A Horse With No Name

I’m with you. Like you i believe if a firm offer was placed in front of them they’d have accepted ages ago. They have made glaring mistakes over the weeks but i put that down to no experience with the media, especially when every little thing they say or do will be manipulated to the extreme.

 

if they get us through this and Rangers can move on down a stable road, it’s a big gold star on their CV IMO. If we go into liquidation down the line it’s a black mark on their reputation that will be hard to shurg off. Plus, do any of us really have genuine experience of a company of our size being in this position, how it’s handled and what the real behind the scenes process is?

 

they will want to finish this job will all the “i’s” dotted and “T’s” crossed so their’s no comeback further down the line.

Cloud cuckoo land!

At £400,000 pcm these cunts will never have to work again!

As for them accepting a firm offer - ffs they said they'd accept Millars CONTIONAL OFFER today if it was the only one on offer, yet they won't accept the best offer on the table today! THESE CUNTS ARE TAKING THE PISS - AS WELL AS PLENTY SWAG, liquidation is inevitable now as all these thieves are doing is grabbbing e-v-e-r-y possible penny out of us!!

Maybe it's time for us to be realistic and walk away - enough is enough and I'm almost at the point of not giving a rats ass!!

TB is very reliable with such stuff and, while the timescale may prove incorrect, I'd suggest TBK are still very much in the box seat.

That's hardly news! There is only two possible outcomes and one possible PB, I've known that all along and it will happen one way or the other, let's be honest Frankie the two possible outcomes are either TBK's get PB or we're down the pan!

If we're down the pan why let these cunts in D&P work their ticket any longer! They are criminals in the moral sense of the word! CROOKS! Tannochbear has now aided and abetted them by his rumour as we should be kicking their door in not looking for explanations of why he took the cunt out of us, fellow rangers supporters!

There was a crooked man (Whyte) who had a crooked house (D&P) and they all stole together, in a crooked little game...

To be fair to the OP, he wasn't alone in believing this to be true and declaring so.

In other words it wasn't an exclusive at all - just guesswork based on the fact D and P said it had to be sorted on Monday! Very poor day for the forum if that's the best you can do!

Rumour are always posted in good faith but should always be taken with a pinch of salt.

I know for a fact TBK's will be named as PB tomorrow morning!

There you go more garbage!

Tbh Frankie that is the sort of guff they regularly pull on RM! Forums such as this have a great reputation because they take aa careful approach to 'exclusives' I suggest you start putting a disclaimer on anything like this in future. Something like THIS IS MORE THAN LIKELY A PILE OF PISS with flashing lights, above the thread title!

Btw where is Tannochbear this afternoon? :-)

I sent text messages last night to friends, bluenoses (and dhims) about this news....now I feel a complete dickhead and in future any 'rumours' posted on this forum will be kicked into touch until it's confirmed 100%.

Last night I still didn't sleep much, so I guess I didn't really believe it!

Have we heard from Tannochbear or has he joined Whyte in Monaco? He must feel like a right fool - I suspect he got the info from a Taig pal on broadcasting - was it Chris McLaughlinn that pulled that one Tannoch?

Behave yourself. This 'silly' attitude bound us together at a time when we were all drifting apart, bickering over nothing. Who gives a fuck what Celtic think? It's not about those ragamuffins, its about Rangers. I think that in 50 years time Super Ally's words will still be muttered at Ibrox & beyond. The man is a legend, his words are legendary & Rangers are fucking biblical. Let's see anyone try to change that...

Í take it you're speaking for juancornetto! :-)

Those Ally McCoist words might just end up as byelines in Newspapers at the buttom of fish supper wrappings! In my opinion they amount giving the Rangers haters a BLANK CHEQUE! Aye in other words he's saying WE'RE NOT WALINNG AWAY PLEASE DON'T HIT US!

