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As a guy at the wrong end of my forties I'm aware that criticising the behaviour of younger guys at the football is in danger of making me sound like a letter writer to the Daily Mail. Truth is I'm not sure I fully 'get' Ultra culture. I 'get' singing at the matches, all match long if possible, I think all of us go through that phase in our teens. When I was younger if you wanted a sing-song you went to the East Enclosure or the Copland Road, and if you didn't you went to the Govan or the Main Stand, it was easier to choose 'what kind' of supporter you wanted to be back then. Back then, the 80s, there was violence at matches, some of it organised and some of it spontaneous, and for some guys that was as important a part of the match experience for them as buying a programme or having a pint after the game is to others. I was at school with guys who were 'ICF' and a few who were Thistle casuals too. You know those guys went to every match, home and away, and from time to time I bump into them again and some still do, but they don't meet in train stations and get into fights anymore. They grew up, they got married, they had kids, they used up all the extra testosterone that flowed through us when we were 17. Thing is other supporters would get angry with them. Often with justification. They looked for trouble and sometimes people minding their own business got caught up in it, they got us a bad press, the club helped the police try and single the ring leaders out. So are these guys the current day equivalent? Young guys with too much time, energy and testosterone? Before the casuals in the 80s there were gangs of skinheads, before that guys with Union Jacks draped over their backs, long hair and flairs, I'm sure their were Mods or Rockers or whatever before that. Bloody hell, The Billy boys were a razor gang who sang at the football to let everyone know they'd crossed the city from Bridgeton to Govan. So I don't want to get too pious when I criticise these 'Ultras'. The flyer was stupid, the banner is asking for trouble and the balaclavas invite people to misconstrue who they are and what they're about. Young men do stupid things when they are young. I suspect a number of these guys might be a bit embarrassed in 15 years time when they look back at this. In the end the club can't be seen to condone the flyer or the banner. I don't condone it, it's a stupid use of language and a disturbing use of imagery. But it's not aimed at me, I'm old, and responsible and have zero interest in trouble or, frankly, even singing these days. I think these guys are fans, real fans, I think they are misguided in some of what they do and deserve criticised for it, but I think we also need to be careful we don't give this more significance than it deserves. It's the 'young team' at the football, same as it always was, indeed considerably smaller than it was in my day.

I've watched a couple of videos from the march, and have to say I find it completely embarrassing. Do folk honestly think that this is acceptable behaviour??? If this happened on any other day (outwith a football context), folk would (rightly) be up in arms, and it would have been shut down by the police. But since it's football/Rangers related, it is suddenly ok (in many folks eyes) for a LARGE group, many masked or hiding their faces, letting off smoke bombs and flares, presenting a banner which could incite hatred/riot, to march down the street, singing banned songs. How does this kind of behaviour show support for the football team??? All it does is supports & encourages the darker elements associated with the club ie. sectarianism - something that the Club itself has been working to eradicate. IMHO, the Club should be doing everything it can to distance itself from these actions.

I was too annoyed to post yesterday, in some ways that defeat hurt more than the real doings we got last season. Having slept on it I'm a bit more rational about it now. For me experience won the day. They'd lots of it and we only had it in patches. Three Glasgow derby debutants, a very inexperienced central midfield, and a defence that showed a lot of uncertainty when put under pressure. A more experienced side would have taken control when we went 2-1 up. A more experienced side would have disrupted play with little fouls, slowed it down and kept possession, instead we allowed them to step up and dictate the match. Might it have been different if Jack, Dorrans, Russell and Wallace had been fit, maybe. Certainly I felt we were naive at times, particularly when they ran at us. Their first and third goals were poor to lose. They were well taken but neither player should have been given that time and space in the first place. They gifted us the first and deservedly went down to 10 men, we should have been good enough to take something from the match. The real test of Murty and this side now is how they react to this. They must be gutted, they'll know what a great chance they just passed up. If they can lift themselves for the next couple of games, and put this behind them quickly then they've got a chance to become the team they need to be, if this starts a slump then I'm afraid changes are needed. I hope Murty can regroup and lift them because we're not that far behind.

You can certainly criticise the media for its focus on certain events over others, but the reaction from Rangers fans (including me) to this is perfectly sensible. Firstly, what other groups from other teams is less of a concern to me because they're not associated with my club. I don't like my club being negatively affected at all, and when it's done by our own fans it's so much more disappointing. Just because others do it worse than use doesn't mean it's ok. That's a ridiculous argument. Not a single Rangers fan thinks that the flyer is worse than someone being attacked. The difference is that we (as Rangers fans) could have prevented the former. It was a stupid own goal we scored and totally unnecessary. If that March was simply about singing songs in favour of the team, why that logo, or covering if their faces? It was sinister and stupid. However, I've already said the attacks on our players, staff and supporters is worse. There's no doubt about that, but it still won't stop me voicing my opinion about our own behaviour. It'll be a sad day when I start measuring our behaviour in relative terms to 'theirs'. I think we're much better than that, don't you?

