We Are The People - This Is Our Time

[Hildy 0]

There's nothing wrong with options when it comes to fan groups or websites. It's natural to form mini-communities on shared interests.

 

However, we have to remember the main shared interest is Rangers FC. All too often, some fans forget that, for the most part, we'll agree on most of the main issues facing the club and fans. Consequently we just need to work on finding that common ground and not allow the smaller side-issues stop us from working together where and when we can.

 

Do we think Celtic fans all love each other? No way, in fact, many hate each other more than we do. However, they have shown they'll put personalities aside for the greater good. We need to learn that lesson.

The thing about options is that it confuses the message. The one thing we should be able to do is to have one group preaching the fan ownership message, but instead we have an unnecessarily complicated situation which is entirely self-inflicted.

 

Ideally we'd have one group but we know now that this is an unlikely scenario - and if it happened, it would only be for a brief moment in time until a new group came along offering its own brand of recycled wisdom.

 

Instinctively, we seem to drift apart while preaching unity. I view things simply. I want Rangers to be a fan-owned club so I joined the vehicle that exists to help make it happen - the RST.

 

Along the way, I have seen faces on the Trust board that I was less than keen on but I stuck with it because I believed in its core message. I do the same at Rangers. I see people in high places at the club that I wish were somewhere else, but I stick with the club because the club is greater than the various ownership regimes that come and go.

[the gunslinger 3,366]

these schemes are great and no doubt ultimately the solution but we also need something more immediate.

[buster. 4,808]

these schemes are great and no doubt ultimately the solution but we also need something more immediate.

 

Regards the immediate, there is the SoS public meeting this evening that will be covering this (see other thread for details).

 

To a degree, matters are out of our hands but I agree that we need to know and do as much as we can regards the immediate.

We lose focus on the immediate and we have a longer, more difficult and more expensive trek to embark on regards longterm solutions.

 

One immediate issue regards share ownership is 'resolution 10' and how it would be used regarding possible issue of penny shares / dilution in stake holdings for some. This being of direct interest to fan ownership ambitions.

[SteveC 150]

It's a lovely article D'Art. "Right on target, so direct..."

 

But as we all know. it won't make a blind bit of difference. Rangers fans seem incapable of unity (you can see the seeds of division even in supposedly supportive replies above)

 

 

Also, even if we were united we'd still be underdogs in the situation where evil asset stripping hedge fund managers and Ashley hold not only every ace but every card in the pack.

 

Our great club, Struth's club, was taken into administration and liquidation and we, those who look into the mirror you speak of, did not even then pick up the scarcely breathing body. That was our fatal error and a disastrous dereliction of duty. We became Leeds and Portsmouth like at that moment. Sent to Coventry (or Northampton) as it were.

 

The second, third and fourth biggest supported clubs in Scotland all would have fought, legally and illegally,to save their club in its time of utter crisis. They would have mobilised and fought back. Despite Timmy Thomson's view of our "fearsome reputation", we didn't, one or two ineffectual afternoons apart. Why do you think we will now?

 

As I say, it is well written and nicely put - but in the grand scheme of things isn't it just self indulgent hot air*, like a guy in a bar spouting off re government policies on the economy and how they should really not keep screwing the poor and stop protecting the rich. Yes, of course, we all mutter as we order our next drinks and go back home eventually having done f@ck all?

 

* Sorry, I do enjoy your "set-pieces", I wanted to praise not criticise, but you are just preaching to the converted and powerless. It is all just...well, bubbles in the air and not celebratory ones.

 

PS None of the schemes described as "great " are having any impact whatsoever. A "great" fan ownership scheme would have, or would have a chance of, delivering fan ownership. None of ours do, and endless cheer leading of one over the other (however disguised in the opening sentences) is just more pissing in the wind. I admire the work people do I have/still am contributed to RST/RF/BR but I have absolutely no hope that they will ever have an effect or influence.

 

That's not a reflection on those involved (their bickering aside, but then that's just internet babble, it's meaningless in the real world of influence and control) some of whom are admirable - but all seem blinkered into thinking they are achieving something. They (we) simply are not - nor do we show the slightest signs that we ever will.

