ComeOffit

Now we're doing nationality stereotypes?

Not a stereotype, a fact. D&P, green, ahmed, most of the "investors", all english. Just for a second imagine they were all french or german, or even irish. You would start to think wtf.

you agree we may need it though mate, just not now under this regime. i agree.

We needed it 15 years ago. If only Murray had the foresight in the good times to speculate, we might not have ended up in this mess. Imagine the millions we wasted on Flo and Ball etc put towards expansion. In our current situation, and climate, it's just another soundbite to get the support excited. It's truly shocking just how far we have let them slip away from us. I fear they will take some catching now, in every department.

We can't speculate to accumulate anymore, even with some of the best players in Europe in the 90s we generally failed in the CL.

 

The mystic meg stuff is hard to debate since I can't see into the future. We have what we have and unless someone buys the current regime out we'll need to wait and see. I assume if/when we win our first title under Green humble pie will be eaten?

If we win a title under green and co, I will happily show my arse at Ibrox at half time for a season.

murray never ran us well at all, ever. bain jus made matters worse. we have been a financial shambles for decades. i believe it can be done though but not under greens restrictive policy. i agree 100% with your last few sentences too.

Our wage bill for players used to be upwards of 20/30 million, it's now about 7 million. Under this 30 odd percent of turnover policy to be spent on players, it's not going to get anywhere near the old levels, and even then we toiled to win the league. A few seasons of not winning the spl, and our book sales will drop, leading to more players cuts, and less success. The 80's are about to repeat themselves, only this time the titles wont be shared around. It will all be theirs.

Literally, our only hope is a rich bear buying most of the shares and stopping us being run as a cash cow for english suits. The sad part of it is, green has told his plans, and the majority think it's a goer. Mental.

why would an accies fan want buried in a rangers jersey?

Wearing an Accies one is a brass, even when dead.

We might need it, but who is going to pay for it. Another debenture scheme ala club deck, another share issue? Ground expansion doesn't come cheap, and we'll be waiting a long time for any of our so called investors coughing up enough for a project like that. Besides, we would only fill it against them, and we are light years away from CL football. More bluster from chucky again im afraid, and I'm shocked I've disagreed with you kuz, twice in 10 minutes.

Someone already pointed out that most of the "missing" 9k ex book holders are probably paying at the gate now.

what a stupid thing to say mate. from someone as clever as king too.

The truth is never stupid. When have we ever made a decent profit, or even a profit of any kind? Unless we all want to sit and watch them collect 10 in a row unchallenged, we will have to go back into debt. Selling the stadium rights for a million or two and a few more shirts just wont cut it. Debt or not making a profit is how football teams win things. Winning things give you the means to service the debt, CL etc. I admit we have to box a little more clever with our money, but that doesn't seem to be happening. Paying top dollar for an average manager, and giving the likes of jig and the decorator good long contracts.

Sorry, I thought the thread was about green talking pish again. My mistake. People seem to think because he tells us we will be making a loss this year, that it's ok. God forbid we ask any questions why a team as bad as ours means we can't even stay in the black, starting from a blank balance sheet. It's hardly a new business in the true sense ofthe word. It's not as if he has had to buy a new stadium and new team. All we got was Templeton, a few spl nobodies, and the failed decorator. The money for developements etc is coming from the share issue, so you can knock that off any calculations.

The shit will hit the fan when we actually have to buy some decent players. The share money wont last forever, so we will need a good stadium sponsorship deal just to break even. Dave King was 100% correct. We can't compete with celtic unless we make a significant loss. The sad reality of Scottish football im afraid.

I can't see in what definition of "good fan" fits people who stop supporting the club because we sign a great player who was brought up in a faith they hate. They are "bad fans" on so many levels.

 

It's got to be said that since Mo Johnson our attendances have gone up dramatically in the 23 years since compared to the 23 years prior. Looking at the stats, probably something like 50%. That sounds like thriving to me.

 

To me the hand wringers are those who wring their hands and have cries of woe about something as silly as players religion. The weird thing is that they see themselves as Christians but don't even understand the religion they associate themselves with.

 

Seems to me that if hand wringers is to be applied in the current scenario, you'd have to choose to apply it to those that are wringing their hands about the threat of stadium name change. The other side are instead rubbing their hands thinking about the income.

Nobody mentioned religion, and super mo wasn't even our first bead rattler. John Spencer was playing for us at the time, and no-one tore up their books because of him. If your old enough to remember the whole scenario, then it was done purely to prove a point by Murray and Souness(also trying to please his bead rattling missus, I might add).

