neutralscot

It's incredible news as a non rangers fan. Why didn't murray weather the storm? He could have downsized, changed the club's ethos regarding youth development etc. He was listening to celtic blogs more than he was his own legal counsel. Incredible mistake to capitulate over the big tax case. Whyte? What was he thinking? He could have had a healthy club worth 60m for £1 but contrived to lose it all. It's mind blowing.

From 18th January their SPFL record was: 7 wins, 4 draws, 5 defeats.

Interestingly, those hearts youngsters looked SPFL quality after 4-5 months experience. Obviously Levein will mess it up. Gary Locke is a coach that any club serious about a youth policy should look at. For any scottish club, selling young talent is essential. Look at Dundee Utd - recently sales over 2m for Goodwillie and Gauld. Their turnover was only 5.4m last year, so the sale of Gauld alone will boost their turnover by 50% or so. This is the equivalent of Rangers selling a home reared youngster for £9m every three years, and tbh, this is the benchmark for scottish clubs

For me the best compromise to buying success and and yet still being a selling club would be to buy young potential but for high stakes, higher than celtic's policy for example. Be willing to pay 6m for the best young talent with a 12m+ sell on in 2 years always the goal. For it to work properly though, you'd always need european football and a more credible SPFL.

The football environment has changed. Championship clubs are paying 11m for average players. No scottish club can win the CL anymore, until there is major league reconstruction that aids small nations. Scottish clubs need to balance taking advantage of inflated prices down south whilst keeping a competitive team that supporters will turn up to see.

The military is an issue where it pays to be hawkish for the yes campaign. As long as the independence movement doesn't rock the boat with radical ideas concerning unilateral disarmament, military bases or the like, America will largely continue to sit on the sidelines.

Having recently chatted with military officers from the US navy, their attitude is very much 'well we kicked them out - you guys go ahead if you want.'

You sense the SNP are desperate to keep the lid on anything radical from their membership before the vote.

IMO, I would have expected the UK gov to have appealed directly to Washington to make an announcement supporting the union. I expect Barack Obama will on the week of the vote.

I've found the No campaign a little negative, but expect it to win. I do agree with a previous poster. Imagine if the British war museum, or natural history museum was based in Dundee, or Inverness etc. Tourism and the economic spin offs would be very welcome. If Westminster was alternated with Hollyrood every year, I'd feel happier. We are meant to be a union of equals. My feeling is that the current government is just a bit Londoncentric, and we are seeing none of the boom but still plenty of the bust up north.

So, fossil fuels are not in fact made from fossils but from naturally occurring pools which replenish the supply? Jeez, everyday a school day….

So it's just me that still has nightmares about Cubillas!

I think Rangers and other teams' influence in Scotland has significantly reduced over the last twenty / thirty years, in line with the reduction in actual children playing football. Scottish football, whilst previously the be all and end all for past generations, is losing out to Sky English football and plenty of other forms of recreation, mostly screen based.

I personally don't believe there is any political lobbying / action based on what team a group of MPs support. I think the 'extremist' view of there being a papal / OO conspiracy underpinning the upper echelons of Scottish society as bunkum.

Ranger's influence in a UK context has also declined as Sky reduces Scottish clubs to a minor sideshow. Local supporter size is not as important these days as selling the EPL package to Asia. When Rangers are in the SPFL, they will likely make £150 million less in broadcasting in 3 years than say QPR. In a UK context, like it or not, the old firm are firmly in lower English Championship level now for wages, with the likelihood being that English league 1 will start cherry picking their players in a few years. Hibs/hertz are already competing with English league 1 and 2.

Politically, I believe there is still a lot of affection for Scots in England (and vice versa as you would expect in such a couple of culturally linked countries), and Rangers and celtic are still well regarded to a degree, but the failure of the old firm to even be allowed to join the english league set up at the lowest level during the Dick Advocaat era highlighted how England believes (correctly) they do not need us sportingly, and how little politically the old firm mean in England.

I don't believe the 'religious' aspects of Rangers (or celtic) resonate much in England. I think it might be viewed as 2 boxers who hate each other (supposedly), it's hyped, and is good box office. Nobody really cares about the why, just the battle. Religion may have been important 100 years ago but now it's just tribalism.

Am I answering a totally different question here? This is worse than uni.