Edited October 7, 2014 by SteveC

[the gunslinger 3,366]

Regards the immediate, there is the SoS public meeting this evening that will be covering this (see other thread for details).

 

To a degree, matters are out of our hands but I agree that we need to know and do as much as we can regards the immediate.

We lose focus on the immediate and we have a longer, more difficult and more expensive trek to embark on regards longterm solutions.

 

One immediate issue regards share ownership is 'resolution 10' and how it would be used regarding possible issue of penny shares / dilution in stake holdings for some. This being of direct interest to fan ownership ambitions.

 

 

if enough of us can get together and demad the best for the club and make it clear we will only fund the best then we can win the immediate war.

 

sure ashley may lose his onerous contract but the overall shareholders will benefit from the club being run properly and in a manor the fans can back.

[Hildy 0]

It's a lovely article D'Art. "Right on target, so direct..."

 

But as we all know. it won't make a blind bit of difference. Rangers fans seem incapable of unity (you can see the seeds of division even in supposedly supportive replies above)

 

 

Also, even if we were united we'd still be underdogs in the situation where evil asset stripping hedge fund managers and Ashley hold not only every ace but every card in the pack.

 

Our great club, Struth's club, was taken into administration and liquidation and we, those who look into the mirror you speak of, did not even then pick up the scarcely breathing body. That was our fatal error and a disastrous dereliction of duty. We became Leeds and Portsmouth like at that moment. Sent to Coventry (or Northampton) as it were.

 

The second, third and fourth biggest supported clubs in Scotland all would have fought, legally and illegally,to save their club in its time of utter crisis. They would have mobilised and fought back. Despite Timmy Thomson's view of our "fearsome reputation", we didn't, one or two ineffectual afternoons apart. Why do you think we will now?

 

As I say, it is well written and nicely put - but in the grand scheme of things isn't it just self indulgent hot air*, like a guy in a bar spouting off re government policies on the economy and how they should really not keep screwing the poor and stop protecting the rich. Yes, of course, we all mutter as we order our next drinks and go back home eventually having done f@ck all?

 

* Sorry, I do enjoy your "set-pieces", I wanted to praise not criticise, but you are just preaching to the converted and powerless. It is all just...well, bubbles in the air and not celebratory ones.

 

PS None of the schemes described as "great " are having any impact whatsoever. A "great" fan ownership scheme would have, or would have a chance of, delivering fan ownership. None of ours do, and endless cheer leading of one over the other (however disguised in the opening sentences) is just more pissing in the wind. I admire the work people do I have/still am contributed to RST/RF/BR but I have absolutely no hope that they will ever have an effect or influence.

 

That's not a reflection on those involved (their bickering aside, but then that's just internet babble, it's meaningless in the real world of influence and control) some of whom are admirable - but all seem blinkered into thinking they are achieving something. They (we) simply are not - nor do we show the slightest signs that we ever will.

During the last few years, there was one moment when there was cause for optimism. The RST's SaveRangers campaign hit around £13m in pledges, and then what happened?

 

The club came out with the RFFF - amongst the biggest pieces of garbage ever to come from the club - and suddenly all was lost when fans were conned into believing they had hope.

 

That was the moment when things, potentially, could have been utterly transformed, but instead we almost burst the net with the spectacular own goal that was the RFFF.

 

A moment like that may never come around again.

[buster. 4,808]

if enough of us can get together and demad the best for the club and make it clear we will only fund the best then we can win the immediate war.

 

sure ashley may lose his onerous contract but the overall shareholders will benefit from the club being run properly and in a manor the fans can back.

 

Yes, but there are obvious difficulties with this aswell regards a reasonably unified and effective action.

It seems as though the same problem or faultline runs through the fanbase whether it be for the more immediate or the longerterm.

 

You have to say that if the support can't see the bigger picture for surrounding noise and squabbles within and make moves accordingly, then there is little hope of achieveing anything beyond that.

 

That may sound negative but it's where we are.

