Ser Barristan Selmy 222 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 (edited) To do that you need money Rab , and we simply don't have any , free transfers and cheap imports will be our future until we get all the off field shit sorted , and God only knows how long that will take The board are going to need to find some sort of investment fast. Signing poor players is going to cost us much more in the long run. We need to be developing players and punting them to the EPL like Celtic do. We are unlikely going to find such players by spending peanuts in the English lower leagues. Edited October 24, 2016 by Ser Barristan Selmy 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian1964 10,458 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Gilks, Hodson, Kiernan, Hill, Wallace, Halliday, Holt, Windass, Tavernier, Miller, McKay. Out of the six players in bold only Windass was not involved in last seasons semi final win over them,which you could say Windass replaced Sheils,throw in Wallace and Keirnan and the changes are not that much,the only changes to their team is Dembele & Sinclair yet they seem to have improved vastly where we look like we have stalled!. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 The board are going to need to find some sort of investment fast. Signing poor players is going to cost us much more in the long run. We need to be developing players and punting them to the EPL like Celtic do. We are unlikely going to find such players by spending peanuts in the English lower leagues. And this is the quandary - because whilst you are right that we need to get investment fast it needs to be in a number of areas that have been neglected far too long. I would contend that we need a multi-pronged investment strategy and it's kind of chicken and egg - we need investment in the playing squad, of that there is no doubt. But probably just as if not more important is investing in a scouting network that the previous custodians obliterated. We need a much wider scouting network in "value jurisdictions". And once we have that we will be able to make playing squad investments which might not cost too much but have genuine resale value. Whilst I can see why people will complain at Warburton bringing in English lower league players - that is the market he knows, and knows well - and without a proper scouting network (McParland seems to be ploughing a lone furrow in the scouting department sadly - and his market is not that much different from Warburton's) - so it isn't difficult to see why he goes with what he knows and trusts. A better, wider scouting network should result in more, better options that he is currently seeing. But, again, without the money to invest in transfers and wages then we still will struggle to improve. If we are honest, much of the reason we competed with Celtic in the semi last season was because Deila had lost the dressing room and Celtic players were disinterested, even in the semi. They looked unfit and not up for it. A change of manager, a couple of decent signings in Sinclair and Dembele, and they look a completely different outfit - yesterday Scott Brown looked far, far fitter than he did in April - still not a very good footballer but his fitness and drive were there for all to see. In April he was blowing out his arse at half-time. They clearly have better players than we do and April was an aberration rather than an expected norm. That much is obvious. But we simply cant ignore the neglect that the Club has had for years. We need investment in a number of different areas, all of which won't be cheap - and it will also take balance if we are to remain in a position of operating within our means, until we have a share issue. We need investment in : 1. Playing squad 2. Scouting network 3. Infrastructure 4. Stadium 5. Academy (Celtic are still purchasing youth players because they have the money to do so.... Rangers are not spending money, or at least nowhere near as much, as Celtic - yet our Academy still does remarkably well considering). All of this needs done whilst having our hands tied by Ashley and the court cases with Green and Whyte et al. All of this needs done whilst Celtic are raking in a ton of money from the Champions League (which has me wondering why ANY Bear would want them to qualify for the group stages of this competition). All of this needs done whilst Celtic have a far superior financial position to us. The reality check. for me at least, is that the best we should be hoping for us 2nd place - because Celtic not only are far ahead of us in terms of quality of playing staff but if we were to get close and look to be catching them up (not necessarily this season - next year or year after that too, possibly) then they also have the financial clout to make purchases in the January window to push them over the edge - just look at what they did in the summer..... we can sit here and say they never spent much in the summer outside of Sinclair - but they also spent a ton of money on Rodgers, money wisely spent - but money we couldn't even begin to imagine spending (at least not with this Board.... Chuckles managed to spend it on Ally, but that is a different discussion). Until we can rid ourselves of "onerous contract" and see the dust settle on these court cases it is looking as if investment is going to be at the bare minimum to continue, which in some regards I can see why. However, if we truly wish to compete with Celtic then we need significant investment in the playing squad. But that in itself is a fairly short-term outlook. I have absolutely no doubt that we will rise to the top of Scottish football again but it is likely to be a long and rocky road. As gunslinger says.... we may as well all hold hands on the journey. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Gilks, Hodson, Kiernan, Hill, Wallace, Halliday, Holt, Windass, Tavernier, Miller, McKay. Out of the six players in bold only Windass was not involved in last seasons semi final win over them,which you could say Windass replaced Sheils,throw in Wallace and Keirnan and the changes are not that much,the only changes to their team is Dembele & Sinclair yet they seem to have improved vastly where we look like we have stalled!. The only changes they have maybe Dembele and Sinclair but you are missing other factors... They have a new manager in Rodgers Deila was shite Deila had lost the dressing room Celtic players had checked out for the season Celtic players thought that April was a "show up and win" situation Celtic players were unfit. There was far more at play than just two new players yesterday. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian1964 10,458 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 The only changes they have maybe Dembele and Sinclair but you are missing other factors... They have a new manager in Rodgers Deila was shite Deila had lost the dressing room Celtic players had checked out for the season Celtic players thought that April was a "show up and win" situation Celtic players were unfit. There was far more at play than just two new players yesterday. I'm not missing it Craig,merely pointing out that our players have stalled since that game,they have not made the next step up yet! 