BrahimHemdani

Just back home and there is a clear leader but so far only 8 votes have been cast. It could be that others will attend regardless but it is not really viable with less than 12.

Come on guys, vote please. Admin - please merge the threads and make this one the sticky thanks.

Celtic are in Pot 2, Legia and Rapid Vienna are both in Pot 3, Sion are in Pot 4 (where there are two nice trips to Azerbaijan waiting including a return visit to Baku). This would be nice for them: Rubin Kazan Rus Legia Warsaw Pol Garabag Agdam Azb or Gabala FK Azb

I am revising the poll to include two dates in January 2016. As a reminder: Sat 07 Nov 2015 v Alloa Athletic The advantage of this date is that we know it's a Saturday 3.00pm fixture, making it easy to plan; the disadvantage is that it means that would be unlikely to get a restaurant to ourselves for more than a couple of hours, which is an issue in terms of a speaker. Sat 14 Nov 2015 v Dumbarton Same as above. Also, I will be away so someone else will need to organise, as it would be no fun organising then not being able to attend. Sat 12 Dec 2015 v Morton The disadvantage here is that the date and time are not yet confirmed but it does seem unlikely they will be moved and also as above if the date and time are not moved then it is unlikely we will get a restaurant to ourselves for more than a couple of hours, which is an issue in terms of a speaker. Sat 26 Dec 2015 v Hibernian The Hibs game is the only home match that has been moved in the first half of the season so far but it seems relatively unlikely that it will be moved away from Boxing Day but more likely an early KO. However, a move to the Sunday cannot be rued out. The obvious disadvantage is that if it goes ahead on Boxing Day, then that will be very difficult if not impossible for many folk due to family commitments. The advantage is that if it is an early KO we might get a restaurant to ourselves for the afternoon/early evening and even more so if it is moved to the Sunday. If we go for either of the December dates then I might need a deputy convener(s) (previous offer by rbr noted with thanks) as I will out of the country from 7 to 29 November, any other volunteers please PM, if you're too embarassed to come forward in public. Sat 16 Jan 2016 v Livingston Same comments as v Morton on 12 Dec Sat 30 Jan 2016 v Falkirk Same comments as v Morton on 12 Dec Unless there's a runaway winner, I'll leave this open till the 12th of September as I'm away on Saturday for 2 weeks. Once we get a result on the date we can think about restaurants, though I don't think that is going to be very difficult. It would be appreciated if everyone who has attended previous dinners and/or anyone who might consider attending this one, please vote in the poll.

In the light of comments thus far, I am going to restart the poll including the January dates. So I'll start a new thread with the new poll and ask admin to merge the two. Then everyone can vote again based on the 6 choices.

Very happy to agree on that one! However, a parting shot: Black had one second half sub appearance for Scotland and is currently unemployed apparently (Berwick?). Zaliukas has played 25 times for Lithuania and played v England at Wembley; so again not a very fair comparison I'd say.

I think you may have misunderstood my first point or perhaps I didn't express it too well. What I was suggesting was that if we are to acquire (European) international standard players in future then it is likely they will be from "lesser" nations like Lithuania [45th] NOT from top (10 or 20) nations such as England , Portugal, Netherlands, Ukraine, Turkey or even say Croatia and Sweden as we have done in the past. I would think that Denmark, Norway etc (outside the top 20) might be our level but if and only if they are better than what we can produce or find in the UK.

Craig, I really do think using the same derogatory expression for Zaliukas as Mohsni or even McCulloch is out of order. McCulloch was a liability basically because of his lack of pace and positional sense as a defender. Mohnsi on the other hand clearly had some kind of defect in his character, mental or otherwise which led him to attack players etc etc which is well documented and rehearsed on here. Zaliukas may be slowing down at age 32 but he is still miles quicker than McCulloch had perfect positional sense for his position. So I would contend that using "bomb scare" to cover all three players is grossly unfair to Zaliukas at least.

I think we'll need to disagree on this one, as I said I enjoyed watching him play, his anticipation and interceptions were excellent most of the time; and it will be a long time till we're back at the level of employing current internationals from top nations, indeed that may never happen again.

I think that's a bit strong, Mohsni was a bomb scare, Zaliukas is a current international who was very successful and captained Hearts and has played for his country 25 times, even if that's Lithuania he isn't a bomb scare.

You definitely get points for win/draw in the latter stages, I was looking for anything about points per round as well and couldn't see it. If you are correct about that then it's a maximum 35?

I think McGregor may have had to go because we are paying £6,500 a week for the Arsenal lad who is obviously going to play more games. Personally I think he deserved a shot in the "new" team based on his performances last season but if MW decided otherwise then it's best he moves on. I liked Zaliukas, though he was often guilty of rash tackles and lack of concentration; the two of them were a decent pairing. At 32 however, he will want to play, so here again it's best he moves on provided we didn't have to give him a big pay off. I wish them both well.

I would think 6 group matches, then last 32, last 16, last 8, last 4 and final equals 15 matches so 30 points possible?

Don't disagree with much of this, though it's a different argument. However, Celtic will likely win more points for Scotland and themselves in the EL than CL, I'm sure you would agree.

I think you are correct here, the points a team collects in the qualifiers go towards the country ranking but not the team's coefficient. However a similar system applies as you have detailed. So to my mind Rousseau is still correct because the more games you win, or the further you go before being knocked out in the qualifiers the more team points you get; but he is also wrong because our minute points total will put us up against teams with much higher coefficients, although that doesn't necessarily mean they will be better teams. Like you I'll look at this in more detail when I have more time.

