BrahimHemdani

The above is absolute nonsense Brahim, nonsense.

 

Let me make it abundantly clear to you - and perhaps you will try to remove your personal bias before responding.

 

1. You said that it could affect as many as 10,000 travelling fans

2. This is the important part so please pay close attention.... I said that there was no way it would affect 10,000 fans BECAUSE at the point in time you made the suggestion there was virtually NO WAY that many fans would have booked their travel. I STAND BY THAT STATEMENT. But the important thing for you to try to pay close attention to is this... AT NO POINT DID I SAY THERE WOULDNT BE 10,000 TRAVELLING BEARS. The "scorn" that I poured on your statement was whether 10,000 fans had made travel plans at that point in time.

3. Your post at #231 is the pertinent post. It is in that post that you make the wildly inaccurate, may, lie, that I suggested that I suggested we wouldn't have 10,000 travelling fans.

 

Check the relevant posts from me and PROVE to me I said that we wouldn't have 10,000 travelling fans. And when you actually FAIL to do so, I will still be here awaiting my apology.

 

You either unwittingly or deliberately twisted words that I never said. Indeed, in the above post you are even attempting to turn the tables on me by suggesting you hadn't suggested 10,000 would have booked travel plans. The issue, at that point in time, only affected those who had ALREADY booked their travel plans.

 

Further, your post at #231 quoted a post that mentioned the number of travelling fans and you replied to that quote that I poured scorn on their being 10,000 travelling fans. I'm tired saying it but show me where I said we wouldn't have 10,000 travelling fans.... that is the crux of this and you KNOW you are wrong.

 

I never jumped to any wrong conclusion. So, again, I invite you to PROVE that. You can't, its that simple.

 

I was miffed that the CEO replied to you ? Get a grip of yourself. I couldn't care less if the CEO replied to you. I do, however, care that you thought your trivial travel concern (in the eyes of the club, not you personally) was an issue for the CEO to deal with. It wasn't. And the fact you can't see that is evidence of just how inflated your ego is. If that is a CEO issue then we really do have problems.

Firstly, I have no idea what bias it is you detect or imagine? As you know rather well, certainly I have none towards you; quite the contrary in fact.

On re-reading your post, I am happy to acknowledge that you did not say that there would not be 10,000 travelling fans for this match. So I apologise for post #231.

Equally, I hope you will now acknowledge, that I did not say, imply or suggest that at the time I made my own reservations, 10,000 fans had also made travel arrangements. That would have been a ludicrous suggestion. I would ask you to credit me with enough experience of Rangers European trips and those who travel, to know that. Anecdotally a fair number did go ahead like me; but I suspect that they would have numbered in the hundreds rather than the thousands. Again what I said was "any changes ..... may affect as many as 10,000 fans." It is you who has inserted the word "travelling" though I agree that in this context fans = travelling fans; it does not = fans who had already made travel arrangements. Note particularly I said MAY AFFECT, not HAVE ALREADY AFFECTED.

My point, and I hope you can see it now, was that the timing of the second leg would affect "as many as 10,000 fans". Therefore it was my submission that it was properly a matter for the CEO, because of the likely number of fans involved, particularly as he was at the draw and therefore in a position to discuss the arrangements with the Progres officials. Not because I thought that 10,000 fans had already booked; but because I thought something of that order of numbers would be likely to book.

You disagree with that, fair enough. Clearly Mr Robertson did not.

It's a great choice to have available.

I think you need to recant the above statement BH because you are completely "at it".

 

At no point in time did I "pour scorn" on your suggestion that 10,000 Bears would make the travel. That is, quite frankly, a complete and utter lie on your part. What I DID say is that there was absolutely no chance that 10,000 people had booked their travel arrangements in advance of getting official confirmation of the date and time of the game. And I stand by that statement.

 

Might be worth your time just desisting with lies, which your above statement is. Or at least reviewing what was ACTUALLY said before casting aspersions.

