waste of resources. Our recruitment has been criminal.

I said it last week but some of our mainstays are not winners. We need to look at getting rid of Goldson, Tav and Lundstram - they're all past it.

Tav’s corners are garbage. Can the manager not see this?

Utter dross - if only we had signed a striker in January who could defend

One thing that was glaring last night, more than normal, is that we didn't have a midfielder on the pitch who was brave enough to take the ball and with his first touch, face the opposition goal. Everytime that the ball was played to Lundstrum last night, his first touch was towards his own goal. While that doesn't sound like its a massive issue, when we are building from the back, its fundamental to play quick. To play quickly, the first touch has to be a positive touch, otherwise the opposition get an extra few seconds to press and close down space. Compound that with the fact that Lundstrum is the deepest midifielder, you're stuffed because teams find it easy to set up against us. Dio was hugely missed last night (and on Sunday)as, while he sometimes can be erratic, he is always positive with that first touch which opens things up and has teams scrambling more. The way to kind of mitigate this is to stretch teams with wingers, but last night we started with Sima and Silva, neither of which are out and out wingers with width. Matondo came on but always looks to come inside so, again, no width. Add to that, two right footers on the left side means the balance of our squad is some of the worst I have ever seen it. There were many things wrong last night, but that was the most glaring things to me

@CammyF's list: Yilmaz Yilmaz Yilmaz Yilmaz Yilmaz Dessers gets a bonus and a new 10-year contract. @der Berliner's list: Tavernier Tavernier Tavernier Tavernier Tavernier Scott Wright gets a bumper new deal, and is made captain.

I'm still gutted from last night, but one thing has become obvious to me. When I was considering who stays and who goes I came to the conclusion that there is not one player in the current squad it would sadden me to loose. I have also noticed a few mentioned we need to buy players capable of beating Ross Co, not Man shitty. The players we have are well capable of they that but for whatever reason have decided not to do so. For some like Goldson, Tav and Lundstram this is not the first time they have let down us, the club and the manager.

If you can’t sell them and they aren’t good enough then you don’t play them and you still look for replacements. I honestly think their mentality seeps through the squad and infects new players. Look at what’s happened to Cantwell and Raskin for instance, they were completely different players when they first joined. I actually said this a year ago, the mentality gets spread through the new signings like a virus and everyone just ends up believing we can’t beat Celtic. I really think we do need a clean break fro, most of these players. Or we can just keep playing them and accept we will be second best.

Got to hand it to the lads. Staved off defeat. Plucky.

It is quite the conundrum. We need to make changes but it is not obvious who would make a difference. If the manager made changes to key players he would be taking a massive risk under these circumstances. I can't see it happening at this stage.

Robbie Fraser is 21 and has not been able to force his way into our first team under Gerrard, Gio, Beale or Clement. His contract is up next month and I think we can assume he'll be leaving the club.

Yilmaz is turkish for Roofe

This is the first stadium I ever seen the Rangers playing in Cathkin park home of Third Lanark

