Oleg_Mcnoleg 50 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 (edited) Eustace looks a risk after those knee ops. But the lack of leadership on the pitch has been absolutely dreadful. Jig had his limitations as a player but I did think he'd have the character to provide a bit of leadership. it makes some sense to have an old head in what's likely to be a fairly young squad, and there's off-the-pitch influence as well: sounds like he might instill a bit of professionalism (evidently pretty thin on the ground). Overall, with a bit of luck with injuries, he might be a canny acquisition. Wilson, assuming it gets done, seems a no-brainier. The other lad, I have no knowledge of but sounds solid and ok on the ball. The discussion of Allan is just getting daft: either he's Platini in his heyday or pub football clogger. On what I've seen, he looks ok. I like the drive he gives. When he gets the ball, he always seems to try to pass forward or to run at the opponent's midfield and defence. He takes responsibility--no hiding--and tries to make stuff happen. Again, this has been absent far too often. On the flip side, it means he can give the ball away cheaply and he also looks a bit petulant and reckless. He's looked decent against us though I've not seen enough of him to make a definitive judgement. On balance, I reckon he'd do ok(clearly wants to play for us too, which shouldn't be ignored--can't be tolerating players who think they're doing us a favour by pulling on the jersey). Edited June 21, 2015 by Oleg_Mcnoleg 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangersitis 0 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 Eustace looks a risk after those knee ops. But the lack of leadership on the pitch has been absolutely dreadful. Jig had his limitations as a player but I did think he'd have the character to provide a bit of leadership. it makes some sense to have an old head in what's likely to be a fairly young squad, and there's off-the-pitch influence as well: sounds like he might instill a bit of professionalism (evidently pretty thin on the ground). Overall, with a bit of luck with injuries, he might be a canny acquisition.Wilson, assuming it gets done, seems a no-brainier. The other lad, I have no knowledge of but sounds solid and ok on the ball. The discussion of Allan is just getting daft: either he's Platini in his heyday and pub football clogger. On what I've seen, he looks ok. I like the drive he gives. When he gets the ball, he always seems to try to pass forward or to run at the opponent's midfield and defence. He takes responsibility--no hiding--and tries to make stuff happen. Again, this has been absent far too often. On the flip side, it means he can give the ball away cheaply and he also looks a bit petulant and reckless. He's looked decent against us though I've not seen enough of him to make a definitive judgement. On balance, I reckon he'd do ok(clearly wants to play for us too, which shouldn't be ignored--can't be tolerating players who think they're doing us a favour by pulling on the jersey). Your assessment of Allen is pretty much the same as mine. I would rather have that type of character in the team than a Law, Wallace or Templeton. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
der Berliner 3,263 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 I don't mind us signing a 35 year-old player, simply because he's bound to play DM where pace is not necessary. He's obviously had injuries last year, and that is the worrying aspect: is it an unfortunate injury, or is it related to age? To be fair, I would still be happy with the gamble; he's obviously a leader so if he can play 20+ games he'd have an influence. I also appreciate most, and me included, feel we should be building for the future and a 35 year-old doesn't fit the bill. However, he might be able to play a few years yet. If his influence is beneficial to the team, and he plays for another 2/3 years would that be acceptable? It would for me. Why is there no decent stats (outside appearances and goals -- there not really a good judge of performance for a midfielder! I need pass accuracy, pass success rate, assists, touches etc.) for Scott Allan? Allan's a strange case. He's always been overrated in my opinion, and his record in England would corroborate that (although, in his defense his loan spells were only a month or two in length), but his performances in Scotland have been lauded. I think he's overrated, but would actually quite like to sign him. Cognitive dissonance?! When in doubt, check FIFA16! (He's level 66.) In absolute terms he's probably a level below what I would like for us; although in my mind we're in Europe! Perhaps he'd be a decent signing for now, but not for the European stage. Does that mean we should overlook him? I'm not so sure. I think I'd take him; he's certainly one of the better players in Scotland, and he's probably good enough for the Premiership. Well, this is not the US of A and American Football, where people are measured by yards run and thrown and whatnot. Yet, you do get decent enough stats over at transfermarkt, both for Scott Allan Overall Goals, assists, cards et al (Leistungsdaten) ... and of course Eustace too Overall Goals, assists, cards et al Haven't checked but there sure is an English version out there too. Tor means "goal", Torvorlage means "assist". Same obviously goes for Rangers -> http://www.transfermarkt.de/glasgow-rangers/startseite/verein/124 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 243 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 How do you know Forfar didn't rate him? He was 18 and joined them on an emergency loan from September to October, playing 4 games. He also played for MK Dons for a month, again playing 4 games. It seems Portsmouth liked him, signing him twice and playing him regularly. Kyle Hutton would be lucky if Accrington Stanley showed interest in him. forfar played only 4 of 7 available How many full games at Portsmouth? 4 or 5? league 1- plays 13 games, 5 as a sub, 3 he gets taken off, 1 goal ,1 assist (5 full games in total) championship- 20 games ,3 as sub, 9 of them he gets subbed, 1 goal 5 assists (8 full games in total) Scottish championship- plays 30 games, 2 as a sub, 12 games he is subbed off ,2 goals ,15 assists the majority for hibs at right mid for comparison vuckic played 15 scored 8 and 2 assists, danny wilson played 31 scored 5 with 5 assists at centre half Are we not trying to improve the side? sorry have watched the guy a few times for scotland u21 and hibs he is poor. The more i think about it the less likely i see Warburton signing off on him. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangersitis 0 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 forfar played only 4 of 7 available How many full games at Portsmouth? 4 or 5? league 1- plays 13 games, 5 as a sub, 3 he gets taken off, 1 goal ,1 assist (5 full games in total) championship- 20 games ,3 as sub, 9 of them he gets subbed, 1 goal 5 assists (8 full games in total) Scottish championship- plays 30 games, 2 as a sub, 12 games he is subbed off ,2 goals ,15 assists the majority for hibs at right mid for comparison vuckic played 15 scored 8 and 2 assists, danny wilson played 31 scored 5 with 5 assists at centre half Are we not trying to improve the side? sorry have watched the guy a few times for scotland u21 and hibs he is poor. The more i think about it the less likely i see Warburton signing off on him. Sorry, but didn't you claim last night that the deal had already been done prior to Warburton's appointment? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
