No Need For A Rant This Week

[Totti 0]

The fact we're not far off bankruptcy after he overspent on shite like McCulloch, Lafferty, Whittaker and Miller suggests the damage is slightly more significant than you believe.

 

I'm not denying results are the most important factor. But the manner in which you win games suggests the long term success of the team. As I've said already, negatively scraping through games might get you points today but it won't tomorrow.

 

the long term approach to a winning side requires an organised and creative nature. This isn't just about 'style'. It's about simply being 'good'. We'd all love to see one touch football but that's not what we're bothered about. We're bothered about the fact we have a side that can barely pass the ball about, never mind style.

 

Again you bring up being 2 points off Celtic as some sort of positive. If Celtic had a better manager they'd be out of sight.

Edited December 2, 2009 by Totti

[craig 5,199]

This season is shaping up, for me at least, to be a replica of the one two seasons ago.

 

We can go on all day about fixture congestion costing us the league that year but the simple truth is that we were so bereft of flair and creativity that it were these failings that saw us drop many points in the last 4 months of the league - we had no flair and no creativity which meant that when we couldn't just use physical force to beat teams we were screwed.

 

I can see what Cal is saying, at the end of the day you can only beat what is put in front of you BUT... and it is a big but.... Celtic are in a much stronger position to strengthen in January than we are (thankfully Monkey heid seems to be pretty poor in that dept) and if we arent being fearful of that then we are, in my opinion, being naive.

 

I guess you would probably be technically correct cal in saying that he hasnt done any irreparable damage as unless we fold then it isnt irreparable - but he most certainly has contributed to the current financial crisis of the club as well as the malaise there seems to be in the squad. The money he has spent doesn't seem to have been well spent, for the most part. Sure we have Bougherra as a sellable asset but most of his other signings we wouldn't be able to get anywhere near what was spent on them.

[calscot 0]

The fact we're not far off bankruptcy after he overspent on shite like McCulloch, Lafferty, Whittaker and Miller suggests the damage is slightly more significant than you believe.

 

You don't think the fact that was a year and a half ago and the fact he has no more money to spend sort of makes it irrelevant to current criticisms? How will keeping him to the end of the season without money to spend cause more damage?

 

In any case my view is that the manager is in charge of the team and has to work within his budget. He does not set the budget or involved himself directly in the finances of the club. His net spend has been about 6M since he came back to the club and so I don't think he is directly responsible for our financial plight.

 

I'm not denying results are the most important factor. But the manner in which you win games suggests the long term success of the team. As I've said already, negatively scraping through games might get you points today but it won't tomorrow.

 

Yes but have people not being saying that since Walter came back? Since then he's reduced a 17 deficit by 9 points, very narrowly lost the league due to a fixture pile up which came about due to our success in the two cups, a run to the UEFA final, bad weather and the cheating of our rivals.

 

He then won the double and narrowly lost the League cup final. He's now in the semi of that cup and potentially top of the league.

 

Just when is this poor run going to kick in? Since coming back, Walter has had better results than any Scottish based manager in all three domestic competitions as well as the UEFA cup, where are the poor results you are predicting? They are taking a long time in coming and the evidence has piled up against you.

 

People have been calling me some kind of blind Walterite, but when you look at those cold hard facts, it's very difficult to agree with what you're saying when reality does not match up.

 

Like I said, once he's failed as spectacularly as you predict then you point will make sense, but let's have innocent until proven guilty instead of conviction on the basis of subjective prediction. Do we really want to go down the route of the Minority Report?

 

the long term approach to a winning side requires an organised and creative nature. This isn't just about 'style'. It's about simply being 'good'. We'd all love to see one touch football but that's not what we're bothered about. We're bothered about the fact we have a side that can barely pass the ball about, never mind style.

 

Smith has had a consistently winning side for three years, he had another for about 8 years, seems like he is doing something right long term. His worst offences domestically are losing the league twice by a maximum of 3 points and "not winning" less than half the cups.

 

I would say that kind of long term consistency is more a predictor of long term success than playing "good" football (which is highly debatable) while going 17pts behind in half a season and out of both cups. The guy who achieved the latter is apparently your preferred champion.

 

There are plenty of people who thought 2-3-5 was the be all end all of football, until 4-3-3 took over and then England won the world cup with 4-4-2.

 

Brazil have lost World cups playing great football and Italy have won using negative tactics. There is a lot more to winning than how nicely you play the game.

 

I think it's best to judge a manager on his actual results than his points for grace and style.

[calscot 0]

I think the fact that Celtic can strengthen in January while we can't should have us worried no matter which manager we have in place. I don't think changing the manager in January is going to nullify that.

 

However, you do quite often have a lift in a team with a new manager - but PLG, Burley and Mowbray showed that isn't always the case.

[Totti 0]

When Italy win trophies they do so with impecable organisation and creativity on the break.

 

We on the other hand are a disorganised cluster of pish.