I can assure you, if you watched 1978, you were scarred by it. For life. Anyone else?

It affecting the 1979 devolution vote purely speculation on my part.

relationship between sport and national identity.

=======

I remember Argentina 1978 and scarring trauma of it all. Scotland lost some of it's swagger directly because of it it's fair to say, and it may have negatively influenced the devolution vote of 1979. I'm sure the book will be an interesting read.

Ally had one season in the SPL during which rangers internally exploded. No one could be expected to win the league with everything in background at that time.

His euro campaigns were not the best BUT, it was very early in his management career, and 2 men sent off against malmo didn't help.

Poor in cups, excellent in league (results wise), it is surely too early to pigeon hole McCoist as a failure.

Come on guys, normally you'd have an average 50/50 chance, even with a team full of internationals. I think your squad is still thin on quality. Even with say 3 internationals signing for you next year you'd still be a bit underweight. Not to say it can't be done though. If it was done, it would be more of an achievement than probably any previous league win.

If Ally first wins championship, then the SPFL at first attempt? I make it about a 98% chance Rangers will win the championship this season, then about a 33% chance they win SPFL season after. So just about 2/1 Ally will do the unthinkable!

Kris Boyd really is a master signing. Maybe Commons is better (2 guys called Kris!) but that's it.

I'm sure you'll think…yippee then eat large quantity of humble pie.

You know, I'm better in my job than I was 2 years ago. Maybe the experience in the lower divisions will have done Ally the world of good.

Frankie, I believe some hardline celtic fans use their football club / faith (ha ha, not at catholicism, but the idea that any of them are actually practising christians) as a reason to be anti SNP and pro Labour, believing the SNP are anti catholic and anti celtic, but labour are not. Lunacy yes.

Alex Salmond – Why Rangers Football Club PLC (in administration) Must Be Saved

Mr Salmond was briefly interviewed on the BBC yesterday regarding the position of Rangers.

Below is a transcript of what he had to say.

“My appeal to Rangers and to HMRC is – can’t we agree on a sum that’s due and a means of paying it that allows Rangers to continue as an effective functioning football club in Scotland because Scottish football, even Celtic, needs Rangers. Scottish football needs Rangers.

“We want Rangers to survive and that should be a key goal and requirement prevailing on nut just Rangers, not just Craig Whyte, but HMRC as well.”

When asked about the need for regulation in football, he replied, “There are processes going on at the present moment.

“In the last few weeks I contacted both Rangers and HMRC, whose record in court is not particularly good at the present moment and I said once this Tribunal which is adjudicating on what genuinely owed – once that Inland Revenue Tribunal sets a sum – can’t that not be agreed as the sum that has to be paid and a time scale agreed to allow the club to pay it without going out of business.

“Now that seems to me an entirely reasonable proposition that would allow the Inland Revenue to get what they are due and allow Rangers to pay their obligations but continue as a vibrant part, not just of Scottish football, but of Scottish culture. I still think that is the best way forward.

“Perhaps people should concentrate on coming to an agreement and moving forward and keeping Scottish football intact with a great future.

“I want to see Rangers continue for the next century and more, contributing to the excitement and fun of Scottish football.”

===============

Without wishing to be involved in a political debate, it is irrefutable and highly admirable that fat jambo Alex Salmond lobbied on behalf of Rangers. I'd say he was about the only politician who paid anything other than lip service to ranger's plight.

Political opportunism?? Maybe. Who cares. Ironic that the best defender of rangers (an unofficial 'unionist' club) was a Scot nationalist. Maybe an official gesture of gratitude would be appropriate at some point from rangers.

But then about 2000 years ago, a guy was nailed to a tree for suggesting we all be nice to each other for a change. The irony is that most those who refuse to be nice in Scottish football, claim to worship him.

====================

And as if to emphasise my point - here is a sentence which is better than anything you will read today in any newspaper covering scottish football

I am on Gersnet because I believe it to be the most important website in Scottish football. I believe this because it is the only Rangers website that is coherent, civil and informed (that I have read). Rangers are the biggest club in Scotland and this site is the best representative of the biggest supporter block in Scotland. I find other Rangers sites with the continual cuhnt/bheast narrative, tiresome. I'd like to see gersnet try to influence not only rangers, but also the rest of scottish football.

