Big Jock Knew?

[ian1964 10,428]

by Bill McMurdo

 

 

I donâ??t know if Big Jock knew.

 

But I knew Big Jock.

 

I was just a young boy working in my fatherâ??s office on Union Street in Glasgow. We ran lotteries for the SFA and Hampden Park Fund. Big Jock was pally with my dad and would sometimes pop in for a cuppa and a blether.

 

He was an absolute gentleman. Even though I was a Rangers fanatic I had the utmost respect for Mr Stein. He had no airs or graces and was polite to the point of being deferential. If he had a big ego he hid it very well.

 

I often used to bristle at the â??Big Jock knewâ? jibes because I knew him as a thoroughly decent man. Of course, these jibes are not really a slight on Jock Steinâ??s character, more of a commentary on the cover-up at Celtic Park in reference to the notorious child abuse controversy that engulfed Celtic Football Club.

 

The infamy surrounding Jim Torbett and his involvement with Celtic Football Club is quite far back in time now; however, it is a convenient rod for Rangers fans to beat their Celtic counterparts with.

 

It has been brought sharply back into focus, though, with the massive media coverage of the Jerry Sandusky affair in America.

 

Sandusky was the assistant coach of the Penn State American Football team, and he has been found guilty of tampering with young boys whilst as their coach. The head coach of the team knew about it, as did other officials in the team. Because of this, Penn State have been banned from competition for 4 years, been fined $60 million & stripped of 11 titles between 1998 & 2011.

 

With all the talk of stripping titles away from Rangers because of alleged book-keeping indiscretions, this story brings a fresh perspective. One could argue that if the football authorities in Scotland were as rigorous at applying punishments to teams where child abuse took place under their auspices as they were at seeking to punish teams who paid players off-book, we might not be speaking of Celticâ??s nine-in-a-row years.

 

That might be ridiculous in Scottish football. Thankfully, it isnâ??t so in America Football.

 

For the record, I might incur the wrath of some fellow bluenoses by saying this but I do not think Celtic should have been shorn of titles because of Jim Torbett.

 

Nor do I think IF Big Jock knew then that is a slur on the man. I donâ??t know if he knew. But I am sure if he did, he would have tried to deal with it quietly.

 

Sadly, child abuse is a massive problem in society. Even more sadly, certain institutions where it has been practised have compounded the horror of it by seeking to cover it up and hide its perpetrators from public exposure and criminal prosecution. The suspicion that this is what happened in the Jim Torbett situation is why Rangers fans sing â??Big Jock knew.â? It is a dig at this institutional cover-up rather than a personal attack on a man most Rangers fans greatly respect.

 

Because of Jim Torbett, Celtic are an easy target. The Jerry Sandusky story just brings this out all the more. We Rangers fans have had to endure the merciless ribbing of Celtic supporters over the ongoing Rangers crisis. And talk of stripping titles is the ultimate hurt to bluenoses.

 

Which is why the Jerry Sandusky story may just cause all who have picked up stones to hurl at Rangers to pause before throwing, particularly those of a Celtic persuasion.

 

People in glass houses should not throw stones.

 

Celtic fans may claim that Celtic FC should not be punished for the actions of Jim Torbett. This is exactly what Rangers fans are saying about David Murray and Craig Whyte.

 

In a nutshell, fans of every team need to ask themselves a simple question:

 

Which is the worst crime?

 

Fiddling with kids or fiddling the books?

 

http://billmcmurdo.wordpress.com/

[Blue Moon 1,114]

I have to say I am ashamed at the references to child abuse that are bandied about by some sections of the Rangers support and I think it is a slur on our club. We are better than to use the abuse of children to get at our rivals.

 

Secondly, I was one who stood in total silence at Clydebank as the Rangers supporters paid their respects to a decent man, Jock Stein.

 

We are losing our way and tarnishing the great name of our club and our traditions by these actions.

 

Our recent trials do not justify any of these actions IMO. If you want to talk about the hypocrisy of Celtic's managers , directors and players being involved in tax avoidance schemes then that is fair game, but abused children are not. It is the lowest of the low. I've said my piece.

[54andcounting 0]

Tit for Tat springs to mind due to the horrendous treatment of RFC as we speak.

 

Yes I knew big Jock too only for a brief moment outside Ibrox Stadium when as Scotland manager he was checking on potential for his team. It was just a "Hi Jock" from me and a "Hello son" from him. I felt important at the time. If BJK it was only because of the stigma back then that nothing was done about it.

 

The tims regard him as a hero quite rightly, we should forget about targeting Big Jock.

[simplythebest 0]

I don't partake in it as a bragging right much myself, although there most certainly were cover ups in the Celtic hierarchy over that situation (where Big Jock was involved i've no idea) and someone should really have been punished for not going to the police.

[Guest Dutchy]

I neither think that this issue is a slur on our name, nor is anything against Jock Stein. It's merely people asking why these things are covered up.

 

I'm not one that follows the PC way, these things have to be out in the open, otherwise, how do to save other generations from the same abuse.

 

I genuinely believe they should be brought up and discussed and the folk that cover it up and refuse to have any talk about it are just as guilty of the terrors committed on these poor unfortuantes.

 

What is it with the law in this country that we can't even talk about it without being attacked by the protectors of the guilty???

[bluedan 93]

It's an interesting article however on the whole i think or would hope we are above going down such a route. It's digging up old stuff going back decades and would smack of pure desperation should we play this card.

[TheWeeBlueDevil 0]

Digging stuff like this up will just make them more determined to take our titles.

[Owain 0]

I've worked in child protection for some time.

 

The idea that it is restricted to Catholics or Protestants or any other religion for that matter is just abhorant.

 

Get real. Most of the kids I've worked with are from a "church of England" background. To try to ethnitise the problem is just going to allow more of it to happen. Nonces are nonces. God doesn't choose, it's the perpertrators that decide.

 

Scraping the bottom of the barrel with this. Lets have some dignity here.

[simplythebest 0]

I've worked in child protection for some time.

 

The idea that it is restricted to Catholics or Protestants or any other religion for that matter is just abhorant.

 

Get real. Most of the kids I've worked with are from a "church of England" background. To try to ethnitise the problem is just going to allow more of it to happen. Nonces are nonces. God doesn't choose, it's the perpertrators that decide.

 

Scraping the bottom of the barrel with this. Lets have some dignity here.

 

The Catholic Church does have very big problems with it, but as you say it's not a religious thing.

[54andcounting 0]

If Celtic are guilty of a cover up which I'm sure they were..does that mean WE should go after their titles?

 

Nah, we are better than that. F**k them let them live in denial it's their history leave them to it.