 

You keep making the same points without listening to any of my logic. I'm not just talking about style, I'm simply talking about being good.

 

There's no getting through to some morons.

 

Again you talk about his domestic performance as a measure of success. YOU CANNOT DO THAT WITH HOW PISH CELTIC HAVE BECOME.

Edited December 2, 2009 by Totti

[calscot 0]

When Italy win trophies they do so with impecable organisation and creativity on the break.

 

We on the other hand are a disorganised cluster of pish.

 

I was comparing Italy to Brazil, you are now comparing Italy with us, I think your relevance is lost. The point is that if we're a disorganised cluster of pish, it still seems to work.

 

You keep making the same points without listening to any of my logic. I'm not just talking about style, I'm simply talking about being good.

 

I making the same points as you are not acknowledging them while repeating stuff that avoids the issues of those points. To be logical, you're arguments should take into account our current run of domestic success. The more you ignore it and continue with empty rhetoric, the more you logic becomes conspicuous by the absence of the facts.

 

There's no getting through to some morons.

 

It must have taken you a bit or courage to admit that, but maybe you're being a bit hard on yourself. Self castigation isn't going to help your debate.

 

Again you talk about his domestic performance as a measure of success. YOU CANNOT DO THAT WITH HOW PISH CELTIC HAVE BECOME.

 

I think I've dealt with that supposition on another thread where you chose again not to acknowledge my points. It's true, but it's a bit of a coincidence is it not? That and the fact no other club has come forward to take advantage.

 

To me it's a symptom of the league as a whole. We're all pish, but the prizes go to the least pish - overall, that's been us. The question is, can a different manager make us "good" with the current situation? I can't see it.

 

I think at the moment it's better the devil you know - the one that at least keeps us competing at the top of whatever pile of shite we're stuck with.

[Norris Cole 0]

Results are the most important factors in football. Style is a bonus but I think you'll find most people preferring winning championships and trophies in a scrappy way than playing great football while lagging 17pts behind halfway through the season and out of both cups.

 

Seriously, every time you mention "17 points" I think Gersnet should make a donation to charity.

 

If some people wanted more time for a hopeless manager - the worst in our long history, then surely a current double winner who today is 2pts behind in the league with a game in hand and in the semi of the first cup, deserves till the end of the season or till he's miles behind, whichever comes first, to prove his unworthiness?

 

Christ on a bike what next, he knots his ties in a better way than Advocaat?

[Totti 0]

calscot is starting to take over Super_Ally's 'Head in the Sand Champion of gersnet' crown.

[CammyF 6,824]

This thread makes more sense than a rant, so I'll leave the ranting and continue the thread.

 

Winning is everything in football, its what matters. However, when you pay money and watch Rangers (be that via going to games, via TV, via internet etc) you deserve to be entertained. You expect the players representing Rangers to be able to complete the basics of football with no or little effort. You expect your manager and coaching staff to have the team set up in way where all players are playing in their natural positions.

 

You expect the players to be able to retain the ball, you epect them to be able to deliver a corner (or set-piece) without hitting the first defender (or sailing harmlessly past the back post). You have to wonder what we do at Murray Park all day, every day. Going with what we witness on the pitch, it appears we do NOTHING constructive at training.

 

This may come as a surprise, but I believe that we have a decent team - we have some very decent players, but in my opinion, they are not being coached correctly. How else can you explain the lack of creativity, the lack of pace, the lack of determination? The choice of leader is also something the manager MUST take responsibility for. David Weir has had a fantastic career, been a great signing for Rangers and is a great bloke, but he ain't a Rangers captain. There is no leadership on (or off) the pitch - no one to grab the players by the scruff on the neck and get them pulling together.

 

Lastly, WS's statements have become a joke - last season we were faceless and clueless and this season it is our fault that we are out of Europe. WS will have us believe that we demanded attcking football and by giving us what we wanted (BTW I must have blinked and missed the attacking football in Europe) we are now out of Europe. Sorry Walter, the only reason we are out of Europe is that you are clueless when it comes to the CL.

 

As for being 2 points behind Celtc, thats all well and good (well its not really). Lets not forget that this is the worst Celtc start to a season in years - in fact, its worse than John Barnes start to a season - thats how bad they are, thats how bad we are.

 

Some fans may feel that it is OK to be slightly less bad than them - that doesn't wash for me - The Rangers should always strive to be head and shoulders above that lot.

 

As for the lack of finances, the Romanian team that are likely to qualify as 2nd place in our group have spent a tiny % of what we've spent but have been coached correctly. Their most expensive player cost �£350,000 and I'll bet that he isn't on over �£10K per week. WS spent �£3.75M on Kyle Lafferty a player who had scored 6 goals for Burnley.

 

Walter Smith has to go and has to go NOW.

 

Cammy F

[craig 5,199]

calscot is starting to take over Super_Ally's 'Head in the Sand Champion of gersnet' crown.

 

A new award for the end of season awards