RST Write to Senior SNP Figures Over IRA Pub Visit

[BrahimHemdani 1]

You'd need to ask Mr Yousaf his reasons, I don't know them. I just know they aren't the reasons most of us choose our team.

 

As a matter of interest BH, had your grandfather taken you to see Celtic v Third Lanark and they'd won would you be a Celtic supporter today?

 

I strongly suspect that my grandfather would not have taken me to see Celtic v Third Lanark.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

The SNP hate us. What do you expect? They mostly get their increased support nowadays from Celtc-supporting regions, hence this pub.

How many SNP MP's, MSP's, MEP's or councillors can you name who are known Rangers supporters ? I can't name any.

 

There was a cross party group of "Rangers" MP's at Westminster, including the Govan MP Ian Davidson. I belive that Brian Donohoe, recently elected to the Board of RF was the Secretary or Chair latterly.

 

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/12461452.MPs_form_Rangers_supporters_apos__club_at_Westminster/

Edited March 1, 2016 by BrahimHemdani

[Bluedell 5,351]

There was a cross party group of "Rangers" MP's at Westminster, including the Govan MP Ian Davidson. I belive that Brian Donohoe, recently elected to the Board of RF was the Secretary.

I didn't think Ian Davidson was a Rangers supporter. I know that he's helped out the RST etc on occasions but don't think he's a bear.

 

Also when you say cross-party, I don't recall any being SNP.

Edited March 1, 2016 by Bluedell

[BrahimHemdani 1]

 

There is documented evidence that the regulars of that establishment have indulged in behaviour' date=' which [b']had it been at a football match[/b], would likely have led to them being arrested. That presents a clear case of hypocrisy for a political party who have managed to move beyond even zero tolerance to something akin to a breach of human rights in their zeal to enforce this legislation - as alluded to by Frankie in a previous post.

 

(3)The references in subsection (2)(a) and (b) to a regulated football match include a reference to any place (other than domestic premises) at which such a match is televised; and, in the case of such a place, the references in subsection (2)(a) and (b) to the ground where the regulated football match is being held are to be taken to be references to that place.

 

(4)For the purpose of subsection (2)(a) and (b)—

 

(a)a person may be regarded as having been on a journey to or from a regulated football match whether or not the person attended or intended to attend the match, and

 

(b)a person’s journey includes breaks (including overnight breaks).

 

That party of the legislation is intended to catch such behaviour in a pub; though it only applies in the specified circumstances.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

I didn't think Ian Davidson was a Rangers supporter. I know that he's helped out the RST etc on occasions but don't think he's a bear.

 

Also when you say cross-party, I don't recall any being SNP.

 

I will stand corrected on ID if you say so, although I found this just now on FF:

 

Andy Kerr, MSP for East Kilbride (Labour)

Gregory Campbell, MP for East Londonderry and member of Westminster RSC (DUP)

Ian Davidson, Vice chair of Wesminster RSC and MP for Glasgow South West (Labour)

John Robertson, Chair of Westminster RSC and MP for Glasgow North West. (Labour)

Adam Ingram, Former MP for East Kilbride (Labour)

Jim Wallace, Baron Wallace of Tankerness and member of Westminster RSC (Lib Dem)

Brian Donohoe, MP for Central Ayrshire and Member of Westminster RSC (Labour)

Eleanor Laing, MP for Epping Forest and member of Westminster RSC (Con)

 

http://forum.followfollow.com/archive/index.php/t-755325.html

 

I was quoting the Herald about a "cross party" group.

 

I said at the outset that I do not believe that the team Mr Yousaf supports is relevant to this issue.

 

I certainly would not vote for or not vote for any person to be my MP , MSP or Councillor on the basis of their religion or the football team they support.

Edited March 1, 2016 by BrahimHemdani

[JohnMc 2,483]

I doubt very much that is strictly true John - if you consider the entailment of that statement.

 

Adams has publicly declared he wishes to eradicate all traces of British Culture from Northern Ireland - that manifests itself most visually in the constant attempts to prevent or restrict marches and the restrictions on flying the Union Flag from buildings. How can we be a mirror reflection of a culture' date=' part of which seeks to eradicate our own ?

 

There is documented evidence that the regulars of that establishment have indulged in behaviour, which had it been at a football match, would likely have led to them being arrested. That presents a clear case of hypocrisy for a political party who have managed to move beyond even zero tolerance to something akin to a breach of human rights in their zeal to enforce this legislation - as alluded to by Frankie in a previous post.