On the contrary, if I had been told before yesterday's game that we could win only once against Celtic this season, I would have gone for a win in the Scottish cup. It's by far our best chance of a trophy this season

The March should never have been organised in the manner in which it was with the wording and imagery contained within it. As a Rangers supporter, I do not wish to be associated with that sort of thing.

While I agree with you, the next game v Killie is the most important one! this will be extremely tough and a must win game, the game against them in the semi will take care of itself.

I seriously believe you're so far out of touch with reality and standards acceptable public behaviour you're part of the problem. Are you so far out of touch with reality you don't grasp that a section of our 'support' and I use that term loosely deliberately hiding faces while 'marching' through public streets aggresively chanting in para military style 'uniform' is unacceptable.? It paints the club in a very bad light indeed while you totally ignore that and further try to excuse it by rambling on with a dose of entirely unconnected whataboutery regarding an MP? I don't give a flying fuck about the MP he doesn't represent Rangers and that's what we're talking about here.

...and will do more "damage" to them by preventing back-to-back trebles.

Bitter disappointment is the overriding feeling this morning, along with a real sense that we let our opposition off the hook again. https://fourladshadadream.wordpress.com/2018/03/12/monday-morning-regrets-and-a-touch-of-reality/

A few thoughts on this one. Firstly it's the first time in a while that I've had any level of optimism going into a game with them and that's a sign of progress that we've made. We're still behind them, can't match their financial clout and there is a gulf in class and quality. The mangerial situation between the two clubs is evidnece of this. We have Murty, doing a great job and I'm a fan of his, who has no previous mangaerial experience, and with the exception of a few international caps his main playing experience was with York City (my home team!), by contrast Celtic have a manger with Premier League credentials. There is a vast difference still between the two clubs, but it's narrowing and the players have the confidence to go for it. Had it not been for a cruel miss at the end, we'd have taken a draw from this one. It also occurs to me that, although we did put 2 goals past them, it was against their 3rd choice keeper, given the nature of the goals I don't think it would have mattered much who was in goal, but the organisation of the defence under Gordon or De Vries. Overall, it was a big statement of how far we've come, but was a bridge to far just now. It does suggest, however, that a realistic title challenge next year is the expectation. That's possibly a year or two ahead of where I thought we might be. They'll get number 7 this year, but we should be in a strong fight to prevent number 8 or number 9...

Hasn't been given any realistic game time but good luck to him if and when he goes.

If we had Martin and either Bates or McCrorie at the back I feel it would have been a different result. I don’t think anyone was happy with Cardozo on the pitch. We played fantastic for the first 25 mins. The goal aside they sat back for the last half hour.

We just need defenders who can do their job of defending a lead to give away the upper hand twice was disappointing but we have greatly improved since the last two managers give young Murty the chance and it will be fine again ,don't panic .

We are so close to beating them, so why now look for wholesale changes? That doesn't make sense to me. Murty could and should have made changes yesterday when we went a man up,, but let's be clear about this, that team should have beat them yesterday, even without any subs. We played really well in spells and only allowed Celtic to play when we stopped doing what we've been doing so well. We don't need to change much at all, and certainly not the formation/tactics. One strong signing for centreback and a number 10 is all we need to beat them, and I'd suggest we can do it comfortably if we keep progressing the way we have been. Lets not talk about throwing the baby out with the bath water now. We are so close to the tipping point.

My overriding feeling is one of deep regret too, they were there for the taking and we blew it. Being honest they took their chances really well , but we let them get comfortable even with being down to ten men. It was a great game, usual derby fair, but small mistakes can kill you , Several things stood out for me, we let them dominate the ball for long spells, that seems to spell a disaster in the making for us, we missed some sitters, never good thing at this level. Murty dithered when Rodgers was decisive. The game changed when they went down to ten men, we done nothing to capitalise on that game changer, when Murty made the change to bolster his striker options it looked too little too late. I could hear myself shouting in my sleep last night ''Get Cummings on ffs'' Experience with tactical awareness at vital times and some composure in front of goal would have won us that game. Experience will come with time, composure will come with experience, tactical awareness will have to be learned, but do have we the luxury and patience to allow this time?

I know what they’re protesting about, I just think they should do it off the pitch and show some respect for the game and their opponents.

Morelos is 21, currently top scorer in the league with huge potential to improve as with any young player, yet Rangers fans want him out!!, pathetic!

OMG, between people fighting in the streets of the Gallowgate and people marching on the streets of Kinning Park all on the same day - what is a person to think about Glasgow? Almost unprecedented ...

Yes, it's painting the club in a bad light which while you don't care about that most others do. In addition given this is a relatively high profile forum both press and curious public will look here for opinion on these clowns. That opinion has to be and is predominately negative. But you go ahead with your support of para military style spectacles. It gives others the opportunity to mark them and you out as not representative of the club or the vast majority of it's support.

