Crimson Dynamo 128 Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Presumably Craig Whyte knew all about this 10 million hole at the start of the season and I would presume he would've planned on the Champions League filling it and according to Craig Whyte he has "the best" financial advice. Why would he then be giving Whittaker, Davis and McGregor pay increases and new long term contracts at the start of the season when Champions League football wasn't assured (and this season isn't the only time we have fell at this hurdle) you would think he would have waited until the we were safely in the group stages of the Champions League before doing so. He could also have used it as an incentive "Get us in the Champions League and you'll get your pay rise and a new deal" Who knows doing it this way might have spurred us on that bit extra and we would have got to the Champions League Where also was the money going to come from for Goodwillie and as I understand we still owe Hearts for Wallace. What financial advisor is going to say "yeah! go out and accrue another 5 million pounds worth of debt" It seems he just wanted to put us more and more into debt and that administration was always the plan. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ergatrude 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Well Zappa, I was thinking earlier.. if he has mortgaged off the season tickets to ticketus then this could be where the shortfall is atm? Since it's alleged that he used the ticketus money to paid LBG with £6m to spare then I would assume that £6m (+player fees) has been used to pay for players wages for this season so far which would sound about right as this would then be exasperated by now. I would imagine that the season ticket money would be an extremely substantial amount of money & since we now effectively owe this money to ticketus it becomes, in my head at least, negative equity. Apologies for and incorrect terminology used, I'm not financial-minded. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 Our operating loss (befoe interest, tax and gains on player sales) in 2009 was £17m. If you use that as your starting point then £10m doesn't seem unreasonable. I can see why you suggest comparing that season from a European football point of view given that we went out to Kaunas in the CL qualifiers, but the wage bill for the playing squad MUST have been far far higher that season compared to this season. On top of that, Walter was allowed to spend a small fortune in the summer 2008 transfer window buying 8 new players (Lafferty, Davis, Mendes, Edu, Bougherra, Miller, Velicka & Webster) at a cost of £18m+ while only selling Cuellar, Cousin & Sebo. We did release Darcheville & Burke in January '09, but even still, take a look back at our squad that season and compare it to our current squad: Allan McGregor Maurice Edu David Weir Pedro Mendes Sasa Papac Barry Ferguson Brahim Hemdani Kevin Thomson Kris Boyd Nacho Novo Charlie Adam Lee McCulloch Steven Naismith Alan Gow Graeme Smith Chris Burke Kenny Miller Jean-Claude Darcheville DaMarcus Beasley Kirk Broadfoot Andy Webster Christian Dailly Madjid Bougherra Neil Alexander Steven Smith Kyle Lafferty Steven Whittaker Aarón Niguez Steven Davis Andrius Velicka Rory Loy John Fleck Andrew Little When you consider Walter's transfer market spending and the cost of running that playing squad, do you still think this supposed £10m loss "doesn't seem unreasonable"?? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 So if we are to 'live within our means', how do we manage to breach this amount of money? Our biggest problem has been paying players higher wages than we can afford as well as having too many players in the squad in the past, but those days are rapidly coming to a close. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 Why would he then be giving Whittaker, Davis and McGregor pay increases and new long term contracts at the start of the season when Champions League football wasn't assured (and this season isn't the only time we have fell at this hurdle) you would think he would have waited until the we were safely in the group stages of the Champions League before doing so. It might have been to increase their value in the shop window or increase their contract values for administration, but the latter wouldn't make sense as he had no need to increase their wages so early on when he could have done it in December. My guess is that giving them bumper new deals was either for the shop window or even more likely, yet another mistake on Whyte's part and in all honesty just sheer stupidity. Welcome to the forum btw! 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 Well Zappa, I was thinking earlier.. if he has mortgaged off the season tickets to ticketus then this could be where the shortfall is atm? Since it's alleged that he used the ticketus money to paid LBG with £6m to spare then I would assume that £6m (+player fees) has been used to pay for players wages for this season so far which would sound about right as this would then be exasperated by now. I would imagine that the season ticket money would be an extremely substantial amount of money & since we now effectively owe this money to ticketus it becomes, in my head at least, negative equity. Apologies for and incorrect terminology used, I'm not financial-minded. mmmm... not sure about this mate, so I'll need to defer to one of our financial wizards. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ergatrude 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 I can see why you suggest comparing that season from a European football point of view given that we went out to Kaunas in the CL qualifiers, but the wage bill for the playing squad MUST have been far far higher that season compared to this season. On top of that, Walter was allowed to spend a small fortune in the summer 2008 transfer window buying 8 new players (Lafferty, Davis, Mendes, Edu, Bougherra, Miller, Velicka & Webster) at a cost of £18m+ while only selling Cuellar, Cousin & Sebo. We did release Darcheville & Burke in January '09, but even still, take a look back at our squad that season and compare it to our current squad: Allan McGregor Maurice Edu David Weir Pedro Mendes Sasa Papac Barry Ferguson Brahim Hemdani Kevin Thomson Kris Boyd Nacho Novo Charlie Adam Lee McCulloch Steven Naismith Alan Gow Graeme Smith Chris Burke Kenny Miller Jean-Claude Darcheville DaMarcus Beasley Kirk Broadfoot Andy Webster Christian Dailly Madjid Bougherra Neil Alexander Steven Smith Kyle Lafferty Steven Whittaker Aarón Niguez Steven Davis Andrius Velicka Rory Loy John Fleck Andrew Little When you consider Walter's transfer market spending and the cost of running that playing squad, do you still think this supposed £10m loss "doesn't seem unreasonable"?? Strange as it sounds.. I look at that squad and think it is so weak. If I started a game of FM with that team I would sell/release most & use youth players. Just aswell I'm not a manager then isn't it? Since that team won the league 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 Strange as it sounds.. I look at that squad and think it is so weak. It's a hell of a lot stronger than what we have now! I'll draw up a direct comparison of that squad and the current one side by side. Should be interesting, but probably a bit depressing too. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluebear54 0 Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Our biggest problem has been paying players higher wages than we can afford as well as having too many players in the squad in the past, but those days are rapidly coming to a close. Don't forget the the other parameter which is that Auchenhowie costa a lot to run, and. I don't think it has ever fulfilled it's real economic/player skill potential. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrahimHemdani 1 Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Well Zappa, I was thinking earlier.. if he has mortgaged off the season tickets to ticketus then this could be where the shortfall is atm? Since it's alleged that he used the ticketus money to paid LBG with £6m to spare then I would assume that £6m (+player fees) has been used to pay for players wages for this season so far which would sound about right as this would then be exasperated by now. I would imagine that the season ticket money would be an extremely substantial amount of money & since we now effectively owe this money to ticketus it becomes, in my head at least, negative equity. Apologies for and incorrect terminology used, I'm not financial-minded. The shortfall simply expressed is current income (this year's season ticket money, match day sales, commercial income (corporate boxes, TV etc) less current expenditure (mainly wages and maintenance costs). With the size of player squad we have and their wages we need European income to balance the books. The shortfall is not created by selling the next three year's season tickets to Ticketus but it might have been covered by it (although that would have been anything but prudent) except for the fact that it was mainly used to pay off LBG as you say. Out of the £6.4M (£24.4 - £18.0) £4.1M is VAT on the tickets and the next big question is has that been paid? Hope this helps. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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