Frankie 8,199 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 Serious question Frankie; what's tricky about it? Is it just the nomenclature? In the post above Bill used the term "torrent of crap" which Gonzo seems to have agreed with. Perhaps Bill or Gonzo will expand on their concern(s) with this. Not knowing what the correct term is to describe someone seems to me a fairly low barrier to understanding the issues people face though. Perhaps Bill and Gonzo's response to this is exactly why the club should be getting involved. Nomenclature for sure but with 70 odd genders, I don't blame people for being confused or even cynical. Until you interact with some of these different genders it can be difficult to understand and appreciate their outlook. To me we're all Jock Tamson's bairns so I don't care much either way but if such folk are suffering from prejudice due to their personal choices then I'm happy for our club to do one small thing to try and show they'd be welcome at Ibrox. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darthter 542 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 it's a PR stunt, nothing more. The players will wear special fancy coloured laces for one game, then go back to their normal fancy coloured laces. As for the multitude of genders.....genetics tell us there are only 2 genders, end of story. If folk want to "muddy the waters" of science & attach different labels to each other, then so be it but just because someone decides they want to wear certain clothes that doesn't mean they are defining a whole new gender. IMHO, the more labels folk put out there, the more division is created. We all "sh*t in the same pot", folk just need to accept that & move on. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Jaws 570 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 (edited) it's a PR stunt, nothing more. The players will wear special fancy coloured laces for one game, then go back to their normal fancy coloured laces. As for the multitude of genders.....genetics tell us there are only 2 genders, end of story. If folk want to "muddy the waters" of science & attach different labels to each other, then so be it but just because someone decides they want to wear certain clothes that doesn't mean they are defining a whole new gender. IMHO, the more labels folk put out there, the more division is created. We all "sh*t in the same pot", folk just need to accept that & move on. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but on this one you are completely wrong. First of all gender is a social construct and there are arguments which suggest certain gender traits can be discussed in terms of learned behaviours. What I believe you were attempting to say was that 'sex' or rather 'biological sex' was binary and even if that is what you were trying to say then you are wrong in the assumption too. The reason why you are wrong is because biology and the science of genetics has shown us that 'biological sex' is NOT in fact binary. That is, there are males, there are females and there are any number of permutations and combinations in between. These cases are normally referred to in official circles as inter sexed. The recent high profile case of the South African runner Caster Semenya who has a condition known as hyperandrogenism had this issue at its core as she is inter sexed. The argument was whether or not she was a biological female or not because she has testosterone levels three times the normal level found in women and approaching those of a man. Furthermore, she has no womb or ovaries, and instead, owing to a chromosomal abnormality, internal testes. These internal testes are what gives her her masculine appearance. Through rigorous testing much of which was invasive and regardless of how she might look she is technically and to the letter of the law a biological female. As far as her gender is concerned she identifies as a woman, her sexuality is that of a gay woman. Taken in the context the OP adding in your post there is quite clearly nothing straight forward in the slightest about any of this at all! Edited November 14, 2017 by Big Jaws 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonzo79 13,875 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 You refer to a "chromosomal abnormality" there, Big Jaws. That's quite an offensive and archaic way to refer to non-binary humans and their inner workings. Next week I will be identifying as a Persian hermaphrodite, with webbed feet and three nipples and look forward to the day footballers wear something which includes me. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ascender 352 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 In my spare time I organise events and there's been a move recently by similar events to ours to embrace this LGBT charter and publish it on our website. The problem I have with this is that it suggests a change in ethos from us and suddenly we're "welcoming all", or that there was an issue before. Thing is, everyone has always been welcome, we wouldn't discriminate in any way and if we found anybody connected with the race or even participating in the race behaving in any way contradictory to this, they'd be booted out. I like to think that the way we conduct ourselves in public and the feedback posted online about our events would mean any one with concerns could feel happy to contact us. So sometimes stuff like this can be seen as an admission that there was a problem before. I've definitely seen responses in our industry which seem like people jumping on the latest PC and fashionable bandwagon. Regardless of why organisations sign up to show support of this sort of thing, should we care? I don't think anybody would argue that the intentions of this movement aren't anything but well meaning and positive. Anyway, long winded way to come round to the fact that I guess football is a bit different in terms of its historic attitudes and culture when it comes to anybody who is "different", so I think its a good thing for the club to be proactively involved in. PR apart, anything which encourages a feeling of inclusivity and people being welcome at Irbox has to be a good thing? It would also be nice for the club to get some credit for this as I've seen many a post online and had chats in pubs with people from all sorts of ethnic background who love following the Gers, but sadly the media hardly ever choose to cover this really positive story. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 2,499 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 I just wish the match against Aberdeen was more important than what colour of laces the players are wearing. Fine to have so sort things during training but on match day all attention should be on the match and not stupid laces. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinker 887 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 The point isn't the ever-expanding categorisation (or non-categorisation - whatever) of genders. It's that folk should be able to enjoy playing and watching football regardless of that aspect of their identity. They should be able to do so without getting hassled or verbally abused. What's controversial about that? And I'm happy to tell the kids in my family that they shouldn't give people grief for looking or behaving differently. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnMc 2,517 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 This isn't about "celebrating" anything, it's about saying to some people who might feel marginalised or that they have to hide who they are shouldn't be scared or nervous about coming to watch Rangers. If your son or daughter asks about the rainbow laces (and, frankly, your kids will already know about them and will probably explain them to you) it's not a difficult conversation to have. It's about saying everyone is welcome, there isn't anymore to explain than that. There are almost certainly homosexuals in the current Rangers squad, but they haven't come out. I'd be astonished if the Rangers women's side doesn't have some lesbian players too. These people exist, they are part of our communities, they're your son or daughter, nephew, they are someone at work. I went to school in the 70s and 80s and if someone had come out as gay at my secondary I genuinely worry they'd have been kicked to death. I can remember guys who got a terrible time at school because there was just something a wee bit different about them. Isn't it better now? All this being hung up on genders and fluidity, where does it mention any of that in the story? It's not about whether you think men can become women or the reverse, it's about whether someone should feel safe and comfortable being themselves at a Rangers match. The very fact that we're even discussing this on Gersnet is proof that campaigns like this are needed and can work. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 Think the club are caught in the bandwagon of being politically correct although I have no objection to it,just don't ram it down our throats.BTW I have a "gay" nephew who's mother tried to hide it from my wife and I,but as we already knew it was a bit annoying on her part. Why the quotation marks around the word gay ? This whole transgerder, transsexual thing has me flummoxed - I simply can't keep up. The nomenclature has me scratching my head. Read something yesterday about a teacher being suspended for calling a transsexual boy a girl - as I said, I cant keep up. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darthter 542 Posted November 14, 2017 Share Posted November 14, 2017 Read something yesterday about a teacher being suspended for calling a transsexual boy a girl - as I said, I cant keep up. IMHO, that's what happens when there are sooooo many labels being attached - it's far to "easy" to offend someone by using the wrong label/term. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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