The Media, Gersnet and the Peloponnesian wars

[calscot 0]

What about Faslane and Ravenscraig? Are you suggesting that they get subsidised?

 

A report was buried? So what? Reports get buried all of the time.

 

You seem to be suggesting that Scotland should solely benefit from North Sea Oil. Talk about a selfish attitude.

 

Scotland is subsidised by the rest of the UK....and thankfully they were there to bail out our banks recently.

 

Lots of different parts of the country had problems with some of her policies but the country as a whole emerged stronger at the end of her time, and it's small-minded and selfish to take a parochial view and say that she should have ensured that bits of unsuccessful Scottish industry should be protected at a cost to the rest.

 

:fish:

 

I really don't get you here. Ravenscraig and Faslane subsidised? Not at all, they were both working efficiently, all they needed was for the government to fulfill the contracts they were promised. Instead they were moved to Tory constituencies.

 

The problem I have is that in most of the country a large proportion of the money stays in the area that raises it. The one huge anomaly is the oil revenue where very little of the money stays there. London is the area that has been subsidised by the rest of the country for centuries - why should they be given so much at a cost to rest?

 

Why is asking that the part of the country that I come from should get a fair deal being parochial? It's not even just Scotland that gets a raw deal, you just have to look at quite a bit of northern England. But the poor and unemployed are just parasites and spongers, right?

 

I really don't get this "Scotland is shit" attitude and where any Scotsman who says, "wait a minute" is some sort of degenerate to be labelled "little Scotlander" or whatever.

 

Scotland must be pretty shit to have so much money pumped into it and still be one of the poorer parts of Britain. Or does it not make more sense that the richest part of the country has had the most subsidy? Money has been flowing into London from the rest of the country for centuries. It's never been the other way around.

 

I'm really not going to get into this as it's too depressing that people have such anti-Scottish attitudes but are probably uber-Scots when it suits them, but the funny thing is, I'm pretty confident about which party certain people vote for - the Tory party line has well and truly been swallowed.

[maineflyer 0]

Those spongers etc that you talk about are EXACTLY one of the MAJOR reasons I have no desire to move back to the UK (although it is, in time, inevitable).

 

I have family who are benefit whores not deserving of it. Some of them get benefits they simply are not entitled to whilst my younger brother, who is mentally handicapped (some would say I am too ) gets next to nothing or has to jump through hoops for anything.

 

At least in Bermuda the tax you do pay is a consumption tax and is not a tax to pay for the services of others who, in many cases, simply dont want to work.

 

So many pay 40% tax so those sponging bassas can sit on their fat arses all day. Not likely.

40% tax, I only wish that was it.

 

Add NI and council tax and you don't even get half of what you earn. Then add the endless maze of VAT, duties and levies ...... and you you're struggling to have anything left. But don't save it or invest it or you'll forfeit any right to the social care you've spend you life paying for, and thereby even the little bit you've managed to keep to yourself.

 

The UK is a socially dysfunctional bandit, intent on robbing the individual of every last vestige of independence or humanity. I just wonder who is going subsidise the freeloading social junkies when they've finally bled dry or driven out the people who pay their bill?

[andy steel 0]

Hoorah! Well said indeed, sir.

 

Calscot, I'm talking about btw.

[Bluedell 5,330]

I really don't get you here. Ravenscraig and Faslane subsidised? Not at all, they were both working efficiently, all they needed was for the government to fulfill the contracts they were promised. Instead they were moved to Tory constituencies.

 

The problem I have is that in most of the country a large proportion of the money stays in the area that raises it. The one huge anomaly is the oil revenue where very little of the money stays there. London is the area that has been subsidised by the rest of the country for centuries - why should they be given so much at a cost to rest?

 

Why is asking that the part of the country that I come from should get a fair deal being parochial? It's not even just Scotland that gets a raw deal, you just have to look at quite a bit of northern England. But the poor and unemployed are just parasites and spongers, right?

