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Wind Energy - not always what it seems


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22 minutes ago, Scott7 said:

On the contrary. Unionists I know see ourselves as the true Scots. The hard workers, the inventors, the developers, the engineers, the investors, the innovators, the scientists the core of the civil and foreign services and the army. And we do look down our noses, not at the thought of being Scottish but at the bleaters, moaners, whiners and poseurs who have their own restricted, resentful view of what being Scottish is.

"True Scots" you say...but are happy to live under the governance of another Country!!!  Happy to have virtually no say in a seemingly "equal" union of nations - a Union that is dominated by 1 member state.  Happy to be part of a Union where one member country has to seek permission from the dominant member before it can vote on it's self determination.

 

Surely a "True Scot" would be proud of their country, of its successes & would be happy to see such a well loved & respected nation worldwide, take it's own place on the World stage.  To be recognised directly for "The hard workers, the inventors, the developers, the engineers, the investors, the innovators, the scientists the core of the civil and foreign services and the army" that SCOTLAND, not the UK has produced.

 

Scotland is being held back by the Union.....we are big enough, smart enough & rich enough to stand on our own 2 feet.  We should be able to make our own mistakes, not bear the fallout from others mistakes.

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4 minutes ago, Darthter said:

"True Scots" you say...but are happy to live under the governance of another Country!!!  Happy to have virtually no say in a seemingly "equal" union of nations - a Union that is dominated by 1 member state.  Happy to be part of a Union where one member country has to seek permission from the dominant member before it can vote on it's self determination.

 

Surely a "True Scot" would be proud of their country, of its successes & would be happy to see such a well loved & respected nation worldwide, take it's own place on the World stage.  To be recognised directly for "The hard workers, the inventors, the developers, the engineers, the investors, the innovators, the scientists the core of the civil and foreign services and the army" that SCOTLAND, not the UK has produced.

 

Scotland is being held back by the Union.....we are big enough, smart enough & rich enough to stand on our own 2 feet.  We should be able to make our own mistakes, not bear the fallout from others mistakes.

The norm is for a country to want political power to represent what their people vote for and I'd agree with this.

 

However, there was a referendum in Scotland, the people voted otherwise and you have to ask why, then address the issues before expecting a different result further down the line.

 

The impression I get from afar is that there are a lot of of Scots who look at the SNP as a political party and simply don't trust them to be able to govern the country with the necessary competence and responsibility. For me, this is the biggest issue that those who want Independence currently face.

 

The next few years are looking like being turbulent and circumstances may well change to the point of forcing another referendum but bottomline, it'll come down to the same question. However, it's very possible that levels of trust in Westminster may well fall significantly in a race to the bottom.

 

 

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50 minutes ago, Scott7 said:

Unionists I know see ourselves as the true Scots. The hard workers, the inventors, the developers, the engineers, the investors, the innovators, the scientists the core of the civil and foreign services and the army. And we do look down our noses, not at the thought of being Scottish but at the bleaters, moaners, whiners and poseurs who have their own restricted, resentful view of what being Scottish is.

Well said.  

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2 minutes ago, buster. said:

The norm is for a country to want political power to represent what their people vote for and I'd agree with this.

 

However, there was a referendum in Scotland, the people voted otherwise and you have to ask why, then address the issues before expecting a different result further down the line.

 

The impression I get from afar is that there are a lot of of Scots who look at the SNP as a political party and simply don't trust them to be able to govern the country with the necessary competence and responsibility. For me, this is the biggest issue that those who want Independence currently face.

 

The next few years are looking like being turbulent and circumstances may well change to the point of forcing another referendum but bottomline, it'll come down to the same question. However, it's very possible that levels of trust in Westminster may well fall significantly in a race to the bottom.

 

 

Totally agree with the comment in bold.  If the issues/concerns are not addressed, then any new vote will fail again.

 

The main problem is the wave upon wave of negative media coverage that comes from UK-centric media sources - AKA Project Fear.  in 2014 there was no was to combat that.  The population were told all sorts of horror stories about what would happen to international business/trade if we left.  People would lose their pensions & savings etc.  However, with the Brexit decision, all these issues were raised again, but instead of resulting in certain doom & armageddon, they were rolled out as positive - and many of the Scottish population have seen this & questioned it.

 

WM's handing over Brexit (something that 62% of Scottish voters rejected), have indeed shown many a glimpse of WM's true allegiances & goals and how utterly useless it is as a functional Govt.  The blatant ignoring of the devolved nations is clear for all.

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6 minutes ago, Darthter said:

Totally agree with the comment in bold.  If the issues/concerns are not addressed, then any new vote will fail again.

 

The main problem is the wave upon wave of negative media coverage that comes from UK-centric media sources - AKA Project Fear.  in 2014 there was no was to combat that.  The population were told all sorts of horror stories about what would happen to international business/trade if we left.  People would lose their pensions & savings etc.  However, with the Brexit decision, all these issues were raised again, but instead of resulting in certain doom & armageddon, they were rolled out as positive - and many of the Scottish population have seen this & questioned it.

