Annual results / AGM 27th November

[Bill 13,717]

15 hours ago, pete said:

Surely a football club cannot produce a detailed future plan as results are on a weekly basis and cannot be seen years in advance. We will be 3rd in 2019 2nd in 2020 and champions in 2021is something that is hoped rather than predicted.

That's just nonsense. A business plan isn't a prediction. It's a basis for forming targets and assessing performance against those targets, which may be specific targets or just general in nature. You don't get a leg amputated if you fail to meet targets but you are expected to be able to explain why ... and similarly when exceeding targets. Those targets might not be anything to do with achievements on the park, probably better if they're not, but they could be business aims and objectives that crystallise our direction and pace of development as a sports business.

 

Why would that be so difficult? In fact if it's not already in place I'd be both surprised and disappointed. My suggestion was that this could be shared with the support in an overview form - big picture stuff. The detail might well be necessarily confidential but the overall direction and aims should not.

[pete 2,494]

22 minutes ago, Bill said:

That's just nonsense. A business plan isn't a prediction. It's a basis for forming targets and assessing performance against those targets, which may be specific targets or just general in nature. You don't get a leg amputated if you fail to meet targets but you are expected to be able to explain why ... and similarly when exceeding targets. Those targets might not be anything to do with achievements on the park, probably better if they're not, but they could be business aims and objectives that crystallise our direction and pace of development as a sports business.

 

Why would that be so difficult? In fact if it's not already in place I'd be both surprised and disappointed. My suggestion was that this could be shared with the support in an overview form - big picture stuff. The detail might well be necessarily confidential but the overall direction and aims should not.

No what is nonsense is that you can split up the business side of things and the  football side of things. Football is the business. The football side of things will always affect the business plan. Yes you can plan for the future but in football it has far more chance of not coming to fruition than a business.

[Bill 13,717]

2 hours ago, pete said:

No what is nonsense is that you can split up the business side of things and the  football side of things. Football is the business. The football side of things will always affect the business plan. Yes you can plan for the future but in football it has far more chance of not coming to fruition than a business.

You’ll know best. 

[pete 2,494]

49 minutes ago, Bill said:

You’ll know best. 

Thanks.

[DMAA 3,598]

It should just be a matter of guidance. For example the club should really have a good idea of how much sponsorship and merchandising revenue will rise in the coming year, with the understanding that there are variables. 

[Bill 13,717]

1 hour ago, DMAA said:

It should just be a matter of guidance. For example the club should really have a good idea of how much sponsorship and merchandising revenue will rise in the coming year, with the understanding that there are variables. 

I think there is a misunderstanding here. I'm talking about an outline business plan, not a financial budget. The former is what business leaders use to guide and maintain direction, the latter is what accountants use. For example, what is the board's intentions with respect to debt, equity, differentiated income streams, reliance on domestic/European income sources, merchandising strategy, international profile, partnerships, etc. It's not difficult unless you think accountancy is the same as finance. If you don't have any insight into this then what's the point of ever turning up to an AGM again?

[pete 2,494]

18 minutes ago, Bill said:

I think there is a misunderstanding here. I'm talking about an outline business plan, not a financial budget. The former is what business leaders use to guide and maintain direction, the latter is what accountants use. For example, what is the board's intentions with respect to debt, equity, differentiated income streams, reliance on domestic/European income sources, merchandising strategy, international profile, partnerships, etc. It's not difficult unless you think accountancy is the same as finance. If you don't have any insight into this then what's the point of ever turning up to an AGM again?

Bill I am not trying to be funny trying to understand really and I know all these things come into account and sometimes businesses even have a ten year projection. I am sure Rangers had that 2 years ago but then comes a Caixinha and spends millions and is kicked out. Then you have to re-adjust your projection or accept that the football side will go backwards which may lead to lower crowds, no European football and less merchandise being sold . Surely the football dictates the business projection.

[Bill 13,717]

18 minutes ago, pete said:

Bill I am not trying to be funny trying to understand really and I know all these things come into account and sometimes businesses even have a ten year projection. I am sure Rangers had that 2 years ago but then comes a Caixinha and spends millions and is kicked out. Then you have to re-adjust your projection or accept that the football side will go backwards which may lead to lower crowds, no European football and less merchandise being sold . Surely the football dictates the business projection.

I wasn't laughing. There isn't a half-decent business plan that isn't constantly stress-tested and reviewed. In fact, if you're not doing this then you shouldn't be running a business. No one, least of all me, has said the football side doesn't impact on the commercial side of the business ... or equally that the financial side doesn't impact on the football side (as we've seen only too clearly these last 18 years or so).

 

However, a more sensible perspective is to accept the Club is a multi-faceted business where many things affect many other things. There are a lot more than two sides to Rangers and a lot more than the two simple categories of ambition you are focussing on. All of these need to be constantly and frequently monitored, measured and assessed against the plan and none of them will be free of shocks and surprises. But if you don't have a plan (and I'm sure Rangers does have a plan) then how on Earth does anyone decide whether we're performing to expectations, exceeding targets or falling on our arses. Simply saying we might not win every trophy or have every signing turn into a world beater is no reason to run a business in a chaotic, shoot-from-the-hip manner.

 

If Club1872 professes to represent supporter interests and claims to serve as a check on future mismanagement then it first needs to know where the board is trying to take the club. The board isn't going to publish the financial budget but it could and should issue a high level strategic business plan in the full knowledge that football, like every other industry, is an uncertain business. In fact, that very uncertainty that you say makes business planning worthless is all the more reason why you should absolutely have a strategic plan.

Edited November 7, 2018 by Bill

[the gunslinger 3,366]

Dont think ive ever seen a football club issue a financial plan. 

 

Do any companies?

[pete 2,494]

1 hour ago, Bill said:

I wasn't laughing. There isn't a half-decent business plan that isn't constantly stress-tested and reviewed. In fact, if you're not doing this then you shouldn't be running a business. No one, least of all me, has said the football side doesn't impact on the commercial side of the business ... or equally that the financial side doesn't impact on the football side (as we've seen only too clearly these last 18 years or so).

 

However, a more sensible perspective is to accept the Club is a multi-faceted business where many things affect many other things. There are a lot more than two sides to Rangers and a lot more than the two simple categories of ambition you are focussing on. All of these need to be constantly and frequently monitored, measured and assessed against the plan and none of them will be free of shocks and surprises. But if you don't have a plan (and I'm sure Rangers does have a plan) then how on Earth does anyone decide whether we're performing to expectations, exceeding targets or falling on our arses. Simply saying we might not win every trophy or have every signing turn into a world beater is no reason to run a business in a chaotic, shoot-from-the-hip manner.

 

If Club1872 professes to represent supporter interests and claims to serve as a check on future mismanagement then it first needs to know where the board is trying to take the club. The board isn't going to publish the financial budget but it could and should issue a high level strategic business plan in the full knowledge that football, like every other industry, is an uncertain business. In fact, that very uncertainty that you say makes business planning worthless is all the more reason why you should absolutely have a strategic plan.

I believe totally that we have a financial plan and that was not my argument. I didn't mean to bring that over. The point I was trying to make is that football is such an unpredictable business that more often than not financial projections will go out the window and need to be re-adjusted. In ordinary business you can look at what you made this year and what new orders are in the pipeline what your production limitations are, new investment in a machine park etc and make a prediction. In football one injured player can turn your season around. if you have ever watched the Lions Den then the people are asked for a 3 year projection. Most are fantasy and dreams.