 

I really don't get this "Scotland is shit" attitude and where any Scotsman who says, "wait a minute" is some sort of degenerate to be labelled "little Scotlander" or whatever.

 

Scotland must be pretty shit to have so much money pumped into it and still be one of the poorer parts of Britain. Or does it not make more sense that the richest part of the country has had the most subsidy? Money has been flowing into London from the rest of the country for centuries. It's never been the other way around.

 

I'm really not going to get into this as it's too depressing that people have such anti-Scottish attitudes but are probably uber-Scots when it suits them, but the funny thing is, I'm pretty confident about which party certain people vote for - the Tory party line has well and truly been swallowed.

 

just because they were working efficiently doesn't mean they were working profitably. I believe BSC were receiving subsidies, for example. It was their decison to close Ravenscraig, but let's blame the Tories anyway.

 

I'd be interested in the proof that London is subsidised by the rest of the country. Yes, money flows into it, but that's not subsidies. It's just where a lot of our nation's cash is generated.

 

As for the oil indursty, the likes of Aberdeen has done well from it. Money tens to stay with the people whoo own the companies that make the money. the location of where that monet is earned is largely irrlevant unless you are talking about the knock-on effect, like Aberdeen.

 

Scotland isn't shit. It's you that has tried to portray it as such under Thatcher. That's not the Scotland I recognise at the end of her time in power. It was booming with lots of great business deals going on. I believe it's gone downhill a bit since then, and we've only ourselves to blame for that, but it's still OK.

 

Scotland is currently subsidied by the rest of the UK. Have the confidence to accept it, and don't look on it as being anti-Scottish. We're an integral parrt of the UK and will continue to be so

 

Also just because people have a different view from you doesn't mean that they have to be swallowing a party line. Debaters and free thinkers are what made this country great.

[Bluedell 5,330]

I hope I'm not your first catch but I'd like to agree with you on every point. The Little Scotchlander demonisation of Thatcher is as self-defeating as it's ill-informed.

 

Oh, and I'll take the poll tax back tomorrow. I work to pay for my family, not about a dozen other families as well. Selfish? Who exactly is being selfish here, the spongers and state-addicted benefit monkeys?

 

Not fishing at you, mate. I meant it. Just highlighting the fact that I knew I was being provocative to Calscot.

[26th of foot 5,836]

Here's something that folks always ignore about Maggie.

 

In late 1981, her Government announced that the Ice Breaker, 'Endurance' would not be replaced, the two frigates that stagged on in the South Atlantic were being withdrawn to Belize, and the Naval Party(Royal Marines) on station in the Falkland Islands were being reduced by more than 50%. The result in March'82 was a dozen Argentenian scrap metal merchants stepped on to South Georgia and began to dismantle the old whaling station. Without reaction, other than diplomatic attempts, the Argentenian fascist Junta invaded British Sovereign terrority and put 2,500 of Her Majesty's subjects under a totaltarian yoke.

 

Recovery of the lands, liberation of the people, and restoration of the status quo cost in excess of 300 British servicemens lives. Maggie went on to win a further election on the back of her reaction to a situation; she was directly responsible for creating.

Edited August 22, 2009 by 26th of foot

[maineflyer 0]

I'm always amused at the hatred that still persists towards Margaret Thatcher, as if hating Thatcher was some of rite of passage, an assertion of scottishness. The face, the accent, the 'Englishness', the inevitable governmental mistakes. But in spite of it all, she set a path of huge improvement and provided enormous encouragement to those Scots struggling under the choking socialist madness and corruption. In the 20 years since she left Downing Street, every other politician in this country has tried to ride the wave she set in motion but not one since has come close to contributing what she did. Which obviously still sticks in the gullets of those who believe Scotland naturally belongs to those who contribute least.

 

You don't like Thatcher? Who would you have had instead? Another decade of Callaghan? Michael Foot? Neil Kinnock? Now that's really scary.

[andy steel 0]

It's not a subject I find especially rib-tickling, but it takes all sorts, I suppose.