 

WM's handing over Brexit (something that 62% of Scottish voters rejected), have indeed shown many a glimpse of WM's true allegiances & goals and how utterly useless it is as a functional Govt.  The blatant ignoring of the devolved nations is clear for all.

IMO the main problem was a lack of trust.

 

The negative media coverage you speak of certainly fueled that, but when you saw the oil price bomb not that long after the referendum, it's shooty-in for dissing the economics, which are the bottomline for the majority.

 

The concept is sound but currently it seems difficult to find political parties anywhere that inspire trust.

 

 

What was it that was attempted 413 years ago today ?...;)3

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3 hours ago, Darthter said:

Strange then that the vast majority of UK/British Nationalists (that I've come into contact with), look down their noses at the thought of being Scottish - to many it's an embarrassment & the thought of displaying a Scottish flag or outwardly promoting Scotland makes the shudder.

 

It's also funny how the term Nationalist is only used to describe someone who is proud to be Scottish (& apparently only in a negative manner), yet doesn't seem to apply to someone who is proud to be from the UK???  Nationalism can be applied to anyone who is proud of the Country they are from or live in.

 

And I'm still waiting to hear what is soooo good about being part of the "United" Kingdom???

Absolute nonsense.

They look down their nose at those loonies waving the Scottish flag about whilst having a glaiket and angry look in their eyes.

95% of those for the Union I know are proud to be Scottish, but not proud of those who bleat about Nationlism.

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1 hour ago, Darthter said:

"True Scots" you say...but are happy to live under the governance of another Country!!!  Happy to have virtually no say in a seemingly "equal" union of nations - a Union that is dominated by 1 member state.  Happy to be part of a Union where one member country has to seek permission from the dominant member before it can vote on it's self determination.

 

Surely a "True Scot" would be proud of their country, of its successes & would be happy to see such a well loved & respected nation worldwide, take it's own place on the World stage.  To be recognised directly for "The hard workers, the inventors, the developers, the engineers, the investors, the innovators, the scientists the core of the civil and foreign services and the army" that SCOTLAND, not the UK has produced.

 

Scotland is being held back by the Union.....we are big enough, smart enough & rich enough to stand on our own 2 feet.  We should be able to make our own mistakes, not bear the fallout from others mistakes.

Who cares? Are you that egotistic that you cannot bear the thought of the U.K. being given any credit?

 

For me, the advantages of being in the union outweigh the advantages of removing ourselves and I’m not that bothered about “standing alone”. I’d rather be more comfortable being part of the U.K. than being poorer and being able to say we aren’t part of the Union.

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Oppressed, victimised, downtrodden, disenfranchised ... the endless lexicon of nationalist self-pity. Pretty soon they'll have ousted all these contrived grievances from their predecessors in feeling sorry for themselves, the socialists. What a pathetic way to view the world.

Edited by Bill
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3 minutes ago, StuGers said:

Who cares? Are you that egotistic that you cannot bear the thought of the U.K. being given any credit?

 

For me, the advantages of being in the union outweigh the advantages of removing ourselves and I’m not that bothered about “standing alone”. I’d rather be more comfortable being part of the U.K. than being poorer and being able to say we aren’t part of the Union.

So, you quite happy for WM to run up MASSIVE bills on projects that have absolutely no significance or benefit to Scotland, but still have Scotland pay a share of that bill???

Scotland generates more than enough revenue to stand on it's own 2 feet - why would you be poorer when WM spending is removed from the equation???  Que the comments about Scotlands financial black hole, massive deficit & huge amount of debt.  The truth is that Scotland spends within it's budget - we send nearly £60bn a year to WM & receive about £30bn back.  An Independent Scotland would then need to spend in order to run the Social security system & defence etc (those things that WM run from the revenue that they retain).  However, what we wouldn't have to pay for is WM spending on England-only projects - as approved under EVEL regulations.  Remember, Scotland has a cap on it's borrowing of £3bn (in total, not per year).

 

So, If the Scot Govt are running a country on a total budget of about £40bn (total approximation, assuming some borrowing & direct tax income), and we generate nearly £60bn....why would we be poorer???

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1 hour ago, Darthter said:

So, you quite happy for WM to run up MASSIVE bills on projects that have absolutely no significance or benefit to Scotland, but still have Scotland pay a share of that bill???

Scotland generates more than enough revenue to stand on it's own 2 feet - why would you be poorer when WM spending is removed from the equation???  Que the comments about Scotlands financial black hole, massive deficit & huge amount of debt.  The truth is that Scotland spends within it's budget - we send nearly £60bn a year to WM & receive about £30bn back.  An Independent Scotland would then need to spend in order to run the Social security system & defence etc (those things that WM run from the revenue that they retain).  However, what we wouldn't have to pay for is WM spending on England-only projects - as approved under EVEL regulations.  Remember, Scotland has a cap on it's borrowing of £3bn (in total, not per year).

 

So, If the Scot Govt are running a country on a total budget of about £40bn (total approximation, assuming some borrowing & direct tax income), and we generate nearly £60bn....why would we be poorer???

Yes, it goes both ways.

 

All the figures are fantastic and hypothetical but I beleive that if Scotland was to break away, the amount of money we generate would drop significantly and the amount of money needed to rebuild the ashes would be significant.

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