No quality, no bottle, no Progrès - Should the manager be sacked?

[der Berliner 3,234]

I've been thinking of who the worst side we've ever been drawn against in Europe is. I think it's Progres but I could accept Gota from the Faroes might have been worse. They were Faroe champions at the time though so they might be expected to beat the 4th best side in Luxembourg.

Valletta of Malta are pretty poor too. Again they were Champions when we last met them but not when we met them in the 80s. To be fair we did score a barrel load against them that time. Anyone I've missed?

 

Yeah, another excercise that is. Now help yourself to a record book and check at what stage of the season and time of year we played those teams.

[JohnMc 2,463]

Yeah, another excercise that is. Now help yourself to a record book and check at what stage of the season and time of year we played those teams.

 

 

Aha, the famous peaking of Luxembourg players in July syndrome, ach well, right enough I should cut Pedro some slack, how are we supposed to expect him to deal with that massive disadvantage.

[JohnMc 2,463]

I think you've just picked out what you wanted to from my post. How can the manager possibly be blamed for having almost no time to bring in a new bunch of players, get them fit and familiar with a style he wants to play, and all within a few weeks....remain optimistic and I'm looking forward to seeing how the manager and new players perform over the next few months. That seems reasonable to me, but I accept it's not for you.

 

Okay, why? Why are you optimistic, what can you see that I can't. PC had a below average CV before joining us and has been mediocre since arriving, why do you still have faith?

Edited July 12, 2017 by JohnMc
Playing the ball, not the man.

[pete 2,499]

Discussions are always better than arguments because arguments are to find out who is right. Discussions are to find out what is right.

[JohnMc 2,463]

Discussions are always better than arguments because arguments are to find out who is right. Discussions are to find out what is right.

 

Yip, fair enough, I've edited the post above. I should know better.

[Gaffer 1,665]

Okay, why? Why are you optimistic, what can you see that I can't. PC had a below average CV before joining us and has been mediocre since arriving, why do you still have faith?

 

What I see is a man who is full of determination and passion, and that's been missing for some time. I like the attitude he has towards discipline and again I strongly believe that's required to turn things around. However, I also know that it takes time to turns things around as much as we need.

 

You're right that he had an average cv, but already he has brought in some quality players. I have seen Alves and Pena play a few times and I rate both very highly. Given that he's brought players in of that quality, I have confidence in his ability to pick far better players than Warburton did.

 

I was optimistic after the first half of the home leg against Progres. Some of the play was excellent. That's the type of football I'd love to watch this season, albeit I'd want us to score more goals with so many chances. For various reasons (I've posted previously) the team then didn't perform in the next three halves we played against them, although I could see what the team was trying to do. I'm excited to see if he can build a consistent level of performance. If he can, we will have a brilliant season (notwithstanding the fact we're now out of Europe).

 

PC has also created a defensive system that can work and that's something we sadly missed last season. I always felt we were going to lose goals last season. I don't get that feeling now. The one tactical thing I'm not happy with however is his use of Miller in a wide position (or in the advanced midfield role). Miller does not have the ability, touch, or discipline to play there to maintain width, and although I can appreciate that PC rates Miller's workrate, I really hope this is temporary until we can get Pena, Dalcio or Candeias fully functioning.

 

Finally, what I also like is his willingness to give the younger players their chance. Even if it means losing more games, I'd rather we continue to do that for the longer term good of the club.

 

PC may turn out to be unable to help in our next stage of development from obscurity to champions. If he is unsuccessful, I'd like to reach that conclusion after giving him sufficient time and support to give it a real go. I'm willing to give him that. I'd hope we all agree on that. Perhaps the one thing we disagree on is what constitutes a reasonable length of time. For me, he's only just got his team almost together, albeit the two key players haven't played yet. Surely he deserves the chance to be judged after he has his first team settled. The part that's frustrated me is that many people have called for his head before he arrived. Many others have reacted hysterically after going out of Europe. Although I understand the disappointment (I feel it too), I think it's fair to acknowledge the circumstances and lack of preparation time, and the fact he's not been able to play his first eleven yet.

 

We all want what's best for the club. I think what's best for the club is for us to unite behind the manager and do what we are here to do - support the club. If things don't work out, we have a board and a DoF that is there to make those decisions. The more support we have for the manager and players, the more likely they are to succeed. I don't think it helps to have any more unnecessary pressure on them as they find their feet. Hopefully that explains my optimism and support for the manager and team.