I'm a hibbie but believe me, we may be in the same league come autumn, but that's where it ends. I believe we will finish out the top 5. Our decline can be traced to exactly the moment Rod Petrie allowed the players to visit him and complain about the manager whilst John Collins was out the country. Apparently the ring leader was Michael Stewart. Didn't like training hard. Seven years later here are the consequences.

If you want to read a different team's website, you could do worse than Hibbies Bounce.

The song is not elevating any one person, it is taken from a street gang song, a gang who, while they were from a Protestant heartland, also fought Protestants from other areas. There were probably other songs sung about them.

It most certainly a part of what Rangers is all about as history and tradition are as important to some as handwringing and profit are to others.

========================================

Apologies for my ignorance, though from the lyrics I'm sure you'll understand why I believed it to be anti catholic, or at least anti irish. What I don't understand here is what a gang have to do with rangers. Did their paths cross in the 1930's ? What is the connection?

Super Cooper - 'neutral my arse?' Perfectly understandable, but bearing in mind I am hated on celtic quick news for suggesting celtic are not a republican club per se (arguably catholic yes), and that the club has been hijacked by a bunch of neds, and that 3 names will not even publish any comments I make because I complain about him using terminology like Klan etc, then you'll have to forgive me for being a fanzine fan rather than a celtic undercover agent.

I'll probably be banned for this, so coat on, but I don't think the Billy Boys is an appropriate song for 21st century Rangers.

I grew up listening the the masses singing it and it is a very intimidating rousing anthem , a great tribal chant.

However, elevating via song, a violent ned, convicted wife beater, and a member of Oswald Mosley's fascists, doesn't strike me as befitting of Rangers. Surely this isn't what Rangers are about any longer? Surely you are a modern football team feeding on sporting endeavour rather than historical references to battering catholics? And in a European Union which is largely catholic, and on increasingly family orientated match day, is it fair to say these chants if deployed are detrimental to Rangers' long term interests?

base a professional appraisal on their chests or backsides:

======

Well they have tiny brains. What else are we meant to do?

No I agree with what you are saying. It is a desperate measure and a crap plan. I think the shares for season tickets is quite interesting though.

No, no one wants to go back divisions. Scottish football is dying without that happening again. You'd hope the threat would be enough and the company would be sold without further need for extreme measures. Ah well, my master plan wasn't so hot after all! Best of luck.

I'd be hoping for a buy out costing around 20 million, and the first season supported by credit or the angel investors I've mentioned. Net realisable value of assets, not accounting tricks. Yes, it is a plan with gaping holes, looking for the likes of your good self to fill in the gaps

Here is my plan complete with gaping holes for a velvet rangers revolution.

I believe currently the rangers support is too fragmented to be effective in achieving fan ownership in 2014, and efforts should be turned to season 2015-2016 by the end of the year if 'angel investors' have failed to remove the current board.

Goal - To create a consensus within the rangers support and eliminate economic uncertainty.

To buy the club for fan ownership.

To rebuild Rangers as a global player

Method - Conference to create united body

Use fans' season ticket money to buy shares

This is Plan Z - it assumes that any investor angels with normal sized hands predictably as usual have failed to walk the walk, and the support are totally on their own with no outside assistance.

I think fan ownership could be achieved by dangling this carrot in front of the 17,000 - from 2015 to 2016, a season ticket will entitle the purchaser to a full share in Rangers, and run for 3 years. I would expect around 100,000 tickets at £500= £50 million.

I would invite the permanently disappointing millionaires to invest, up to £50 million, and offer a seat on the board for such investment, (and most importantly for their contacts and business acumen) but weight supporter owned shares 2:1 over investor shares. So to recap £100,000,000 investment inwards in 3 years, but with season ticket revenue being used to buy out ****s, and with supporters owning 66.66% of club.

If the ****s won't sell, then they must be made aware that any plans they have for Ibrox RE sale leaseback, will not be acceptable. They must be made aware that rangers are willing to move to Hampden and possibly rebuild it with the SFA, if the conditions for Ibrox are not right. If this happens and the ****s sell Ibrox to property developers, they must be made aware that there will be continual harassment and civil disobedience on the site of Ibrox with the sole purpose of reducing the value and profit of the site. Any investors who refuse to sell at fair market value must be made aware that there will be a price to pay for this, and offices in London etc will be no protection from picketing supporters and economic pressure exerted form any avenue possible. There should be however, no ned behaviour like the hounding of BBC reporters, smashing windows at Pacific Quay for example. This needs perfect PR. And no neds.