 

I don't have the answers and am myself opinionated regards the ongoing situation, but efforts need to be made in an attempt to seriously address the division, so as to give us at least a chance going forward for both the short and long term.

[D'Artagnan 173]

It's a lovely article D'Art. "Right on target, so direct..."

 

But as we all know. it won't make a blind bit of difference. Rangers fans seem incapable of unity (you can see the seeds of division even in supposedly supportive replies above)

 

 

Also, even if we were united we'd still be underdogs in the situation where evil asset stripping hedge fund managers and Ashley hold not only every ace but every card in the pack.

 

Our great club, Struth's club, was taken into administration and liquidation and we, those who look into the mirror you speak of, did not even then pick up the scarcely breathing body. That was our fatal error and a disastrous dereliction of duty. We became Leeds and Portsmouth like at that moment. Sent to Coventry (or Northampton) as it were.

 

The second, third and fourth biggest supported clubs in Scotland all would have fought, legally and illegally,to save their club in its time of utter crises. They would have mobilised and fought back. Despite Timmy Thomson's view of our "fearsome reputation", we didn't, one or two ineffectual afternoons apart. Why do you think we will now?

 

As I say, it is well written and nicely put - but in the grand scheme of things isn't it just self indulgent hot air*, like a guy in a bar spouting off re government policies on the economy and how they should really not keep screwing the poor and stop protecting the rich. Yes, of course, we all mutter as we order our next drinks and go back home eventually having done f@ck all?

 

* Sorry, I do enjoy your "set-pieces", I wanted to praise not criticise, but you are just preaching to the converted and powerless. It is all just...well, bubbles in the air and not celebratory ones.

 

PS None of the schemes described as "great " are having any impact whatsoever. A "great" fan ownership scheme would have, or would have a chance of, delivering fan ownership. None of ours do, and endless cheer leading of one over the other (however disguised in the opening sentences) is just more pissing in the wind. I admire the work people do I have/still am contributed to RST/RF/BR but I have absolutely no hope that they will ever have an effect or influence.

 

That's not a reflection on those involved (their bickering aside, but then that's just internet babble, it's meaningless in the real world of influence and control) some of whom are admirable - but all seem blinkered into thinking they are achieving something. They (we) simply are not - nor do we show the slightest signs that we ever will.

 

As I said Steve Im under no illusions and much of that piece was directed at those who still view FO as an alien concept, and to start the ball rolling on a debate where our support examines who can be best trusted to safeguard our club and to serve the interests of the club, rather than others.

 

I understand what you are saying re the problems of unity and note what you have said regarding this thread and the comments themselves. Can we really achieve some measure of FO without some measure of compromise on all sides ? Isnt that a better advert for FO - that the groups can work together constructively to safeguard our club from further exploitation ? Wouldnt that remove some of the scepticism out there that FO is a workable solution for our club ?

 

Thats doesnt mean to say any of them need to abandon their original aims and objectives - those can still be pursued and those signing up to same can choose the particular model which best suits their own beliefs.

[Hildy 0]

As I said Steve Im under no illusions and much of that piece was directed at those who still view FO as an alien concept' date=' and to start the ball rolling on a debate where our support examines who can be best trusted to safeguard our club and to serve the interests of the club, rather than others.

 

I understand what you are saying re the problems of unity and note what you have said regarding this thread and the comments themselves. Can we really achieve some measure of FO without some measure of compromise on all sides ? Isnt that a better advert for FO - that the groups can work together constructively to safeguard our club from further exploitation ? Wouldnt that remove some of the scepticism out there that FO is a workable solution for our club ?

 

Thats doesnt mean to say any of them need to abandon their original aims and objectives - those can still be pursued and those signing up to same can choose the particular model which best suits their own beliefs.[/quote']

What is the aim of the Vanguard share-buying scheme and why does it feel the need to go its own way?

[D'Artagnan 173]

What is the aim of the Vanguard share-buying scheme and why does it feel the need to go its own way?

 

You'd need to ask them Hildy - I genuinely dont know.