Craig, I think before you resort to calling me a liar, you look at what I actually said at #165 and reaffirmed at #171

"I'm in doubt that it's an issue for the CEO because (a) he was at the draw and will be involved in agreeing any changes and (b) it may affect as many as 10,000 fans."

At NO TIME did I imply or suggest that 10,000 fans had booked travel as soon as the draw was made. All I said was that the arrangements for the second leg might affect as many as 10,000 fans. And, I STAND BY THAT STATEMENT.

You jumped to a wrong conclusion because you were of the opinion that I was "silly" etc etc to write to the CEO and you were miffed to find that he replied at all never mind that he replied within just over an hour and a half.

I expect better than such false accusations from you.

Perhaps YOU now wish to recant.

They get O'Halloran back in return for the gate receipts.

I can help a little in your search for information.

 

It isn't me!

I know that, Craig has the offshore deal well in hand.

Hong Kong?

You might think so but I couldn't possibly confirm.

The shares could be gifted as part of another deal and is nothing to do with C1872. They are just the recipriants of the gift as a sweetener

That would break all sorts of rules, surely?

I had always understood that any cash raised would be invested in the club. That was the case when Gersnet invested in both RST and RF and was the case under Gersave.

 

C1872 made a big thing recently of all major decisions being made by its members and the members should decide directly whether the existing cash should go to Rangers or some fatcat shareholder.

 

That's not mentioning the massive conflict of interest that seems to be a concept that's not understood by certain board members.

Conflict of interest does not apply to lawyers and others designated by them, they have an exemption.

I would be happy if the 47.5%/47.5% rule (if it is a rule) was suspended so that a large tranche of shares could be purchased which to my mind is far more important in terms of the original objective than any other investment in the Club e.g. the currently proposed training camp places, laudable as that may be.

Whilst I agree with BD's sentiments, surely all the shares purchased by C1872 thus far have been from existing shareholders?

On a sidenote there are some supporters buses running to this game, and I have just heard that my own RSC, Nithsdale, are running a bus and that it is already over-subscribed.

 

I think we are going to be amazed at the numbers going to this game in Lux!

I agree, a certain admin poured scorn on my suggestion of 10,000 but I think we will fill the stadium which holds c.9,000 I believe.

It may be cheaper to travel independently but you often need a lot of free time to be able to do so. Many of my friends end up going on 3 planes and a Euro trip requiring 3 days to save £100. I am quite sure they spend more than £100 on the extra days food and drink even before costing in days off work.

 

The big difference between the TC and SO is ticket guarantee. If you go with TC you get your ticket as no matter the number of tickets RFC receive, the first lot go to the official flight. If you book up with SO you go into the independent ticket ballot. Sometimes this works ok, and sometimes it doesnt.

 

I agree in the past the TC has been a bit like herding sheep with some daft rules etc, but I think that was more to do with poor management which wont be an issue now that there are different personnel in charge.

 

I know you are right BH in the pricing from SO. They generally just cut TC by £20-30 but they do run a good service as an option for those who didnt get a ticket through TC sometimes.

The TC has never been the same since Gillian Melrose left. She was a tigress. The lady who took over (name escapes me) ended in tears in Israel but did gradually become more confident. A lot of good staff have left but one or two experienced ones remain and I would be fairly confident that this is an easy restart for them.

Another advantage of going independently is that the travel itself can be interesting e.g the train to trip across the Alps from Vienna to Maribor and if you stay at least one night then you can do a bit of sightseeing.

That said I recall in Pisa mentioning to some of the guys that the Leaning Tower was just round the corner, you could literally see the top from where they were sitting. "Maybe later" came the reply, they never did see it.

 

It appears on the face of it that a director of C1872 has been negotiating with Ashley on the subject without the authority of the members.

I wonder who that might be?

There has been talk of various people wanting to invest but biding their time until the club has been stabilised.

 

I'd expect this news should given them more comfort in that regard and it will be interesting to see who puts their money where their mouth is.

I think you should be looking to the Far East.