This is correct in respect of the team points which determine our seeding but not in respect of the country points which determine where Scottish teams start in the qualifiers. As per # 27 the country points are determined by dividing the total points earned by all the teams in the particular country by the number of teams, the 20% only then applies to the team points. So if Celtic were to miraculously gain 20 points and nothing else changes, it would move Scotland up to joint 18th and 17th means that the team that finishes second in the SPL would start in EL Q2. Not a vast difference and unlikely as well, but a difference nonetheless. It is also fair to say that a better seeding does not necessarilly mean you are a better team as Celtic can attest! It may mean you were better at some point or various points in the past 5 years but not now.

Not sure I fully understand this point Rousseau. I think what you mean is that if Scotland has a better coefficient and we start higher in the qualifiers and lose the first game that is no good, so it might be better for taking things as they stand and having a chance of beating some teams in the early rounds and building up points? In theory YES, albeit it's only 1 point for a win in the qualifiers. However as per #39 the issue is that our own non-existent coefficient means that we will be up against teams from respectable footballing countries like Norway, Serbia, Slovakia and Slovenia or worse still rising nations like Azerbaijan and Khazekstan. We will not be playing playing minnows from Malta (and look at the hard time Birkirkara gave West Ham) San Marino or the Faroes etc because they'll be on similar points/seedings to us.

Not correct, it's the same points whoever you play: 2 for a win and 1 for a draw, and half in the qualifiers.

As last time it will be possible to get a non Christmas menu on the 12th. I agree as per the OP about the 26th but wanted to offer the option.

I accept that but I did have someone extra special lined up

I don't want to influence voting too much but just to reiterate that I will not be here on either November date, so someone else will need to organise. (In theory I could organise in advance and not attend but that wouldn't be much fun. ) Would QoS on 17 Oct be too early or would Jan 16 v Livingston or Jan 30 v Falkirk be too late? I can amend the poll (and start again) if these dates are viable alternatives.

There are two aspects to this. #1 is that we need the Scottish coefficient up so we get a decent start (unlikely I agree). #2 is getting our own coefficient up from more or less zero, so we get a decent seeding (which we obviously have to build ourselves). The big problem with where we are now or will be in a couple of year's time is that it's a double whammy. Unless we win the SPL at first time of asking (and even then it would be CL Q2), we'll almost certainly start in EL Q1 due to Scotland's position; but our own non-existent coefficient means that we will be up against teams from respectable footballing countries like Norway, Serbia, Slovakia and Slovenia or worse still rising nations like Azerbaijan and Khazekstan. I don't think a lot of folk realise that. They might think we'll be playing minnows from Malta (and look at the hard time Birkirkara gave West Ham) San Marino or the Faroes etc but that isn't the case because they'll be on similar seedings to us. Basically I was having a rare agreement with SBS; Scotland must have both sides of the old firm performing well in Europe because the other teams just aren't strong enough. If I remember correctly there was at least one season we had one auto qualifier and one in Q3 in the CL, which means being in the top 12 these days, even two in the qualifiers means 13th to 15th; how far off does that look now.

Please cast a vote in the poll, rbr and offer noted with thanks.

OK guys, it's that time of year again, well nearly, so let's get started with sorting out a date. I can see 4 possible contenders: Sat 07 Nov v Alloa Athletic The advantage of this date is that we know it's a Saturday 3.00pm fixture, making it easy to plan; the disadvantage is that it means that would be unlikely to get a restaurant to ourselves for more than a couple of hours, which is an issue in terms of a speaker. Sat 14 Nov v Dumbarton Same as above. Also both the above dates are a bit early to my mind (last year's Christmas Dinner was on 6 Dec) and I will be away so someone else will need to organise; which some might see as a double advantage. Sat 12 Dec v Morton The disadvantage here is that the date and time are not yet confirmed but it does seem unlikely they will be moved and also as above if the date and time are not moved then it is unlikely we will get a restaurant to ourselves for more than a couple of hours, which is an issue in terms of a speaker. Sat 26 Dec v Hibernian The Hibs game is the only home match that has been moved in the first half of the season so far but it seems relatively unlikely that it will be moved away from Boxing Day but more likely an early KO. However, a move to the Sunday cannot be rued out. The obvious disadvantage is that if it goes ahead on Boxing Day, then that will be very difficult if not impossible for many folk due to family commitments. The advantage is that if it is an early KO we might get a restaurant to ourselves for the afternoon/early evening and even more so if it is moved to the Sunday. If we go for either of the December dates then I might need a deputy convener, as I will out of the country from 7 to 29 November, volunteers please PM, if you're too embarassed to come forward in public. Unless there's a runaway winner, I'll leave this open till the 12th of September as I'm away on Saturday for 2 weeks. Once we get a result on the date we can think about restaurants, though I don't think that is going to be very difficult.

True. Last season (for this season's seedings) Celtic were 55th with 39.08 points, we were 117th with 17.08 (clinging on to 12.72 from 2010/11 run to the EL last 16) and our 2011/12 conquerors Malmo 142nd with 12.54. Currently, Celtic are 43rd with 39.13, Malmo are 100th with 16.85 and we are 263rd (level with Dundee Utd) with just the couple of points we scored in 2011/12 at home to Maribor and Malmo and share of Scotland's points for all the succeeding years we have been out of Europe. As things stand now, with only a share of Scotland's points to look forward to next season and beyond till we get back, we are looking at being below 300th in the rankings; Celtic are provisionally 35th and Malmo 92nd.