Duff and Phelps have taken that on board as now they're gonna try and stretch their huge salaries to yet another week - tbh I'm fast losing patience - whether I give my life savings or not is in the balance as I need to make plans for the summer very soon, if they haven't sorted it out by first thing wednesday my money won't be there for the shares issue - I do do walking away they're not taking the cunt out of me much longer!

saw this on Rangers Media interesting article: http://www.rangersmedia.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=707:defining-rangers-the-club-versus-the-legal-entity&catid=101:club&Itemid=529

 

Definitions:

 

A Limited Company - a legal entity which owns assets and liabilities with the purpose of seeking profit ("Company" or "legal entity")

 

Newco - the continuation of a company in a legal format; usually taking assets from the OldCo whilst it's liquidated ("NewCo")

 

A Football Club - a community formed by fans working towards a common goal ("Club")

 

Rangers FC, the club, the community, was formed by the Gallant Pioneers in 1872.

 

The Rangers Football Club PLC was incorporated on 27 May 1899. This is the legal entity which holds the Club's assets and liabilities, the legal entity which seeks profit to its shareholders, and the legal entity which the Club aims to progress on.

 

As we are all painfully aware, the Limited Company as a profit making business and going concern legal entity has failed by the fact it has entered into an insolvency process.

 

The Club has not failed. From 1872 to 2012, fans continue to support Rangers Football Club as a Club not as a legal entity. We support the Club, the community that bonds Rangers fans; Bill Struth's words, Rangers 1972 European team, its miserable lows in the 1980's, its 9 in a row team, its title winning #54 team, its losing 2011/12 team. Did 48 thousand fans turn up to see Rangers old boys vs. Ac Milan Glorie in support of the Club, or the Company?

 

The Legal Entity is simply the body which is required by law to hold the assets and liabilities, can open a bank account, can take out a loan, can be floated on the stock exchange etc. It is not who the players play for - they play for the Club; the fans, the community, the history.

 

Although there are concerns over the SPL shamelessly and utterly ludicrously moving the goalposts on NewCo in a deliberate attempt to punish Rangers FC, regardless of Rangers' format next week or in six months or in six years, the Club will still exist. Rangers fans won't forget the SPL's tactics and other club's attempts to kick Rangers when they're down. Rangers will exist after David Murray, after Craig Whyte, after the new owners, after the owners after them regardless of the legal format.

 

Did The Celtc Football and Athletic Company Ltd (incorporated by Fungas in 1994) lose its history from 1888? Or since 1897 when Celtc incorported? Did the Celtc fans refuse to support this legal entity, or did they continue to support their Club?

 

Businesses fail. Legal entities fail. Rangers FC as a Club will move on.

 

If Rangers got beat next week, we will continue to support the Club. If the legal entity gets beat, we should continue to support the Club.

All that terminology can be very misleading - the crux of the matter was that Celtic weren't Liquidated and therefore no one opposed a name change, or the change of aims of that club, so that analogy cuts no ice. There are some who put forward the idea of 'Buying' our history back after insolvency but anyone who knows the bitterness of the Rangers haters will know that route would've been blocked by the 'moral outrage'. Of course that morality was missing when Celtic KNOWINGLY DEFRAUDED THE TAXMAN* for millions by lying about gate receipts.! Their fans thought it highly amusing that they got away with that (until they were skint and asked the question "what about all those huge crowds?". Their sense of humour took a dive at that point! :-)

Hopefully the threat of 1 Liquidated, will start to wane now, but we still have the outrageous possibility that on the 30th of this month these Rangers haters will try and chip away at our history! If they try that on we will need to know which clubs were pushing for it (along with the Taigs) and take the obvious sanctions against them! If they hide behind a wall of secrecy we should boycott the whole lot of them til they see sense!

As I said I don't mind being punished but they can't mess with our history, and make our memories false - THAT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE!

Tonight, though I shall sleep a little easier! Well done Paul Murray!

*if anyone doubts that look back to the outrage the Kelly's had to shelter from (and Mars bars etc) their fans the day after the Kelly's put it out that they had put in THEIR OWN MONEY!

I wonder if the people who were still taking it upon themselves to rip the absolute fuck out of Miller "The American businessman" can tell us how many jobs Mini and his men have created in the UK over the past two decades..?

 

Ahhh, hell. Time to get off our knees, eh? Going to drink a bit and play some guitar. I think everyone should do the same.

 

Back to it: :spl:

Maybe take out the acoustic myself "WE'VE been through the desert on a horse with no name..". Now, although we're not out of the (desert) yet, but we're in with a fighting chance!

Great news!