Did we need him? No. Would we have won less trophies without him? No. Did it piss off lots of good fans? Yes. Was he a two faced Rangers hating wee shite? Definitely. Dont make the asumption that people hated him for his faith. Anyone crossing themselves in front of our support should be banned from Ibrox, not welcomed like a hero.

Our club changed forever that day more than the "modern" fan realises, and it wasn't because he was a catholic. It gave Murray the confidence to do whatever the fuck he wanted,which led to the banning of our songs etc, safe in the knowledge the majority would just roll over and accept it. Remind me how that worked out for us again?

You don't think D&P dragged their feet in the admin process?

Considering green and co were first contacted in march, then I suppose they did rip the piss a little. That's before you even start on how they treated Bill Millers bid. I seem to remember his spokesman saying that D&P told them a load of pish about the true situation, hence wasting another 2 weeks. The whole process was a stitch up to get D&P as much dough as possible, and to get green and co in the door. TBK, Miller and Kennedy never stood chance. Now we are expected to trust green as if everthing was legit and above board. Laughable.

Why even bother with that muppet

lol, kiss ma baws.

You've got a list of the mails and letters you've sent to UEFA or the SFA or the SPl or your MP then? Just asking.

I doubt any of the above give a fuck what I think about the hand-wringers in our support, or were you trying to make some deeper point that I've missed?

With titles come money.

 

Anyway, I really think I need a break from this place.

Relax man, it's nothing personal. It's good to have both side of any debate.

Our history is a big part of his sell to investors.

Nah, all investors care about are future incomes. Some suit in London doesn't care if we have 4/5 less titles to our name. Besides, most of the selling is done....

I believe the 'tribunal' is a sham that had the verdict decided long ago, and the only real fight is the proper legal route.

 

The fact Green has gone back on that stance shows a disappointing lack of backbone.

No, it shows that he's found someone to fund what he should be funding. They're his titles, so he keeps telling us. The truth is, he doesn't really care if we keep them or not. All he see's are the legal bills, for no great return.(financially)

Lol I now find myself having to defend Green in the face of you're deranged logic.

STB, the evil genius. He's even got me saying that green is right in this case.

As i say, I believe Green has made a mistake in that case.

You think we should just let the tribunal happen without any legal team from Rangers present? Is that what you are saying?

STB has finally lost it. I'd imagine accepting the RFFF dough is pretty much an admission that he was wrong. Otherwise he should just tell them there is no need for it. I'm sure they would listen. The fact you think the RFFF are acting without the clubs consent is craziness.

I dont know what's more ridiculous, Green saying he'll give Ally £10m for players, or actually giving Ally £10m for players.

Of course they decided themselves, the money was sitting gathering dust.

They can't have decided alone. They must have had some communication with the club to be authorised to fund any defense expenses. Otherwise, anyone off the street could have done it.

lol .

Green's initial stance that the tribunal was" nothing to do with him", was peculiar to say the least. Surely it's better to be in there from the start, rather than wait for the inevitable guilty verdict, and then fight it through the law courts. An odd twist to this sorry affair, was Chris Graham saying in his recent article that there may have been a problem with the newco defending itself, due to liquidation rules, and something to do with the old creditors. I got the feeling he was implying that this was the reason that the RFFF had to step up and pay the legal fees. Very strange. Almost as if Green has told the RFFF this to get them to pay for the defence.

Something about it all doesn't sit right with me. Why would the RFFF suddenly decide to offer to pay the expenses without any communication from Rangers? I guess they didn't, and only hope they were given the whole truth from Charles.

And we thrived as a fanbase without them.

 

They'll be plenty of hot air from some then it'll blow over.

Aye good fans replaced with hand-wringers. Thriving.

Take a look at board remuneration if Green, Stockbridge and Ahmed get their bonuses as set out in the IPO document then that alone could be skywards of £2m.

 

Why do we still employ the Travel Club staff when there won't be a Travel Club as such for at least another 3 years? Why do we still have a full complement of hospitality staff when hospitality is substantially down? etc. etc.

Ahmeds bonus was actually undisclosed in the share prospectus. It just said to be decided on performance. Could be a tenner or a million. Probably closer to a million seeing as his best buddy green decides the amount.

One of the share issue expenditures listed in the prospectus is general working capital purposes.

Aye, I know, but he was asked on tv if we needed the money to get by, and he said no. Hopefully we can do a share issue every season to keep us out the red, because we have no overdraft.