Has anyone travelled with the TC often? Been once and it was a disgrace, have always travelled and bought tickets on our own. Have seen some terrible treatment of fans when going with the TC like at Auxerre ? Does anyone have good stories of travelling with the official club?

I travelled with the Club to Stuttgart (2003), Maritimo, Wronki, Nicosia for Famagusta, Bratislava, Porto, Valencia for Villarreal, Molde, Pisa for Livorno, Auxerre, Tel Aviv, Zeta in Montenegro and Belgrade; I went independently to Pamplona for Osasuna to and all the group stage games in 2007/08, and all the matches subsequently in 2008/09, 2009/10, 2010/11 and 2011/12. So I can base my comments on having travelled 13 times with the Club and 19 times independently to 21 different countries over 9 seasons.

I agree that generally the TC trips are well organised and so far as I can recall the buses have always been there to meet the aircraft arriving. The issue I recall in Auxerre was that the police moved the buses and I do remember one chap did not find them and had to make his own way to the airport. There have been issues with departure times of flights being delayed awaiting incoming aircraft and particularly with delayed return flights due to crew down times as they rely on the same crew who are entitled to the legal off duty hours. Obviously this can be a particular issue on day trips. I recall there being a long delay after the match in Molde. This is exacerbated because the aircraft cannot be refuelled until the crew are on board. In addition going with the Club means that you are subject to delays by local police inspecting buses etc and dictating where the buses and fans are dropped off e.g. Belgrade they put us in a park and didn't want to allow us into the city. IIRC we were held in the buses for around 1.5 hours after the game vs Amica Wronki. If you travel independently generally you will avoid such restrictions.

The other issue is price. The TC is usually the most expensive option (£395 for the day trip this time, albeit direct and inc transfers vs around £300 for scheduled flights) and there are some who feel that this is because if you do not have much of a history then the only way to guarantee a ticket is to go with the Club. Also the Club are making a profit and paying for staff on the trips and so are the travel agents. There have been several occasions when folk with 0 points have got tickets by going with the Club (as I did myself when I was just starting out) and those with much better histories going independently have not. How big an issue this is depends on the ticket allocation. I don't see it as an issue for LUX because of the move to the National Stadium but it will be an issue if we go to bigger clubs and are limited to the statutory 5%, which often means around 1,000 - 2,000 tickets. Bear in mind that Corporate and Sponsors as well as players and directors account for several hundred tickets. There are 2 or 3 supporters clubs who traditionally have also run buses and get an allocation. So quite often there are only a few hundred or less left for independent travellers.

Again in my experience the TC trips are generally well monitored in terms of fan behaviour on flights and buses; surprisingly this can be an issue on scheduled flights with a large number of fans on board.

I have no experience of Sport Options other than to say that they are usually a few quid cheaper than the Club (I have often felt that they wait to see the Club's price and then charge a bit less but that may be the cynic in me); this time £379 vs £395 but they do not supply tickets.

My experience has been that it is always cheaper to travel independently, albeit sometimes by circuitous routes e.g. 3 flights to Pamplona via London and Madrid and flights and bus/ferry to Istanbul for Bursa, flight and trains to Maribor. As a rule of thumb I have been able to do a one night trip for the same price as the Club charge for a day trip and a 2 night trip for the same price as they charge for a 1 night trip. This is for a single room. Those sharing will be more cost effective. I reckon you can do a 2 night trip to LUX sharing a room in a decent hotel for £425/£450 vs £395 for the Club's day trip and you should have no problem getting a ticket unless 10,000 bears turn up, which is not impossible given 8,500 in Leipzig.

My understanding is that more than 4,000 have signed up to the TC, which is an extraordinary number especially for this stage of the season and that around 200 (inc me ) have the maximum 6 points history from 2009/10 & 2010/11.

Rangers are only taking one plane so you can do the maths. I suspect they will take around 5,000 - 6,000 tickets if they can get them, so everyone who wants one should get one. It will be a completely different story in Cyprus and if we get to Q3 because we will be limited to the statutory 5% which usually works out as I said about 1,000 - 2,000 tickets.

