A dinosaur rears it's head

[der Berliner 3,290]

People should also make a clear distinction between nationalism and patriotism.

[simplythebest 0]

People should also make a clear distinction between nationalism and patriotism.

 

Exactly, i'm a patriotic Scot and Brit, not a nationalist.

[The Real PapaBear 0]

Exactly, i'm a patriotic Scot and Brit, not a nationalist.

 

hmmm. I'd be grateful if you could define the difference for me.

[simplythebest 0]

hmmm. I'd be grateful if you could define the difference for me.

 

Well I don't believe in separatism for one.

[simplythebest 0]

"has become"? I put it to you, sir, that you started out with your mind made up about scottish nationalism. I say this because if you compare the records in office of the SNP v either of the westminster governments which have been in place since the SNP were elected, you cannot reasonably fail to conclude that Scotttish nationalism has been good for this country, whether it be higher education, the scottish NHS, free eye exams, care for the elderly, investment in renewable energy, investment in transport infrastucture, - the list goes on and on.

You know, stuff that used to be considered a British birthright? Stuff that you now only find practiced in Scotland. Maybe because we are now protected against the worst of Tory ideology?

Your view of present Scotland is very one sided to say the least.

 

I'm only 21 and I've never had political views drummed into me so I make up my own mind. I find nationalism to be separatist, divisive, borderline bigoted and downright horrible at times. What happened to Nigel Farage in Edinburgh and Salmond's refusal to condemn it is a prime example of the horrible side. This is not the type of country I want Scotland to become.

[Bluedell 5,356]

Exactly, i'm a patriotic Scot and Brit, not a nationalist.

 

Agreed. You can be proud to be a Scot without wanting independence.

[simplythebest 0]

Agreed. You can be proud to be a Scot without wanting independence.

 

That pretty much goes back to my initial point in this thread, that nationalists make out to be true proud Scots you have to want independence.

[calscot 0]

I'd argue that Scotland was relatively better off in the 80s than it is now.

 

I would say that's incredibly ignorant of what went on at the time - perhaps you were better off. Maybe it's getting worse again but who has most of the power in Westminster now?

 

Thatcherism had it's good points but went way too far and due to lack of votes over the border, shafted Scotland. They also shafted the British economy - and we're still paying for that now due to creating an economic system that relied on our banks instead of manufacturing to bring in the money.

 

I leaned towards the Tories in the early 80's due to more sensible policies than the loony left at the time and the infighting of the Lib-Dems and the marginalisation of the SNP. But when someone shafts you good, you don't invite them back - not when they haven't changed a bit.

 

I really don't agree they are doing any good for the economy right now and even history has shown their policies are unlikely to work - just look at the difference between Hoover and Truman.

 

I've never felt so wary about losing my job to cuts as I have since the Tories came in and haven't had a pay rise either, despite high inflation. I was very poor under the Tories before and I'm getting poorer with less job security under their policies now.

[The Real PapaBear 0]

Agreed. You can be proud to be a Scot without wanting independence.

 

Of course you can, and nobody is claiming anything else.

 

I can completely respect, whilst fundamentally disagreeing with, the view that Scotland is better off in the union - and would never suggest that anyone who held a different view to mine is any less Scottish for holding the view they do - however flawed .

 

Having said that it strikes me as oxymoronic to say that one is a proud Scot and proud Brit but isn't a nationalist. Pride in your country *is* nationalistic by definition. The only question is whether you believe your country is best served by the union with England.

[The Real PapaBear 0]

Agreed. You can be proud to be a Scot without wanting independence.

 

Of course you can, and nobody is claiming anything else.

 

I can completely respect, whilst fundamentally disagreeing with, the view that Scotland is better off in the union - and would never suggest that anyone who held a different view to mine is any less Scottish for holding the view they do - however flawed .

 

Having said that it strikes me as oxymoronic to say that one is a proud Scot and proud Brit but isn't a nationalist. Pride in your country *is* nationalistic by definition. The only question is whether you believe your country is best served by the union with England.