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Russia, Ukraine


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Deary me, there's no hiding some colours.

 

Russia invades a neighbouring country and embarks upon an unrestrained military campaign, repeatedly committing war crimes and the destruction of civilian infrastructure. I repeat for the hard of understanding, Russia invaded Ukraine. 

 

Russia has made it a national trait to whine about being threatened and the need to remove enemies from its borders, when in reality no one since Napoleon and Hitler has ever threatened, let alone challenged, a Russian border. Russia is like the disaffected angry teenager ... "everyone is against me".

 

And yet we are subjected daily to this perverse denial of reality by the Kremlin's many apologists, variously cranking on about nazis and neo-fascists, expansionist NATO aggression, and carefully selected conversations from 30 years ago that are somehow supposed to represent conclusive proof of US double dealing. You'd almost think Ukraine was a convenient excuse rather than a justifiable reason. Some colours are never far below the surface.

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11 minutes ago, buster. said:

Have you heard of 'The Project for the new Russian Century' where they set out how they want to dominate the world ?

The think tank that was dissolved 16 years ago?

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18 minutes ago, Bill said:

And yet we are subjected daily to this perverse denial of reality by the Kremlin's many apologists, variously cranking on about nazis and neo-fascists, expansionist NATO aggression, and carefully selected conversations from 30 years ago that are somehow supposed to represent conclusive proof of US double dealing. You'd almost think Ukraine was a convenient excuse rather than a justifiable reason. Some colours are never far below the surface.

Are you the same guy that has been sobbing about snide remarks for ages?

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16 minutes ago, ranger_syntax said:

Are you the same guy that has been sobbing about snide remarks for ages?

I see you've been trying on the cap. Always a good first step but try not to get too emotional about these conversations. This is just a footy website, not the Supreme Soviet.

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11 minutes ago, Gonzo79 said:

I'm unsure why anyone would choose to side with either USA or Russia. 

 

Bit like hiding behind a playground bully.

Quite right, siding with one or the other would simply be indulging in tribalism and we have our fill of that here at home. But neither is it sensible to treat them as nations of equal consequence for us in the UK and, at the end of the day, it's consequences that matter.

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1 hour ago, ranger_syntax said:

Your suggestion is not relevant as Bill Clinton was urging expansion into former Warsaw Pact countries in 1996. Putin was not in a position of supremacy at that time.

What does this mean?

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26 minutes ago, Bill said:

I see you've been trying on the cap. Always a good first step but try not to get too emotional about these conversations. This is just a footy website, not the Supreme Soviet.

Not even sure what this means.

 

If you really want to discuss something unrelated to the topic you should be clear.

 

No point in derailing things any more than necessary.

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1 minute ago, Scott7 said:

What does this mean?

Putin didn't even start working in Moscow until the second half of 1996.

 

He didn't rise to the top for another few years after that.

 

Clinton didn't make his decision because of Putin.

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1 hour ago, ranger_syntax said:

As mentioned above a country can break any kind of agreement that it likes. It only has to live with the judgement that follows.

 

Your suggestion is not relevant as Bill Clinton was urging expansion into former Warsaw Pact countries in 1996. Putin was not in a position of supremacy at that time.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/1996/10/23/us/clinton-urges-nato-expansion-in-1999.html

NATO cannot expand, and has not expanded, against the will of new member states, unlike, say, VVP's expansion into Ukraine, an independent country which is a member of neither NATO, or the EU. 

 

 

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