Now, is the time to put all that ill feeling towards those that backed TBK's to bed. Everyone must make an effort to help get us off our knees, whether that's putting in cash to the shares issue or facing up to our many enemies. First up we have to let those attending and voting in that meeting on the 30th know that if they try to mess with our history THEIR CLUBS and SCOTTISH FOOTBALLL WILL SUFFER in the form of boycotts etc!

They've been kicking us we were down - now let's get into those bastards!

It was always gonna be the fan based consortium that won - so much time wasted - let's get behind them now!

Well done Paul Murray and your backers!

It's sad if you allow your support for a club to be dictated by the actions of the SFA. Do they have that much influence over you?

Rangers Rovers 2012 won't be my team!

Give this newco some thought, there will be no more RFC badges, no pictures of ex players inside the stadium (if this newco still own it - Celtic could buy it and use it for U21 matches), the SFA maybe not even give you permission to use the colour blue, christ it's a depressing scenario!

Only a matter of time before Celtic surpassed our trophy haul is another...

Also picture yourself in discussions with Tims.. Or even Sheepshaggers... Christ Partick Thistle will be a more successful club...

It's sad some of you won't face these harsh truths!

If thing go down the newco route, i do belive there will be a lot of folk saying they'll not support it. However, i would put money on the 1st newco game @ Ibrox being a complete sell-out!!!

There (as expected) is a lot of bravado and beating of the chests - but within a short space of time the reality will set in. If either 1 or 2 happens for me 1 will be akin to a FATAL heart attack while 2 will be getting HIV, with death taking longer...

The one person (not Ally with his SFA pleading) that has shown the right attitude is Alex McLeish - when asked about his attitude re trophies being removed said I'D LIKE TO SEE THEM TAKE MY MEDALS OFF ME!

This silly attitude of Ally McCoists (We Don't Do Walking Away) and those of you that echo it are just giving the people that hate Rangers the green light to get tore in! Where is the deterrent to those that vote on April 30th to be fair?

What these people are pushing for is simple. They have two outcomes in mind: First to try and get Rangers liquidated, second to take away our titles. These people hope that Rangers fans will return to subsidising scottish football after either 1 or 2, they hope we don't do walking away as they need our money!

Rangers are the most successful club team in the world - destroying that by liquidation or removing trophies at their leisure destroys our soul! It will destroy scottish football too...

The more you stick to this woeful (and untruthful) idea of not walking away the more you invite damage on the club, also for those being abusive I really do fear for you because if either 1 or 2 happens (maybe even both) you are in for a rude awakening because you'll find out then the real enemy wasn't me, I naturally hope neither of these happens, but if it lessens the worry - just keep abusing me!

What kind of response do you expect to a post like that? Do your walking away now mate and save us the hassle of reading your hanky waving pish. NO SURRENDER.

What I'm saying here is reality, whether you like it or not Rangers Rovers 2012 will drop support by huge margins in the case of 1 and in the case of 2 the support will gradually dwindle and we'll have same levels of support relative to Dundee v Dundee Utd - we'll eventually fall by the wayside like Dundee have in that city!!

Now, you can call that hanky waving if you like, but should either 1 or 2 happen time will prove me right! If they don't happen I'll continue supporting MY TEAM and I don't need permission from you for that!

As Morgan F said in The Shawshank Redemption THERE'S A HARSH TRUTH TO BE FACED - by ignoring that harsh truth YOU make it more likely.

if rangers do indeed go into liquidation who will support a new co?

 

i wont be. should we go down the pan then im finished with football. i will never put another penny into the game and ill make sure my son doesnt either.

 

I sat on my grandfathers knee when i was 5 and he told me that his dad too was a rangers fan. that takes my familys involvement with rangers back to before the turn of the 20th century. A very long line of tradition. A tradition that will disappear in an instant should we go down the tubes over the next few weeks.

 

You just cant replace that. it just wont be the same.

Absolutely 100% spot on - others are kidding themselves on, they'll be surprised how easy it'll be to walk away from a club that ISN'T RANGERS! Scottish football as a competitive sport will be over. FINNITO.

By the way if they find us guilty of using double contracts and decide to relegate us to the 3rd Division I would continue supporting Rangers - I have no problem with getting punished for the way we let David Murray run us, but they mess with memories then as far as I'm concerned it's GAME OVER for scottish football!