 

Im sure if Yousaf wanted to express his empathy with the poor in Govan he could have chosen to have the photo op at a foodbank - rather than in a licensed premises, particularly one with a chequered history of indulging in behaviour contrary to what his party legilslates against.

 

Perhaps the cynic in me would suggest the photo shoot was nothing to do with expresing empathy with the poor but more about securing the Cathlolic vote in Govan.[/quote']

 

You can't use Gerry Adams as representative of the 'Irish'. Individuals might have contrary or challenging political views but that's also true for people who live on the same block as me or indeed post on this messageboard. We're not a mirror reflection, I'm saying we're the same.

 

As for your points about Yousaf you'll find little disagreement from me on any of them, I just don't think it has anything to do with Rangers.

[JohnMc 2,483]

I strongly suspect that my grandfather would not have taken me to see Celtic v Third Lanark.

 

I suspected that myself BH.

[calscot 0]

I suspected that myself BH.

 

But from what you're saying, it seems that "most" people who support Rangers would just as easily give in to family and peer pressure had they been born into a different demographic, and therefore just as easily supported Celtic in different circumstances.

 

I can say for myself that as I chose freely I could easily have chosen Celtic, had the names and colours been switched; however, due to being free I also know who I am and I don't believe it would have lasted long as there would be too much I would feel uncomfortable about.

 

There is plenty I feel uncomfortable about with Rangers and the more extreme supporters but it's at a far lower level than at Celtic.

 

For a start, I could not reconcile the identity not being Scottish. I am uncomfortable about the Northern Irish and English identity some try to slap on Rangers and also with those that put Britishness before Scottishness. However, I'm very comfortable with the mainstream Scottish First and British second identity.

 

I would not be comfortable at all with the Celtic mainstream identity of Irish first, Scottish second and British not at all.

 

I'm not comfortable with the anti-Irish bias at Rangers but it's at a low level, while I don't know how I could reconcile the intense anit-Britishness of Celtic fans, especially as I am British.

 

Then there is the terrorist support, I'm uncomfortable with support for Loyalist paramilitaries, but again it's at a low level, I could never endorse the pro-IRA stance of Celtic.

 

I'm also not comfortable with the religious aspect, but again, I find Rangers generally more secular while Celtic promote their Catholicness, which for a non-Catholic is not only difficult, it seems a lot more extreme a religion than the CoS which is at least somewhat humble and democratic. I'm not a fan of religion at all but the Catholic church seems to be one of those religions that noticeably and continuously, negatively affects the world. I find it more malignant than most. The CoS is pretty benign in comparison. However, I'm not comfortable with the Orange Order connections with Rangers.

 

On a selfish note, I suppose I'd also find it very difficult to support a club where I had little chance of playing due to not being of the correct religion. When I grew up the Celtic team had generally about 8 Catholics in it, in a country with 18% of that religion...

 

There are lots of other reasons why I would be more likely to drop a support of Celtic compared to Rangers, but the point is that as I chose freely, there is almost no chance that under different circumstances I'd be a Celtic supporter today, due to who I am as a person.

 

In the same way, I might not have actually been a Rangers supporter if between 5 and 8 years old, someone started explaining some of the "history" mentioned in this thread to me.

 

I'm hoping there are a load of others like me, rather than "mostly" not.

[Bluedell 5,351]

I will stand corrected on ID if you say so, although I found this just now on FF:

 

Ian Davidson, Vice chair of Wesminster RSC and MP for Glasgow South West (Labour)

 

My understanding is that's more to do with Rangers being in his constituency rather than him being a bear. However it could be that he has adopted us as his team in the last 10 years.

 

Either way it's still a relatively small number of members.

 

 

I was quoting the Herald about a "cross party" group.

I wasn't disagreeing with you but rather clarifying that AFAIK, it wasn't across ALL parties.

[jhunter 0]

Are you sure it's not legal - or is it that it's not a legal requirement to answer?

 

no legal requirement to answer due to their being no grounds for the inquisiton i.e. alighting from a train after a normal journey.

 

as i say it doesn't happen where other crowds have gathered in similar situations

 

T in the park, nightclubs etc.

 

IMO it is down to nothing more than intimidation of football fans