Rangersitis

Is moving seats to another area of the stadium not open to all season ticket holders? Also is there not a system already in place that allows friends and family to sit together if the seats are vacant?

What about Erwin's subsequent retaliatory attacks on Moshni?

 

Why haven't the SFA further charged Moore Kerr and Ainsworth with the excessive nature of their attacks on Moshni?

Probably because he never got anywhere near him, not that I have seen anyway.

Because they were covered by the rules on red cards for violent conduct?

We can't put up much of an argument in defending Moshni, but that does not mean we cant highlight the culpability of Erwin. The mitigation of Moshni's actions, nor the SFA and SPFL's suspicious but not surprisingly lenient attitude towards Erwin's guilt, and several other Motherwell players part in assaulting Moshni.

Erwin's push was worthy of nothing more than the yellow card that he received. Handbags like that are routinely seen in matches.

Mohsni, Ainsworth, Moore and Kerr all received automatic two match bans for violent conduct.

Mohsni received a further automatic two matches for his previous exploits.

The extra three matches Mohsni received was for the excessive nature of the violence.

I was never a big fan of Mohsni (although I was pleased when he performed well: like the times when he reads the forward pass a drives himself forward to intercept; Or the times he got his head on a cross easing the pressure. I took great pleasure in watching that -- we don't have many that can read a pass like that. It was all too few and far between alas!), but I feel sorry for him here. It was not an unprovoked attack, and while I'm not condoning what he did, I feel he's being made a scapegoat. He's not a nutcase, he just has a temper with a low tolerance threshold. I doubt anyone, when pushed hard, would simply walk away. B]I condemn the degree of the response, but I do not condemn that he responded at all.[/b]

If he had responded to the push with a similar push he would have received the same punishment as Erwin. The degree of his punishment was for the degree of the retaliation added to his previous record of indiscipline. There really is no just reason to defend him.

The manager of the team that beat them?

The manager of the team that beat the team that beat them?

Very true. But I WILL give him time once he has signed, like any other player. Still think there are better players out there at that price.

Only teasing.

No, the stats prove that English sides don't take the tournament seriously. We can keep doing this if you want but if you seriously believe the Portuguese league has more depth than the English one then any credibility you might have becomes difficult to take seriously. You keep doing that, good luck with your argument!

 

 

My argument is that the English teams, despite all their wealth, are being outperformed by other nations in both of the UEFA competitions. Claiming that English sides don't take the EL seriously isn't borne out by the facts. Both Liverpool and Everton went out while fielding their strongest available teams. Like Pochettino, I'm not really sure what Spurs best team is, but they fielded most of them in defeat to Fiorentina.

 

 

Nope, I was slagging off Rangers, try reading it again. It was heartbreaking a club like Brentford could buy our best player, but that's on us not them. I'm old enough to remember when Watford bought our club captain, I felt the same way about that. Just as well we didn't have messageboards then or you could have misunderstood that too...

 

You were demeaning Brentford without having the first idea about what you were talking about, even misrepresenting their crowds to try and push your arrogant views. If you read all of the comments on the thread you will see that one or two others also 'misunderstood' you. I too am old enough to remember when Watford signed McClelland so your wee Top Trumps moment fell flat.

..........

With respect what do those Europa League stats prove? Are we saying that the Dutch, Swiss and Portuguese leagues are as good as the English one? Really? Do your Champion's League stats again for the last decade.

 

I think most people would accept that Spanish football is of a very high standard, I certainly would. This isn't about saying Spanish football is poorer than English football or German football, it's about not criticising our new manager for looking at the English league for his first signing. If he signed some guy we'd never heard of from a second tier Spanish side he might be just as good a player as this Keirnan lad. But he's going to take time to adjust to Scottish football and, more challenging, to living in Glasgow, a very different culture on many levels to what he's been raised in and used too. That's not to say he couldn't do it, just that it's more of a risk than buying an English (or Irish, whatever he is) player.

Looking at one of the nations with the strongest league in the world, with who we are identical in almost every way culturally is the most sensible thing any new manager could do. If that manager also happens to know these leagues well because he's spent his entire working life in them too, well I'm sorry but it's a no brainer.

You do the CL stats for the last decade if you feel so inclined. I gave you five years as that is what the UEFA co-efficient is based on.

The stats for the Europa League show that the high standard that you claim exists in the English game would not appear to go much below the top 4 or 5 clubs. The Spanish and Portuguese teams are consistently reaching the latter stages of the competition.

It wasn't so long ago that you were slagging off Brentford as a tinpot club when Lewis McLeod went to them, yet now we have you waxing lyrical about the merits of Rangers buying players from that league and below....and picked by the very same manager who was in charge at that flash in the pan club!

I suspect we could find better at that price.

What happened to that 'wait until they have played for Rangers' mantra?

No doubt the press will be making up all sorts about who he is going over to watch

Brazil, Argentina, Chile.....

It's down to money, pure and simple. During the 1980s, when English football was in a financial slump (relatively speaking) Serie A had lots of English players; Gascoigne, Platt, Ince, Wilkins, Hately, Paul Elliot, Blizzard, Rideout, Cowans and Trevor Francis not to mention Souness, Joe Jordan and Liam Brady who all came from English football. They don't just now because even the top Italian sides struggle to compete with middling EPL clubs on salary. The richest leagues tend to have the best players, wherever they are from.

 

 

 

The richest clubs recruit the best players wherever they are from, see above. Why isn't everyone in the Barca team Spanish? Because they can afford to sign the best players, not just the best Spanish players. Why isn't everyone in the Bayern side German, they're world champions after all? It's the same in England. Spanish football is relatively impoverished outside of two or arguably three sides so they tend to lose their good players too.