1. Liquidation. Will you support a newco?

My answer is that having given the matter a great deal of thought DIFINIITELY NO! All the years I've followed Rangers would be like the memory of my Mother and Father and people I've cared for in the past DEAD! It puts into question what is the point in supporting a club that isn't everlasting, because whether we give the issue much thought or not that's basically the rationale of our support!

Now, it's always hard to gauge fans' opinion - my thoughts are that (forum wise especially) although around 75-80% say they will 'not walk away' most WILL WALK AWAY In my opinion them saying that is hugely bravado on their part as when they're faced with the cold facts that this newco will have no trophies and no history to sustain them through barren years they will simply stop coming! My thinking is that 'initially' they'll get around 10,000 at Ibrox with that number slowly falling over the years.

Do you agree or disagree with that?

2. Taking away our trophies. Would you support Rangers (newco or not) if these cunts on the 30th of April take away any of our trophies?

For me the answer is again DEFINITELY NO! My reasons are the same as for 1.

Don't get me wrong I'll take a lot of comfort if Rangers survive but I won't continue to put money into something where the prizes and successes I've cherished can be taken away!

Tbh, it is completely irrational for these Rangers hating cunts at the SFA/SPl to try to take these actions, but the hatred they have for us is such... Would it mean games the Dutch players played in were awarded too the opposition? Where do they stop with that nonsense? It's one thing doing it to Sion when a competition is underway but...

For those of you who have answered yes to either of these ask yourselves a question: Rangers beat Celtic to win a trophy and you leave the ground smiling but at some point you must be thinking HAVE WE REALLY WON...:disgusted:

What's the betting when this is over those two will leave that firm and leave the country! I'm away to put my head down and crash - hopefully I'll get a text before returning to work, but I feel it's been their game all along to drag this out until the end of season ANOTHER COUPLE OF CAPITALIST CROOKS!

Hate that prick as well but as you say mate better the devil you know. Some day all the dirty wee secrets are going to come surrounding this disaster I hope I'm still here to hear it.

I'm not back to work until Monday so I've asked a Bear pal to text me when they make the announcement so will just lie in a darkened room until then - what's the betting these cunts are still making excuses!

When this is over and we're down the pan we should use all our energies to get these cunts barred, tbh they better keep a very low profile because at some point in time they'll run into a Bear with a sore head! If they do their job I'm heading for a sunny beach with a handful of books and a few Stellas - never felt so knackered in all my life!

I feeking hate Capitalism, scumbags the lot of them - if these Rangers haters think we're just gonna support a newco and continue feeding them all with our money they're out of their minds - no Rangers, no more money will I put their way!

They've been well warned IFRANGERS FC GO DOWN THE PAN SO WILL SCOTTISH FOOTBALL!

Sorry, Craig talking at cross purposes there - i haven't a clue, like you said why is it necessary to appoint McElroy when it's just simple arithmetic... I'm away now for a cup of tea heads doing me in!

Thanks AHWNN. Why would they need to appoint someone ? The people already involved looked sufficient enough, all they need to do is assess who they think should be paid first, then second etc etc. Surely it isnt THAT difficult !

Exactly, if they've had talks with HMRC and they've said okay 10p in the pound surely, it's just a matter of paying of the smaller sums and then working up the Taxman...

The other thing that smells is this ruling of the 'BTC' i just wonder if they're stalling with that in mind, but then maybe HMRC are stalling to see if there's a linkage between the preferred bidder and Whyte or to see if he's gonna get a backhander...

God, this is fekking torture, i wouldn't be surprised if D&P are a couple of Tims just enjoying themselves!

As far as I can tell D&P have moved the goalposts more than once already.

I know but this is kinda a big one - it's a bit like Keanu Reeves (The Matrix) noticing a black cat on the stairwell...

I have always erred on the side of supporting D&P given the very difficult job they have had.

 

But I am moving very swiftly away from being supportive of them to thinking they are doing a hatchet job on us.

 

I thought the exact same thing AHWNN, they originally said that the "best and final" bids would obviously have conditions attached to them. There is NO WAY that ANY bidder will make an unconditional offer for the club UNLESS there is nothing further to be gained from seeing the books in a period of exclusivity i.e. if D&P are saying that the creditor listing is complete and that there is really nothing to be gained by the period of exclusivity.