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 2,499 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 And this is the quandary - because whilst you are right that we need to get investment fast it needs to be in a number of areas that have been neglected far too long. I would contend that we need a multi-pronged investment strategy and it's kind of chicken and egg - we need investment in the playing squad, of that there is no doubt. But probably just as if not more important is investing in a scouting network that the previous custodians obliterated. We need a much wider scouting network in "value jurisdictions". And once we have that we will be able to make playing squad investments which might not cost too much but have genuine resale value. Whilst I can see why people will complain at Warburton bringing in English lower league players - that is the market he knows, and knows well - and without a proper scouting network (McParland seems to be ploughing a lone furrow in the scouting department sadly - and his market is not that much different from Warburton's) - so it isn't difficult to see why he goes with what he knows and trusts. A better, wider scouting network should result in more, better options that he is currently seeing. But, again, without the money to invest in transfers and wages then we still will struggle to improve. If we are honest, much of the reason we competed with Celtic in the semi last season was because Deila had lost the dressing room and Celtic players were disinterested, even in the semi. They looked unfit and not up for it. A change of manager, a couple of decent signings in Sinclair and Dembele, and they look a completely different outfit - yesterday Scott Brown looked far, far fitter than he did in April - still not a very good footballer but his fitness and drive were there for all to see. In April he was blowing out his arse at half-time. They clearly have better players than we do and April was an aberration rather than an expected norm. That much is obvious. But we simply cant ignore the neglect that the Club has had for years. We need investment in a number of different areas, all of which won't be cheap - and it will also take balance if we are to remain in a position of operating within our means, until we have a share issue. We need investment in : 1. Playing squad 2. Scouting network 3. Infrastructure 4. Stadium 5. Academy (Celtic are still purchasing youth players because they have the money to do so.... Rangers are not spending money, or at least nowhere near as much, as Celtic - yet our Academy still does remarkably well considering). All of this needs done whilst having our hands tied by Ashley and the court cases with Green and Whyte et al. All of this needs done whilst Celtic are raking in a ton of money from the Champions League (which has me wondering why ANY Bear would want them to qualify for the group stages of this competition). All of this needs done whilst Celtic have a far superior financial position to us. The reality check. for me at least, is that the best we should be hoping for us 2nd place - because Celtic not only are far ahead of us in terms of quality of playing staff but if we were to get close and look to be catching them up (not necessarily this season - next year or year after that too, possibly) then they also have the financial clout to make purchases in the January window to push them over the edge - just look at what they did in the summer..... we can sit here and say they never spent much in the summer outside of Sinclair - but they also spent a ton of money on Rodgers, money wisely spent - but money we couldn't even begin to imagine spending (at least not with this Board.... Chuckles managed to spend it on Ally, but that is a different discussion). Until we can rid ourselves of "onerous contract" and see the dust settle on these court cases it is looking as if investment is going to be at the bare minimum to continue, which in some regards I can see why. However, if we truly wish to compete with Celtic then we need significant investment in the playing squad. But that in itself is a fairly short-term outlook. I have absolutely no doubt that we will rise to the top of Scottish football again but it is likely to be a long and rocky road. As gunslinger says.... we may as well all hold hands on the journey. I will probably get pelters for this but I doubt I would trust Warburton with a big Transfer budget I am seriously starting to doubt his man management skills for one, and the 2 players he spent biggish money on are not exactly setting the heather on fire. O'Halloran has only played about 120 minutes this season. Forrester has suddenly dropped from the planet and he was our best player in periods last season. Funny how you linked Dhelila losing the dressing room to playing bad last season. Mmmmm it couldn't be could it? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyk 158 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Most of the players looked like they lacked confidence and self belief yesterday, they looked lost with no imagination most of the game! 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyharley 5 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Most of the players looked like they lacked confidence and self belief yesterday, they looked lost with no imagination most of the game! Ive slated Windass but he didn't seem to know where he was supposed to do. A player can pop up all over the park in good reason, like when Holt is on form, he's everywhere. But yesterday JW didn't seem to know where to position himself so ended up upfront, centre mid and defensive mid at times. He looked completely baffled as to what he was supposed to be doing. This affected Holt and Halliday for me who also didn't cover themselves in glory. It seems a pretty Scottish mentality but at times yesterday I felt as if we needed to be stronger, more aggressive, pick up a booking leaving a mark on Forrest or Sinclair. And we made it far to easy for Brown to do the same to us making him look like a fine central midfielder. For me, the season now starts on Wednesday, we have a run of winnable games. We put that game to bed and get the confidence and goals back. Self belief needs instilled into these players and the guys who need a rest need to hold their hands up and say I need a couple of games out. We have a decent size squad, lets start getting game time to some of the fringe players and rest Wallace and McKay til say the Hearts game in principle. Give Forrester and MOH some game time. Dodoo looks like he could become a decent player but he too will need game time. I remember the days when Rangers would get beat and we'd take it out on the next team bossing games start to finish. That needs to happen Wednesday and Saturday. 6 points should lift us up the table and its an absolute minimum from these next two games 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian1964 10,458 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Most of the players looked like they lacked confidence and self belief yesterday, they looked lost with no imagination most of the game! They should be having a word with themselves,allowing themselves to be bullied all over the pitch,time they stood up and start battling for results 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyk 158 Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 They should be having a word with themselves,allowing themselves to be bullied all over the pitch,time they stood up and start battling for results I totally agree mate, something looks wrong to me, their whole body language from last season to this season looks different. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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