The TC is closed for this match but may be re-opened for Cyprus or any other matches depending on demand and supply of tickets.

I hope this helps. Anyone who wants specific advice feel free to ask and I'll try to answer.

It makes sense if JB was a lead negotiator that Ashley might sell to Club 1872 but I think I am right in saying that they could only pay a "fair market price".

Ashley owns 7,265,000 at the current 32p that would be £2.324m which is about a million more than C1872 were last reported to have in the coffers. Also if C1872 buy them they would not have any money for a rights issue. However, if they could do a deal potentially they would become the largest shareholder. Even buying half would put them second; but the holding would then be diluted again in a rights issue. Despite that I would certainly want to buy any I could even at 32p or a little higher.

I have heard something about King's shareholding as well; but I can't substantiate it so I know I won't be allowed to post on here.

Yeah, they have a shed load of last years strips which will make the club plenty.

 

I'm looking forward to seeing fat 40+ blokes walking round supermarkets and pushing prams in Sauchiehall Street with immaculate Royal Blue Rangers shirts on emblazoned with those 5 stars, it'll be rather refreshing and a welcome development to seeing only fat 40+ filthy dumb ratbags wearing that horrible rag of green and grey.

There was a couple on my flight to Puerto Vallarta; wearing the his and hers versions, I saw them several more times around the town; probably never took them off.

Ref strips Puma would have been unable to produce new strip in time so agreed with Rangers to go with old strip with a view to releasing a new second/third team strip in coming months.

Yes but BD makes a good point about registering the said 2nd/3rd strips.

So how were they able to register a new second and third strip but not a first strip?

A very good question BD. Perhaps they will only use it in the SPFL who may have different rules or may allow it.

We could then obtain a trophy (I could probably purchase if the current $:£ exchange rates remain as I am getting more £ than I expected) and could make it an annual award - whereby Gersnet (BrahimHemdani) could arrange the Gersnet end of season meal/drinks and the winner could be invited along to receive their award and perhaps give a review of the season just past (or update on the current season if the meal is done before the end of the season).

I think this is an excellent idea. I was going to say I think we are the only forum who offer an annual dinner. I think experience has shown that end of season works best although we have had two poor end of season attendances, there were reasons on each occasion and by far the biggest attendance was in Jan 16 this was in large part due to the high quality guests. We could present the trophy/awards for Prediction League, though I'm not clear how we translate player ratings into an award, unless it's for the highest number of times you give top ratings to the eventual winner? A writer of the season as well perhaps? Best post of the season. Best looking poster (yes I see the double meaning). Worst post of the season? The possibilities are endless.

As one of the "old (baldy) heads" in more ways than one, I have noticed a considerable reduction in some of the more offensive posters/posts that used to occur some years ago. This is a tribute to admin/mods who generally do a great job even if on occasions I feel they could be just tad more proactive than reacative.

Whilst my own opinions are often far from mainstream, as some people seem to find it necessary to continually point out; the general quality of debate on here is what keeps me from being more than an occasional poster elsewhere.

Proud to have worn my Gersnet polo shirt award on recent trip to Mexico, though the wife said it didn't match my shorts. (What happened to my 2015/16 Runners Up Banner?)

It would have been justifiable for UEFA to have kept them apart in the draw; but it would be crazy for Celtic to accept tickets for the away match whenever it is played. The max cost would be for 5% of tickets which is all Linfield need to give them (if requested) and they don't need to accept or guarantee to sell.

Rangers day trip is £395 with ticket at extra cost to TC members.

Sports Options are £375, no ticket.

The KLM flights Tues-Thurs I am on are still available at £306. Reasonable hotels around £250 for 2 nights. So about £425+ if sharing a room/£550+ single.

That's crap. This season, of all seasons would be the ideal time for a new strip. Are they just using up old stock?

Deal was done too late to register a new strip and not clear if it had even been discussed.

No doubt that SD are sitting on large stocks and that would have been a loss Rangers would have had to underwrite if they had changed strip for next season.