Derek Underwood obituary: Spin bowler considered one of England’s all-time greats Nicknamed Deadly, he had a unique style that made him almost unplayable new The Times Monday April 15 2024, 2.30pm, The Times Derek Underwood obituary: Spin bowler considered one of England’s all-time greats (thetimes.co.uk) Fresh-faced, courteous and polite to a fault, Derek Underwood appeared to be too nice a man to excel against rough-hewn Australians and bouncer happy West Indians in the cauldron of Test cricket. This was deceptive. Geoffrey Boycott, his longstanding England team-mate, described him as having “the face of a choirboy, the demeanour of a civil servant — and the ruthlessness of a rat catcher”. Indeed, Underwood’s nickname was “Deadly”, bestowed because in helpful conditions he was exactly that. On rain-affected pitches his sharp left-arm cutters, delivered from a flat-footed run at near medium pace and allied with metronomic accuracy, made him almost unplayable. Even on placid pitches his immaculate control and subtle variations of line and length could frustrate and undermine the best batsmen. Although he possessed great determination and pride in performance, both for himself and for his county and country — and would glare at fielders if the batsman pinched a single — Underwood’s personal ambitions were confined to his own game. “Why do so many players want to be captain?” he asked plaintively. Cricket politics were not for him and his essential decency was such that he tended not to take sides in disagreements. The ability to bowl came so naturally that if he fretted over any aspect of his profession, it was whether he could cope in retirement. Given that he was a world-class cricketer, Underwood was woefully underpaid. This resulted in his joining the two highly contentious breakaway events of his era: Kerry Packer’s World Series and a tour to South Africa in 1982. Both were unofficial and, because he was so highly regarded, Underwood gave them some respectability. This did not prevent the authorities from implementing lengthy bans, which curtailed his England appearances. Underwood and Alan Knott, his Kent and England wicket-keeper with whom he formed a telepathic understanding, were initially both sacked by their county for joining Packer, a decision which Les Ames, their former cricket manager and mentor, described as “repugnant and distasteful”. Until their retirements in the mid-1980s they were not even consulted over changes of captaincy at Canterbury: county committees were omnipotent. Derek Leslie Underwood was born in Bromley, Kent. He was given an early taste of cricket from his father, a useful club bowler, who was so determined that he and his older brother, Keith, should take up the game that he built a net in his garden. Derek’s ability soon emerged. At Dulwich College Preparatory School he took nine wickets for ten runs in an under-tens match and continued to shine at Beckenham and Penge Grammar School, making 96 in a match against the staff and taking all ten wickets against a rival school. He was recommended to Kent after attending a cricket school in Croydon, where he was coached by two England players, Ken Barrington and Tony Lock. He had started as a quick bowler but realised he would be more effective if he reduced his pace. He took easily to spin. At 16 he was in Kent’s second XI, taking nine wickets against Hampshire in his first match. He was only 17 when he made his first-class debut in 1963, taking four wickets against a strong Yorkshire side, and he went on to top 100 wickets for the season, the youngest player to do so. His arm ball, which dipped in to the right-hander, won many lbw decisions. He was the outstanding English spin bowler of his era and, with the arguable exception of Jim Laker, the finest to emerge since the Second World War. His 86 Tests brought him 297 wickets at a respectable average of 25.83, and he would have taken many more had he not decided to join Packer and tour South Africa. A tail-end batsman, he was often deployed as an England night watchman and as such showed great courage against the ferocious West Indian pace attack. He was a reliable outfielder who missed little. The supreme professional, he always kept his feelings under control. Even quixotic captaincy decisions, such as not bowling him at the right time in a Lord’s one-day final which Kent narrowly lost, were accepted without complaint or rancour. At the Oval in 1968 he helped England to a remarkable win against Australia which squared the series. At lunch on the final day Australia were 86 for five and heading for a heavy defeat. A cloudburst then flooded the ground, making further play seem unlikely, but thanks to the valiant mopping up efforts of the ground staff, helped by volunteers from the crowd, the match resumed just before 5pm. Getting the ball to turn and lift from the damp pitch and with every England fielder crouched round the bat, Underwood took four wickets in 27 balls to secure victory with minutes to spare. He finished with seven for 50. From then on, though occasionally left out to make way for an extra seamer or for Norman Gifford, who bowled at a slower pace, he was England’s premier spinner. Shrewd enough to adapt to different conditions, he was often as effective overseas as on English pitches, which would normally be expected to give him more help. In Australia, where he got little turn, he took pace off the ball and relied more on flight. He had some spectacular figures. During the home series against New Zealand in 1969 he had match returns of 11 for 70 at Lord’s and 12 for 101 at the Oval. In New Zealand in 1971 his 12 for 98 at Christchurch included his 1,000th first-class wicket. He was 25 and only George Lohmann and Wilfred Rhodes had reached the landmark younger. On a rain-affected pitch at Lord’s in 1974 he had a spell of six wickets for two runs as Pakistan collapsed from 192 for three to 226 all out. In 1977 he was one of the first batch of England players to be recruited for Packer. This dismayed some admirers and he admitted that the decision had been a painful one to make. Indeed, he, along with Colin Cowdrey, his Kent and sometime England captain with whom he had an excellent relationship, had been lone voices in saying they would be prepared to play an additional Test match on the 1970-71 tour of Australia without extra remuneration. But cricketers, even established Test players, were not well paid and had little security. A generous contract with Packer was too good to turn down and offered Underwood and his family a chance to secure their financial future. After a High Court decision thwarted an attempt by Lord’s to ban the Packer players from all first-class cricket, Underwood was able to continue playing for Kent, and in 1979 he was restored to the England side. Of the players who had signed for Packer, he missed Test cricket the most. But in March 1982, directly after playing a Test in Sri Lanka, he joined the breakaway tour to South Africa, earning a reported £40,000 for five weeks’ cricket. This time a three-year ban from Tests was unchallenged and it ended Underwood’s international career. He went on playing county cricket until his early forties, retiring at the end of the 1987 season. In all first-class matches he took 2,465 wickets at an average of just over 20, conceding barely two runs an over. His one century came against Sussex at Hastings when he was 39. Appropriately enough, this was on the ground on which he had taken his best figures, nine for 28. Underwood, left, with fellow cricketing heroes Geoffrey Boycott, Bob Woolmer and Alan Knott NEWS GROUP NEWSPAPERS LTD

We've been worse since McCausland has been (hopefully) rested.