[Frankie 8,146]

I think that's a very fair post.

 

The quicker we get playing again the better so we can move the debate on.

[Tannochsidebear 2,306]

What I see is a man who is full of determination and passion, and that's been missing for some time. I like the attitude he has towards discipline and again I strongly believe that's required to turn things around. However, I also know that it takes time to turns things around as much as we need.

 

You're right that he had an average cv, but already he has brought in some quality players. I have seen Alves and Pena play a few times and I rate both very highly. Given that he's brought players in of that quality, I have confidence in his ability to pick far better players than Warburton did.

 

I was optimistic after the first half of the home leg against Progres. Some of the play was excellent. That's the type of football I'd love to watch this season, albeit I'd want us to score more goals with so many chances. For various reasons (I've posted previously) the team then didn't perform in the next three halves we played against them, although I could see what the team was trying to do. I'm excited to see if he can build a consistent level of performance. If he can, we will have a brilliant season (notwithstanding the fact we're now out of Europe).

 

PC has also created a defensive system that can work and that's something we sadly missed last season. I always felt we were going to lose goals last season. I don't get that feeling now. The one tactical thing I'm not happy with however is his use of Miller in a wide position (or in the advanced midfield role). Miller does not have the ability, touch, or discipline to play there to maintain width, and although I can appreciate that PC rates Miller's workrate, I really hope this is temporary until we can get Pena, Dalcio or Candeias fully functioning.

 

Finally, what I also like is his willingness to give the younger players their chance. Even if it means losing more games, I'd rather we continue to do that for the longer term good of the club.

 

PC may turn out to be unable to help in our next stage of development from obscurity to champions. If he is unsuccessful, I'd like to reach that conclusion after giving him sufficient time and support to give it a real go. I'm willing to give him that. I'd hope we all agree on that. Perhaps the one thing we disagree on is what constitutes a reasonable length of time. For me, he's only just got his team almost together, albeit the two key players haven't played yet. Surely he deserves the chance to be judged after he has his first team settled. The part that's frustrated me is that many people have called for his head before he arrived. Many others have reacted hysterically after going out of Europe. Although I understand the disappointment (I feel it too), I think it's fair to acknowledge the circumstances and lack of preparation time, and the fact he's not been able to play his first eleven yet.

 

We all want what's best for the club. I think what's best for the club is for us to unite behind the manager and do what we are here to do - support the club. If things don't work out, we have a board and a DoF that is there to make those decisions. The more support we have for the manager and players, the more likely they are to succeed. I don't think it helps to have any more unnecessary pressure on them as they find their feet. Hopefully that explains my optimism and support for the manager and team.

 

If I can just pick out a couple of points from your above post, one i agree with and the other I dont. The use of Miller (including man-marking Brown in the 5-1 humiliation) has been staggeringly poor. He is either a central striker (best coming off the bench for the last 20 mins or so) or he doesnt play. Like Jig before him, it seems we are determined to find a place in the team for him cos he's a nice guy, irrespective of his playing ability restrictions. That had me really worried about Pedro when I saw how he was using this player.

 

I am not sure he is going to be the guy to give youth a chance. Barjonas, Beerman & Aiden Wilson have been jettisoned back to the youths when they should be pushing on this year in the first team squad given their assured performances at the tail end of last season. It seems Pedro just used them to prove a point to the players he was wanting rid of that he was going to play kids in front of them, but now that he is bringing his own experienced players in, three of our brightest youth players are not even training with the first team squad now. Of course this may change as he gets rid of the unwanted squad excess, and hopefully it does, but the early signs are not good for our youth development into the first team action.

[union 0]

back in the day Rangers managers had no hesitation in giving youth its chance.as our forward line against Real proves only to well.

Pedro is the problem not the cure,as are those who selected him.

[der Berliner 3,234]

back in the day Rangers managers had no hesitation in giving youth its chance.as our forward line against Real proves only to well.

Pedro is the problem not the cure,as are those who selected him.

 

Based on what? Three months with MW's leftovers running on empty from x-mas onwards? He blooded Bates, Beerman, and Barjonas, all of whom did admirably. Who is to say this won't continue?

Edited July 12, 2017 by der Berliner