der Berliner 3,263 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 (edited) Are we not trying to improve the side?. Yes. We are building from scratch and a dynamic midfielder who can deliver a decent cross and corner and drives the team forward is exactly what we need. We e.g. started to have decent corners when Vuckic and Walsh started taking them, not our own creative player Law, who by all accounts has a decent scoring record and played nigh every game, yet was essentially a rather poor attacking midfielder, chasing shadows and being brushed off the ball. Hibs dominated our midfield nigh every time we played them last season, and in embarrassing fashion. With better players than at Hibs around him, and a decent coach on the sidelines, Allan (at 23) can develop into a decent enough attacking midfielder for us. Just my humble opinion. I think I bow out here, as there is no further need to discuss this until he actually signs. Edited June 21, 2015 by der Berliner 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Barristan Selmy 222 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 (edited) I don't mind us signing a 35 year-old player, simply because he's bound to play DM where pace is not necessary. He's obviously had injuries last year, and that is the worrying aspect: is it an unfortunate injury, or is it related to age? To be fair, I would still be happy with the gamble; he's obviously a leader so if he can play 20+ games he'd have an influence. I also appreciate most, and me included, feel we should be building for the future and a 35 year-old doesn't fit the bill. However, he might be able to play a few years yet. If his influence is beneficial to the team, and he plays for another 2/3 years would that be acceptable? It would for me. Why is there no decent stats (outside appearances and goals -- there not really a good judge of performance for a midfielder! I need pass accuracy, pass success rate, assists, touches etc.) for Scott Allan? Allan's a strange case. He's always been overrated in my opinion, and his record in England would corroborate that (although, in his defense his loan spells were only a month or two in length), but his performances in Scotland have been lauded. I think he's overrated, but would actually quite like to sign him. Cognitive dissonance?! When in doubt, check FIFA16! (He's level 66.) In absolute terms he's probably a level below what I would like for us; although in my mind we're in Europe! Perhaps he'd be a decent signing for now, but not for the European stage. Does that mean we should overlook him? I'm not so sure. I think I'd take him; he's certainly one of the better players in Scotland, and he's probably good enough for the Premiership. I agree with you on Allan. As I said in another post theres a long list of players like him who are the better players in Scottish football and who weren't good enough in England. He's a lot better than what we have but if he was that good he would have broken through at Birmingham and WBA. That said, I want players like him much more than someone like Eustace. What is the point in signing players just for this division? A captain no less? Given the position we are in, I definitely want us to sign players like Allan and Wilson. They are decent SPL level players, though long term we need better, ideally focusing abroad and developing our own. Edited June 21, 2015 by Ser Barristan Selmy 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rousseau 9,407 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 Well, this is not the US of A and American Football, where people are measured by yards run and thrown and whatnot. Yet, you do get decent enough stats over at transfermarkt, both for Scott Allan Overall Goals, assists, cards et al (Leistungsdaten) ... and of course Eustace too Overall Goals, assists, cards et al Haven't checked but there sure is an English version out there too. Tor means "goal", Torvorlage means "assist". Same obviously goes for Rangers -> http://www.transfermarkt.de/glasgow-rangers/startseite/verein/124 Thanks for that. Of course it's not American Football, but we judge strikers by goals scored etc., so it makes sense to judge a midfielder on assists and passes, pass success rate etc. no? Incidentally, Allan contributed 15 assists in 30 games last year. I think that's decent; it certainly makes me more interested in signing him. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rousseau 9,407 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 I agree with you on Allan. As I said in another post theres a long list of players like him who are the better players in Scottish football and who weren't good enough in England. He's a lot better than what we have but if he was that good he would have broken through at Birmingham and WBA. That said, I want players like him much more than someone like Eustace. What is the point in signing players just for this division? A captain no less? Given the position we are in, I definitely want us to sign players like Allan and Wilson. They are decent SPL level players, though long term we need better, ideally focusing abroad and developing our own. I appreciate where you're coming from, and if we could get another 'younger' sitting-midfielder with experience, than I'd prefer to go down that route. However, I think he could be a shrewd acquisition. He's experienced, he can pass a ball, tackle, etc. -- he's certainly not short of admirers! --, and if he plays for the next 2/3 years he'd be a success. If we can go younger, then, yes, that's the way to go, but he's a realistic option just now, so I'm ok with it. I'm not too excited, but I can see the logic. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangersitis 0 Posted June 21, 2015 Share Posted June 21, 2015 Thanks for that. Of course it's not American Football, but we judge strikers by goals scored etc., so it makes sense to judge a midfielder on assists and passes, pass success rate etc. no? Incidentally, Allan contributed 15 assists in 30 games last year. I think that's decent; it certainly makes me more interested in signing him. I never have taken the time to find out the parameters of these in-depth stats. Is a successful pass judged the same whether it is 2 yards sideways or a 20 yard slide rule pass that guts the defence and leads to a goal? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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