Pre conference

1- Decide on chairman and decide on speakers. You'll need a couple of keynote speakers speaking for half an hour each, and say, 20 speakers speaking for 2 minutes each. The speakers must be representative of the support and include representatives for season ticket holders, supporters clubs and busses, international supporter clubs, websites (of which Gersnet must be one), and board members of the club, if they want to put their point of view across.

2- Decide on format - At start, conference should recap how rangers came to be an omnishambles, and why it is an omnishambles. After this, a keynote address laying out the options for the supporters, and how the conference will progress through the day. Then move onto numerous quick addresses from supporters' representatives, outlining the views of the support.

3- Lunch, then voting.

Conference

1- Hire the SECC or EICC.

2- Book a full AV package including projectors, screen, and digital voting system

3- Have prepared motions for conference. These will include:

a) Do you agree that today we create one organisation who's authority to speak for all supporters will be granted on achieving 50%+ majority, and the results of any majority votes will be respected and adhered to by the minority? YES/NO

b) Do you agree the supporters are the club, and we should own the club? YES/NO

c) Do you agree to offer to buy the shares of the current incumbents at fair market value? YES/NO

d) If they do not sell out their shares, do you agree to take a course of action which will potentially liquidate the 'company'? YES/NO

e) Are you prepared to start again in Division 2 if necessary? YES/NO

Vote on all of these and your own crafted (no pun intended) questions.

Appoint a permanent 'manager' for your new organisation. he must be of outstanding flawless character, liquid, and without any legal impediments.

Appoint a PR person untainted by Scottish nonsense. Try England for a robust PR professional. An attractive woman would be my sexist standpoint here, not some fat guy from Dennistoun.

I don't know how to finance PR people, permanent positions, hiring SECC etc - maybe DK could help.

Give your angel investors until November1st to provide a viable roadmap to fan ownership. After this it is closed to them and they must come through the fan's organisation in the future. Book SECC/EICC for Jan 31st. 2015. The results must be made available via a press release, and the current shareholder left in NO DOUBT, the consequences of their (in)actions.

Note - fair market value should be just above the asset value. The current board will try to manipulate the share price to gain a better position.

I have read recently that DK made more in paper profits from the share rally of a company he is chairman and major shareholder off in three months than he paid to SARS. (more than 40M pounds). The company stock ticker is MMG and is listed in SA. I do believe he has the funds to buy Rangers is required.

Excellent piece Hildy. Better writing than anything in paid media.

Irvine Welsh recently said a term - 'the sectarian doped old firm,' in a disparaging answer as to why the old firm win in Scotland all the time. Traditions, loyalty, yada yada. Ultimately it will hold both clubs back though. The EPL in it's earlier days will have certainly discussed the old firm in response to approaches, but I feel justified in speculating that the nutter element of both clubs,and policing, will ultimately have been the discouraging factor in rejecting overtures. The nutters may have held the club back from being a truly global powerhouse. Idle chatter I know.

Both the old firm are hostage to a very sizeable element who believe in dragging fairly extreme politics into their club, projecting an image of Rangers as beholden to a right wing, and celtic as a hotbed of terrorist sympathisers and activists to everyone else.

Right wing politics are generally unpalatable to the modern middle class, (everything is wishy washy these days- it's not the early 20th century) and you'll lose some of a demographic by being associated with it. A club which operates and is perceived as being inclusive will commercially prosper easier in normal market conditions than a non inclusive one. Barca learned this over the years. The fact that you are debating it is however fantastic. But hey, both clubs have massive supports, and as William Burroughs said 'Earth is a war planet. War and games."

Cheer up Hildy. I notice you have a dark view this now, but I'm sure rangers will come good again soon. You'll wipe the floor with the hibbies - the players will literally be on £500 a week, and the jambos were actually building a team under Locke, but levein will mess it up. If you went to easter road this season (and it is the coldest ground in Scotland I swear) and didn't see a win in over a dozen home games you'd know about misery. It's been like Ripping Yarns.

Bluebear - why do you think he feels it necessary to come out in the open now?