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28 minutes ago, alexscottislegend said:

Regardless of Left or Right stances I cannot recall such a bunch of charlatans, incompetents or liars as the present incumbents (Starmer and Rayner equally). God knows I hated what Thatcher stood for but even I had a (grudging) respect for her and her principles; the current lot I have not one iota of respect for.

You are so right

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1 hour ago, buster. said:

Can't agree, or at least not to the same extent. Never seen a politician (Corbyn) under various, but always constant, campaigns to discredit him over such a long time period.

 

Farage is the only one on the right that I can think of who reached a position to significantly influence major events and got a lot of negative attention. A lot came from scared Tories.

 

 

Farage was attacked by lefties on the campaign trail, some labour types wouldnt share a platform with him and he was also followed to his local as well as the usual MSM negative attacks - especially the so called impartial state broadcaster. Corbyn was attacked in the media for his stance/non stance on Brexit, re-nationalisaition, anti semitism and his open backing of terrorist organisations. 

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1 hour ago, alexscottislegend said:

Do you foresee a role for humans in this Brave New World? Driverless cars may come in too...

I think it will be a while before the average person can afford one of those. The vast majority cannot afford a nearly new car, let alone a electric one and a driverless is pie in the sky!! 

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3 hours ago, buster. said:

Anyone that is really on the left and becomes a real threat to the status quo, eg. Corbyn, gets absolutely slaughtered and continuously discredited with mostly lies.

He did get slaughtered by the press.

 

I don't remember any lies though.

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3 hours ago, Gonzo79 said:

With economic problems on the horizon, perhaps the very recent French vote gives an indication of how things might go (the general populace lurching back towards socialism and nationalism).

A very good point.

 

We should think really carefully before taking any course of action that could exacerbate the economic difficulties ahead.

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1 hour ago, ChelseaBoy said:

Blimey, ASIL open that bottle you have been saving for the last few years :) :) 

Just setting him up for a fall 😂

(just joking asil)

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12 hours ago, Bill said:

Funny how this inevitably gets bogged down in a show of political credentials.  The strikes are clearly orchestrated to avoid or significantly delay productivity improvements, while hamstringing the govt for the next year or so in concert with other unions. Faults on all sides but this is definitely not in the country’s interest. 

40 years of collective bargaining/power getting watered down parrallel to the reduction of the real wage whilst money flows ever faster to the already wealthy. Not enough, they want more.

 

What is in the country's interest ?....who is the country ?

 

How dare people want more, they should get less and pay more. 

How else will the wealthy hit their targets and top up their off shore accounts.

 

Unions should be disbanded, it should be individual bargaining...."Can I have some more please, sir"

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23 minutes ago, buster. said:

40 years of collective bargaining/power getting watered down parrallel to the reduction of the real wage whilst money flows ever faster to the already wealthy. Not enough, they want more.

 

What is in the country's interest ?....who is the country ?

 

How dare people want more, they should get less and pay more. 

How else will the wealthy hit their targets and top up their off shore accounts.

 

Unions should be disbanded, it should be individual bargaining...."Can I have some more please, sir"

No need to get hysterical. All I said was that bargaining doesn’t mean demanding, it means both give and take, more money in return for more productivity. I’m all for them filling their boots on that basis. Unfortunately the unions want the money but aren’t willing to accept the productivity improvements that go with it.

 

The individual should always be able to earn more but it is impossible for the collective workforce to cost the business more unless the productivity gain is correspondingly high. That’s s a myth that can only exist in the public sector. In the real world it’s not about emotions or “fairness”. In the end it’s simple arithmetic.

 

All this guff about fat cats is just a way of hiding from reality and indulging in tribal politics.

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17 minutes ago, Bill said:

No need to get hysterical. All I said was that bargaining doesn’t mean demanding, it means both give and take, more money in return for more productivity. I’m all for them filling their boots on that basis. Unfortunately the unions want the money but aren’t willing to accept the productivity improvements that go with it.

 

The individual should always be able to earn more but it is impossible for the collective workforce to cost the business more unless the productivity gain is correspondingly high. That’s s a myth that can only exist in the public sector. In the real world it’s not about emotions or “fairness”. In the end it’s simple arithmetic.

 

All this guff about fat cats is just a way of hiding from reality and indulging in tribal politics.

After 40 years of mostly give, some take is long overdue.

 

Regards money flows,...It isn't guff, it is reallity and it underpins the whole system.

 

To say it is guff, is what is actually guff.

 

 

As for tribal politics, it takes two to tango.

 

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