Alves had a wee dig at Brown. I think there was another incident too, but I can't recall who? More of that please!

away yi go....bunch of tossers dressing up like IRA tims.....fuckin brain dead

If they had broken the law or crossed Social boundaries they would have been arrested. They didn’t and they weren’t. People can walk or march covering their face if the wish, a certain ethnic group force their woman to do it. I don’t profess to enjoy that sort of thing but they identify with it. I will defend their right to behave in any way they wish with the boundaries of legality. No harm was done so they have nothing to answer. If that changes then my reaction changes. Personally I find it distasteful but that’s just an opinion.

Whilst I agree with your sentiment, I find it absolutely staggering that there has been this reaction to it, and a lot coming from Rangers fans. Why is there such a massive uproar about it? The Groin Brigade do it all the time. There was a pub of Rangers fans with women and children physically attacked and it’s hardly been mentioned by the newspapers or MPs. There were Rangers fans attacked after the match whilst they were walking home. Yet the outcry is about fans with a logo of someone being kicked. So what is worse? A logo depicting violence or actual violence on women and children? By the mass response, it seems that the answer is the logo, but that is just because it depicts a Celtic fan as the victim. Again, think the march was stupid, but the hypocrisy of the outcry as if this is the first time in history that this has happened is ridiculous when you compare it to the actual violence that the Rangers fans have been subject to. It really does show you the awful political landscape that we reside in where actual violence against us is not newsworthy.

For me the match mirrored what we used to do to them in the 90's and 00's. Sides evenly matched apart from one or two class players the likes of Laudrup, Gascoigne, DeBoer, Goram etc supplying that one moment of magic that would win matches.

These guys don’t give a toss about the club. Ffs they don’t even watch the games at Ibrox.

probably...and unfortunately it will be based on fact - there's pictures & video to back him up. Compare this march to the one several years ago to Hampden - how many folk then had their faces covered??? How many smoke bombs or flares were set off??? What there any imagery to "promote" violent behaviour??? No there wasn't, it atmosphere was peaceful, relaxed and family friendly. How would you react or think if you saw a march like this coming towards you on the street???

What if someone in a Celtic top crossed paths with this group? A thuggish "ultras" group like this creates the toxic atmosphere where unprovoked violent attacks can easily occur and have often in the past.

This is what annoys me so much now. I am fine with spending resources on clamping down on abusive or sectarian language. I've always thought this was too tough to deal with sensibly and in a balanced fashion, but I at least understood the sentiment behind it. What I am astonished at however is that this has become worse than other 'crimes'. When the 'flyer' was originally posted on line, almost everyone in authority jumped on the language used. Almost no one focussed on the logo showing fans kicking their fans, which would potentially be inciting violence (not saying that was its intention, but merely pointing out it could have been). We then have fans running onto the pitch at the cup final, assaulting players and officials and then the focus being on the songs being sung. And now we have police unwilling to invest much time and effort on a potentially lethal assault with smoke bombs. What the hell is wrong with our country these days?!?

Im glad he hasn't been playing Cardoso. We would not have been as likel to build the momentum had he played ahead of Martin and Bates. Our two most reliable defenders were unable to play this match (well, not for long anyway) so we can't give Murty pelters for that, surely.

Oh well. the White Elephant it is. Better get a decent team on the park, then......

You could get a firecracker past a basic body search, easily. Searching 7,000 people would take ages and largely be pointless.

What a strange tactic that would be dropping our top scorer ,would give the opposition a great moral boost thinking were coming for a draw .

We can beat them in April.

It’s frustrating. He causes so many problems for defences and puts himself about so much, more than Cummings but he does so many things that cost us. Straying offside while looking along the line for a pass that would put him 1 on 1 with the keeper (Celtic go up the park and score). Missing a 1 on 1 with the keeper (Celtic go up the park and score), and missing a open goal from 3/4 yards. These three pieces of play cost us the match. I have no doubt in my mind that Cummings would have stayed onside for the first and scored the second and third chances but he doesn’t give you the same physicality and hold up play. I do think he should be dropped after today and give Cummings a few games up top to see what he gives.

I believe that Bates would have prevented the 2nd too. But also felt he had some responsibility for the first as think he should have closed Rogic down a bit quicker given Rogic had no passing options and was always likely to have to shoot. havent seen second half as wee man had a training session with KT but first half we competed well. Needed to get to half time at 2-1. Didn’t think Fod needed to come off his line for the 2nd. Dembele was under pressure for Cardoso and Fod made his mind up for him.

what a load of fuckin' muppets... arseholes pure riddie

Sinister snd unacceptable.

What a pity today. I thought Morelos caused them so many problems and if he'd scored it would have topped off an excellent performance from him. Strange how fine the margins are in this game.

There is no need to be unkind to them but I do wish all MSPs would quit social media.

Yes, Bates may have been turned for their 3rd, but no way he gets out-muscled or out-run for their 2nd. Stupid aimless ball over the top!

The turning point for me was bates' injury. We needed a settled defence today, and Cardoso just didn't fit in.

No it wasn't. It was infuriating.

Second place was always the target this season. I'm much more confident of achieving that now than I was a few months ago.

The league gap isn't because of today. It's because of a poor first half to the season dropping points that should never have been dropped. I don't see that happening next season.