This isn't about signing 'Englishmen' but looking at the English leagues for players (this Kiernan isn't English I understand).

i think that you may have swallowed the Sky Sports hype. Despite being awash with cash, they consistently fail on the big stage. Here are the statistics from the last five years of the Champions League - they make for interesting reading. Also, I wouldn't have any English - based players in my world XI although I do concede that it is something which is subjective.

Quarter Finalists

 

 

Spain 13

Germany 7

England 6

France 5

Italy 4

Portugal 2

Cyprus 1

Turkey 1

Ukraine 1

 

Semi Finalists

 

Spain 10

Germany 6

England 3

Italy 1

 

Finalists

 

Spain 4

Germany 3

England 2

Italy 1

 

Winners

 

Spain 3

Germany 1

England 1

The same stats for the Europa League appear to show that despite being plundered by the EPL there is sufficient talent to do the business where it matters.

Quarter Finalists

 

Spain 7

Portugal 7

Holland 4

Italy 4

Ukraine 4

England 3

Germany 3

Russia 3

Switzerland 2

Belgium 1

France 1

Turkey 1

 

Semi Finalists

 

Spain 7

Portugal 5

Italy 3

England 2

Russia 1

Switzerland 1

Ukraine 1

 

Finalists

 

Spain 4

Portugal 3

England 1

Switzerland 1

Ukraine 1

 

Winners

 

Spain 3

England 1

Portugal 1

Someone (SBS I think) said "there's a reason there's a complete lack of English players and coaches abroad" as some kind of fact. It's not, there are scores of English players and coaches 'abroad' in all sorts of leagues. The main reason for this misapprehension is the lack of English players at top English sides.

It's worth remembering the governing factor in almost everything in professional football; money. If an English player can live in England and play in the Championship and earn more than he would at an La Liga side outside of their 'big two' then that's what they do. The reason Lampard and Gerrard are now plying their trade in America (that's abroad btw) is because of the money on offer.

 

I'm no fan of the EPL or its greed is good mantra, if the money dried up tomorrow you'd suddenly see English players and coaches appearing in leagues where the salaries were higher. The standard of player in England is as high as anywhere in the world and we are culturally and linguistically identical, any manager who didn't look there first for players should be severely questioned.

A quick Wiki check shows that the number of English players playing in La Liga and Serie A over the years have been less than half of their Spanish and German counterparts.

If the standard of player in England is as high as anywhere in the world, why are the top English clubs largely recruiting players from elsewhere?

There may be a subtelty at play, or I may have misinterpreted... but was the suggestion not that voting rights of shareholders found to have breached dual-ownership rules would be disapplied?

It reads to me that it will be added in order to stop any further breaches of the rules, rather than it being used to bar anyone who has done so in the past but I'm certainly no expert.

Was further detail provided at the GM?

So if I rob a bank today, I can't be prosecuted tomorrow because the robbery itself is no longer ongoing? Behave...

 

The idea, as far as I undertand, is that any shareholder proven to have been in breach of said dual ownership rules, would be proposed to have their voting rights disapplied, The main benefits thereafter would be a) to prevent him from taking up his portion of shares in the proposed rights issue (as if he'd actually *invest*, snigger snigger); and b) to prevent any future breaches given that the SFA levies fines on the club.

 

All very sensible, as I'm sure the majority of shareholders will agree.

 

Tanks on kiddy-on lawns, etc.

Not if you have already been prosecuted for it, no, you wouldn't. If Ashley was to pull another stroke which breached the rules, then there would be further sanctions.

It's not ongoing but the ruling may hinder any efforts of Ashley to appoint another place-person at board level.

 

As stewarty posted earlier, club will now most likely use this ruling at the next AGM to disapply the voting rights of anyone with a duel-interest of which Ashley may not be the only person.

 

However, as Ashley has done with the subsequent Sports Direct loan, chances are he'll use another loop-hole to get round this or just transfer his shares (and rights) to a friendly family shareholding represented by our resident alias.

 

Round and round we go...

Jim Ballantyne at Airdrie?

Your last sentence sums it up for me. This has become deeply personal between two egotists, a battle of wills and to fuck with the consequences.

You'd think so but they're maybe waiting until one or two other cases are concluded before they attempt to declare the retail stuff as null and void. This may be one such case.

 

I doubt this is something that will be resolved in the short term. Unless, of course, Ashley is the one to take a step back which seems very unlikely.

I'm with you on that, Frankie.

Still a breach, as confirmed by the SFA. Again.

I don't believe anyone is arguing that there wasn't a breach, but it is not something which is ongoing.

Anyway, was the plan not to stop the voting rights of anyone who had an interest in another club?

Both Richard Gough and Davie Robertson were flying the flag for McLeish at the NARSA convention.

What's the story with Richard Gough? He was front of shot along with King on the ST boycott only to disappear without a trace.

Some points of note in the judgement which may help the RFC argument vis-a-vis retail contract issue...

If the retail contract was considered to be in any way illegal, would the club not just break the terms and put the ball into Ashley's court instead of looking to renegotiate?

More leverage!

Chris Eagles did he not reject us a few year back thinking he was better than the SPL level ?

He wanted more money than Rangers were prepared to offer.

The share issue will be fully subscribed.

How much will it actually bring in bearing in mind that a number of shares have already been set aside for the two loans?

This thread is surreal.

I will be amazed if 12 million isn't spent on the team

Is that a Craig Whyte £12m which includes wages, agents fees, hotel bills, 85p for a bottle of water.....?

OOOOOOOOOOOOOO!,we have witches on the forum?

Apparently so.