Keevins in Sunday Mail

[barca72 440]

Enlightened, savvy and proud.

 

Come with us, it's a bright new dawn here.

 

Patronising.

[barca72 440]

 

 

That's an interesting take on it. The overwhelming majority of Rangers 'global' support is made up of ex-pats, there are exceptions but they are just that. That's the case for all clubs outside of Real, Barca, Juve, Milan, Man U, Liverpool and Bayern. In recent times you might be able to add Man City, Chelsea and Arsenal to that list but not many more. Our 'global support is diaspora based, not kids in China playing FIFA and thinking 'I like the sound of this YCV those guys sing about, coupled with Ian Black and they're the side for me'.

 

I also feel you are conflating 'removing the religious element' with singing songs glorifying murder gangs. I think Rangers will remain the 'Protestant' club in Glasgow, mainly by default because Celtic will retain the 'Catholic' support. I've no issue with that, AC Milan remain the 'left wing' club in Milan despite being owned by right wing Berlusconi. My main problem is this belief that only by singing about Northern Ireland and in particular murderers there are we able to display this. Where's your pride in the enlightenment or the covenanters? I see no display of 'Protestantism' at Ibrox, rather a narrow, angry display of what's broadly called 'Loyalism' of the Northern Irish kind.

 

I've a number of issues with 'loyalism'; it is outdated, it's not progressive in anyway, it makes no sense (who is this loyalty too exactly and more importantly why?) and its out of step with the world around it. That we'd choose it of all 'isms' to cling too makes no sense to me.

 

Playing up this 'loyalist team' thing won't garner us anymore supporters worldwide, producing world class footballers will though. Success is what grows your fanbase, nothing else.

 

You clearly no longer live here, you've made another part of the world your home. I'm curious, what is about loyalism that you like, you've seen the world for it is, you know that decency, loyalty, kindness, common-sense aren't limited to one race or religion. Why do you still see it as a virtue?

 

If you want to know something go directly to the source, assume nothing. Your assumption that "I also feel you are conflating 'removing the religious element' with singing songs glorifying murder gangs." is basically wrong. If you read any of my posts in this thread I have not advocated merging Protestanism with with any other ' ism '. I said that the Global support , such as that poor insignificant amount of diaspora compared to the big clubs' support, require the central Protestant core. That is not the same as embracing any kind of 'ism'. In our club we play songs like 'Still the Blues' and other Rangers' standards, those who attend the NARSA convention will get their 'ism ' jag when they have a listen to, and join in with, The Govan Protestant Boys Flute Band. Those who choose not to enjoin can leave and enjoy other pursuits for the evening.

That remark about the Chinese kid was specious. However, I do agree with you that producing world class players will help increase the the small Global support, although you do realise that you and I will never see a Rangers team playing anything close to the standard of Barcelona in our lifetime.

You seem to have a real problem with loyalism, and that is your choice and is perfectly legitimate. However, you ask me why I still see it as a virtue and yet I have never advocated loyalism in any of my posts ( assumption again ). It is not for me to preach to the choir. I have agreed with you in a previous post that the world is changing and that anachronisms will probably fall by the wayside by default. If you believe that, then why are you wasting so much energy railing against an 'ism' that will be taken care of by society and the authorities for you?

I can be a Rangers supporter, RTID, and not need to be the same guy I was 40/50 years ago. If the truth be known, over that time period you get to look back across the pond and see how parochial the whole situation is. Sometimes the whole thing just saddens you.

However, with a foot on each shore the cry will always be 'NO SURRENDER'.

[barca72 440]

 

Venom? I was being nice.

 

I could go through your post line by line, but it would simply be an exercise in correction. Half the stuff you write is attributing things to me which I did not say - where, for example did I say that you or any other ex-pat is insignificant? Where did I say that Celtic are driving the agenda?- and the other half is irrelevant to what is being discussed - what relevance is it that every club has some numpties?

As to whether I have the right to tell people how to conduct themselves, I'd have thought it was pretty obvious; it's both a right and a responsibility to do so, if those people are behaving in a way which is anti-social, criminal or damaging to the club. What's the alternative? Just shut up and look the other way and leave it up to outsiders to force reform upon us?[/QUOTE]

 

This is the job of the club and authorities, yours is to support Rangers.

[barca72 440]

Maybe I don't want to believe that 40k+ people are attending games, not actually for the football, but for a mass celebration of anti-Catholicism, and pro-Orange Order of which most know little about and few are members. If you can prove to me that that is the case then I will be truly saddened for the country of my birth and the football club I follow.

 

BTW Can't stand Penny Arcade, I prefer Rangers songs. We have a few and could have made up a ton more had we not been stuck in the 17th century. We could even still have had the Billy Boys if we had dropped the F word - that was an anthem.

 

You have the right to believe what you want. I have neither the time, the inclination or the skill to convince you otherwise.

[Steve1872 4]

This. Looking forward to a good sash bash in Stenny tomorrow

 

Xmas sash bash next week with 200 knuckledraggers down here in the heart of England

[Juancornetto 1]

What a truly depressing thread

[RyanGers193 0]

Xmas sash bash next week with 200 knuckledraggers down here in the heart of England

 

 

Got mine next week too, might even sing TBB

[RyanGers193 0]

So many people in here must feel really uncomfortable when attending Rangers matches.

[Juancornetto 1]

So many people in here must feel really uncomfortable when attending Rangers matches.

 

Not in the slightest, even if that was the case would that please you? To make people uncomfortable...?

 

Why don't you sing your loyalist, anti-Catholic songs at work in the bosses office? I'll tell you why, because you need the comfort blanket of others around you and need to feel as if you belong to something that is a wee bit subversive and controversial don't you Ryan? To find identity only in something which is the opposite position to another must be pretty unfulfilling. Tragic almost.

[RyanGers193 0]

Not in the slightest, even if that was the case would that please you? To make people uncomfortable...?

Why don't you sing your loyalist, anti-Catholic songs at work in the bosses office? I'll tell you why, because you need the comfort blanket of others around you and need to feel as if you belong to something that is a wee bit subversive and controversial don't you Ryan? To find identity only in something which is the opposite position to another must be pretty unfulfilling. Tragic almost.

 

Name one anti catholic Rangers song? Really doubt my boss would mind if I'm being honest.

 

What's controversial about singing the same songs as thousands of like minded people around me?

 

What's tragic is that we have fans like you in our great protestant loyalist support. There's plenty of other clubs to follow since you hate Rangers fans with a passion.