 

And if that is what they are saying (the period of exclusivity makes no difference as there is no further information) then they are loons, because no bidder in their right mind will simply take an administrator at their word.

 

Any credible bidder worth their salt will want a period of FULL ACCESS without inhibition.

 

Duff & Phelps are very much starting to irritate.

What they led us to believe was that the preferred bidder had to then agree with the creditors and then a transfer of power could be completed and then Rangers exit Administration. If they're saying that's not the case and as you said that the Creditors listing is complete and (i add this on) they've all agreed 10p in the pound or whatever then surely as you say that's a done deal, no need to mess around just do the deal get in there and start to get things sorted.

I must say my head is spinning with the amount of dummies these guys are throwing our way. Initially, when Paul Murray said it would be good if the preferred bidder was in place for the last old firm game and they then came out with saying "they'd try their best to have a transfer of power before the end of the season.." my thought was LIQUIDATION and the rest is flannel so that Rangers fans can come out and keep the club going to the end of the season, by which time we'd be toast and they'd've racked up one hell of a wage bill!

If they haven't sorted this out by tomorrow and think it's game over...

It reminds me of a ploy i used when i was a Support Worker. Big lad and i wanted to get him fitter, lose some weight etc etc healthier body healthier mind. I would tell him "let's just walk to the next bus stop" and then once we got there it was "we may as well walk to the next one".... This whole thing just stinks that's what my senses tell me.

I actually thought the other day when i read of them saying "right guys we need this sorted, time is of the essense..." i thought hey the penny has dropped and maybe the Politicians having a word in their ear has done the trick...

Hopefully by the time i've finished work tonight and got home and turn on the radio...

but then maybe Sonny and Cher will come on AAAARRRRGGGHHHH!

As I have said quite a few lines. It is not as easily done as a player transfer or somesuch - though if I say Jelavic and Goodwillie, that may wake a few up on here. Every legal stuff takes its time, most of it will have to be done in writing, and I mean legally binding and correct writing. It has to follow certain guidelines, and I assume administration guidelines - not least with regards to the minefield left behind by SDM, Whyte and Lloyds - are pretty strict indeed. Other clubs have been in administration for years (Motherwell?) and survived. IMHO, the admins are actually pressing for a quick solution with all their deadlines and somesuch, to force the bidders hands. If, in the time being, Ticketus et al change their opinions or court cases against Whyte et al make an impact, the whole process may get further delays ... who again follow a strict code of conduct. And I'm only guessing here and sure don't want to paint the admins in a better light than they deserve.

 

Ever since the age of internet and quick access to news fell upon us, people have become impatient and want all the info they can as quickly as possible and expect that much of what is being written here, there, and everywhere is actually the truth, or at least partly true. The big problem is that to keep up with this demand, you get a lot of info that is - at best - half truth, peppered with a great deal of assumption and conjecture from the media. Day in and day out. No wonder the hysteria levels you encounter with each and every bad news nowadays.

Definitley true about this being an age where people are impatient. I mind seeing a film review thingy a wee while ago and the Producers and Directors of films were saying that if they didn't get the attention of the viewers within the first few minutes the film tends to flop, wonder how many good films have fallen by the wayside because of that.

The thing that confuses me is that surely after the first 'round' when the bidders put in revised bids it would just be a matter of the paperwork involving shorts pieces for amendments? (ie same as offer of xth of March, with the exception of the following...)

Same with Brian Kennedy, i'm sure the fella just wanted his bid aired in case they were about to make a decision for one of the ones wanting Liquidation, and it'd be a case of the bid will be delivered to your offices first thing tomorrow morn.

Is that too simplistic?

Surely they're not gonna read the entire offers again... Tick tock, tick tock...

I see on ceefax they're reminding bidders that the bids have to be unconditional. I seem to recall them saying a few weeks back that it was natural for the bidders to put conditions as part of their bids...

So, have they moved the goalposts or is my imagination playing tricks?

I'd imagine (could be wrong...) it is about using the RFFF money to pay off the smaller bills. Can't imagine it'd be anything bigger.

So long as the needle is filled with arsenic all should be fine

That plus a few air bubbles Craig! ;-)