When a team has defenders that can’t defend your in trouble from the word go add that to our half backs/midfielders who’s build up is so slow and ponderous you’re up shit creek .

Got what we deserved from that with a performance as bad as anything I can remember. Don't think we had one player that can say they did what they were asked to do and the lack of quality was stark. All is not lost but if the players don't believe, I doubt many fans will either.

This is the day we lost the league, not just because of today but because we haven’t turned up for weeks and today was in the post.

It's annoying when you have to agree with Sutton. We have a league to win and you'd struggle to think that with the way we wander about the pitch. We have to work so much harder and show a lot more quality.

Right, I'm ready for an uneventful hammering of the Stags with no fuss whatsoever. Who's with me?

Can I take Cammy's 5 and Rousseau's 5 as well please.

Indeed, if the cap fits and all that 😉 . i'd stick him in Lawrences' position ,because when we get a new right back next season that's where he'll end up playing anyway. The punishing runs from RB position aren't getting any easier for Tav .

Keeping Cantwell would be fine with me, but he needs to be more consistent as when he is in form, he is a good player. We can't rely on Ridvan, that's a matter of fact, not opinion. Just look at his availability / selection since he arrived. Plus his stats show that he is no better or worse than a declining Barasic (who'll thankfully leave at the end of the season). I'd be agreeable to extending Sima's loan (as we won't be buying him). Same with Cortes but will depend on how he recovers from his injury. Silva should be sent straight back to Wolves. The board are at a cross-road. The squad requires major investment / surgery this summer and that will come at a cost. It took SG 3 seasons to assemble a team that eventually won us the league, I'd say we are in a similar position now as we were when he took over. Recruit is key - we simply havent replaced the likes of Aribo, Kamera, Morelos, Kent, Helander and even the likes of Arfield. We might not win another title with Tav and / or Goldson but moving them on / dropping them wouldn't magically transform us into title winners. The issue is far more deep routed that just Tav and Goldson.

There's definitely something not working with certain members of this playing squad. It's been a never ending cycle of let downs with a few of them, 55 excepted. Clement has my full backing.

There have been bright periods under Clement but those have completely disappeared in recent weeks. Whether it's fatigue or a lack of belief, the quality just isn't there. It's disappointing after clawing our way back into a challenge but, ultimately, we're just not good enough. Barring a miracle, the title has gone so we can only hope the preparation has already begun to revamp our squad for 2024/25. Many new players required and that won't be cheap. But we must build a squad that can meet both the physical and mental demands that this one can't.

Whilst I hope for a great performance and a decent victory, I'd snap your hand off for a 1-0 win right now.

Surname wasn't El-Nakla, was it?

Barca had 2 in the starting line up, one who is 16 and has started nearly 50 games now, with 6 caps for Spain, and one who's 17 and has played over 100 games, with 20 odd caps - We in this country still think that a 21 year old is young. Barasic, please no.

Are the number of "we've blown it" posts on this thread an attempt at reverse juju?

......post-Independence Record breakers? Arkadag FC and the winning streak still under scrutiny Turkmenistan’s champions lay claim to a world record but some suspect details lie behind their dazzling winning run John Duerden Tue 16 Apr 2024 08.00 BST Record breakers? Arkadag FC and the winning streak still under scrutiny | Football | The Guardian It’s not often that a football world record goes from Wales to Saudi Arabia only for Turkmenistan to also have a claim. In March, Al-Hilal surpassed the achievement of 27 consecutive top-tier wins set by The New Saints of Wales in 2016. The 18-time Saudi champions have now extended that streak to 34 and look unstoppable at home and abroad. The same can be said in central Asia where Arkadag FC have won every competitive game in their history. The 2023 league title was lifted in December with 72 points from 24 matches. Throw in seven cup victories and six from six so far this season and it comes to 37 and counting. Yet the world record resides in Riyadh, over a thousand miles to the west. What gives? “There’s relatively little detail available for the Turkmenistan league, less than we want for the kind of due diligence we carry out in our research for this and similar records,” a spokesperson for Guinness World Records told the Guardian. “This may also be indicative of a level of governance and competition under what we’d ordinarily look for as well. All this being considered, we have confirmed Al-Hilal as the record holder.” A lack of detail may be down to the fact that Turkmenistan, home to 6.5 million people, is one of the most isolated and secretive countries in the world and, even given the growing importance of the wider region in geopolitical affairs, rarely gets a mention in the western media. In terms of governance and competition, the way Arkadag were formed may also be an issue. It all started with Gurbanguly Berdymukhamedov, the president of Turkmenistan from 2006 to 2022. Berdymukhamedov revelled in his nickname of “Arkadag”, which means “hero protector”. One of his pet projects before he handed the reins of power to his son, Serdar (nominally, at least, as many observers believe father is still pulling the strings), was the foundation of a new city in the south of the country, a smart city that cost upwards of $5bn. A city that, unsurprisingly, is called Arkadag. Home to more than 70,000 people it needed a football team so, ahead of the 2023 season, the best players in the country joined the newly formed club. National team stalwarts like Arslanmyrat Amanow and Altymyrat Annadurdyyew were soon wearing the shirts designed by Berdymukhamedov which, unsurprisingly given his obsession with the animal, sported a logo of a horse. The league’s transfer window was extended to facilitate this influx. The rise of Arkadag FC is almost pleasingly nostalgic for anyone who remember the former army and secret police outfits that dominated eastern bloc leagues in the cold war era. Fans of rival clubs may not agree, however, especially as they suspect favourable officiating – such as in a November clash with Sagadam when, with the score at 2-2 going into the final seconds, the new boys were given a controversial penalty and subsequently won. Indeed that game was a rare close affair, with the champions ending the season with a +66 goal difference. So far this season, that margin is +30 after six games. There are few public complaints as Turkmenistan is not really the place to criticise projects close to the heart of the former president. Guinness World Records misgivings are unlikely to be well received. Berdymukhamedov is known to be keen to get his new city into the storied book in some manner and club officials believe once the team starts competing in Asian competitions, which is scheduled for the summer, then their case for inclusion will be there in black and white for Guinness to see. Al-Hilal also have state backing, largely owned as they are by Saudi Arabia’s Public Investment Fund, which is chaired by the country’s Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman. There are also plenty of fans in the country who believe the Blues get the rub of the green when it comes to refereeing decisions. To be fair to the Riyadh giants, they were the most successful club in Saudi Arabia and Asia in terms of titles – 18 and four respectively – before PIF took charge of them in 2023. This season, however, has been something else – the 34 successive wins has them on course for an unprecedented quadruple. Last week saw the head coach, Jorge Jesus, and stars such as Rúben Neves and Kalidou Koulibaly (Neymar and Aleksandar Mitrovic are injured) get their hands on trophy No 1 with a 4-1 victory over Al-Ittihad in the Saudi Super Cup final. Riyadh rivals Al-Nassr were beaten in the semi-final, a game that saw Cristiano Ronaldo sent off for elbowing the Al-Hilal defender Ali al-Bulaihi. Al-Hilal are 12 points clear of second-placed Al-Nassr in the Saudi Pro League with seven games to go. League title 19 is incoming. Then there are two semi-finals in April: the King’s Cup, Saudi Arabia’s domestic knockout competition, against Al-Ittihad, and the Asian Champions League clash against Al-Ain of the United Arab Emirates. Al-Hilal are favourites to win both and a fifth Asian title would put them two clear of the next two most successful clubs: Pohang Steelers of South Korea and Japan’s Urawa Reds. Asia is also the next stage for Arkadag. Can they translate their domestic dominance into overseas success? The ambition is certainly there and sooner or later they may well find themselves on the same pitch as Al-Hilal in a game that these two teams won’t be able to both definitely win.

We can do it and, ironically, now we have the underdog status again, we may play better but there are two key issues: 1) We're not scoring enough goals 2) We're conceding too many As such, I think the odds are against us but you never know...

The first five minutes of the second half? It has been a lethargic, disjointed first half where we have been the beneficiaries of good fortune, mainly the own goal that puts us one up. We have created another three opportunities to stretch further ahead but spurn them. The second half begins with our kick off and, several seconds later Borna puts a raking diagonal straight out of play. During the next two minutes, we play a couple of balls on the edge of the County box, lose possession and on both occasions, County pick out a pass to central, forward player. He has time for a controlling touch, turns and, gets his head up to release a pass to breaking wide teammates. Three minutes later, the previous two instances are repeated and on these occasions, County put the ball in the back of our pokey twice. Those first five minutes of the second period epitomised our performance today. Ross County played with a discipline, structure and, an energy. Well done County on your first ever victory over Rangers, fully deserved.

As well us being unable to defeat Celtic, we have dropped 11 points to teams who have finished in the bottom 6. Let's be brutally honest, we were only in the title race as Celtic have regressed. We have the same failings under Clement as we did under Gio and a Beale. I'm not writing Clement off but we can't deny that recently, his team selections and tactics have been baffling and have cost us dearly. We need a huge change in mindset right through the club. The honeymoon periods are over.

Which was actually my point...... Our defence is in far more need of change than our forward players.