trublusince1982

Tavernier is a great prospect. Really happy with that. Hes the one I mentioned ages ago far better the wabara

Would remove every doubt I had if we signed a few of them other than allan

Halliday Hardie Gallagher.

clearly stated that playing regularly or the standard of player is immaterial. Was talking about how many players have progressed through the club into professional contracts and been promoted to first team squad. Most criteria measured for youth amounts to one game for first team. Inter aim for think if I remember right 1-2 players to play once each year for top team. We actually rank not bad for youth last time I checked admittedly over a year ago. We were top in scotland and outside th top 20 in europe.The criteria was measured as at club from 15-18 and having signed professional contracts for teams in their respective top league so not even including the championship in england. Even the mob who collated the info I emailed were surprised at how well we had done with our budgets. Couldn't get the buggers to include the English championship which would have improved our position dramatically!! Ajax as you mention spend €6m euro a year on their academy and their main aim is to promote 2-3 players into the first team squad every two years. We have promoted far more than that.

How do we buy players next year for greater value than this years? Do we not have to make the extra money this year to pay for it next year? Will season tickets not once again cover football costs while king and co cover the deficit? Promotion will bring more revenue through st sales but that will be reduced by salary rises everything else will be of benefit the following years budgets surely

Durrant on official site at end of interview

Sinnamon also moved up I believe.

Talking about youth players not young players.doesn't matter if they are regulars or sit on the bench they still count as moving up. Those that have went from semi pro contracts to pro and went in as first team squad players. I bet we are very high over the last few years. Walsh, Murdoch,McKay,Gallagher,Hardie ,mcloed off the top of my head. Think there is a few more than that. That's actually a lot mate. As I said the likes of ajax only aim for 2 or 3 every 2 years and they are quite prolific.especially if you count what we spend on our academy in comparison. How many other teams can you think of that have had 5 or more in 2\3 years. Edit* aird sinnamon gasparrato there's more but having a mental block

not at all mate. Don't worry about it.

dont get me wrong i agree with him starting with the spine at the back. Just wondering with the squad size he has mentioned and the amount of players both murray and king expected to come in, if we plan as many more as we all hope.Or if he is planning to do it by stages. if you take away quality and just count bodies we are heavy in the attacking sense if he plays a 4-3-3 with one main striker. do you think we will see any leave or drop back to youth level/loans?

we must be in the top ten teams in europe for the amount of youth we have promoted into the first team squad in the last couple of years. the likes of ajax aim for 2/3 every 2 years to be promoted from youth into first team squad. I know circumstance has dictated but still an impressive amount of youth has progressed.

Do you think he is only maybe signing def players this window? Can see a right back and def mid signed with a couple of loans playing similar roles for cover. we really need a forward in my mind but if he plays one real striker with two winger types wide he may think we have enough presently. Think thompson will go into youths since he was brought in by mullholland, dont think warburton would risk putting his nose out of joint by stealing the boy right of the bat. most likely let him settle at youth then bring him up giving the youth department the kudos.Then again city traders can be ruthless!

do you think that will be on top of loans or including, zappa?

how does everyone see the squad? Have i forgot anyone? Bell foderingham mcgregor zaliuskus wallace sinnamon keirnan wilson law crawford murdoch templeton aird shiels walsh halliday(looks likely) mckay gallagher hardie miller clark 21 players have not included thompson as he and lang are meant for youth.

to be fair zappa i am a prick

no i have stayed true. Where we are is not just the championship its a far bigger picture that encompasses our 3 year goals. You don't build a weak spine then surround it with talent. That's absurd. These signings are the spine of the team. They are not getting replaced next year. For the spine of the team to be made up of cheap freebie players is not good enough and in my opinion will not meet our specified 3 year goals. Large consistent crowds,and euro football qualification,cup runs, championship title and to challenge celtic. I then answer the responses which are basically excuses for cheap players because they are for the championship with better standard down the road for various reasons. I argued the various reasons do not stand up under scrutiny.The reasons being, the level of league,they are good enough for the championship, why spend money to win the championship, we need a share issue, etc. There seems to be this feeling on here that these signings are not typical of what we can expect over the next 3 years and that some time soon we will start spending money to supplement these players. I say that is not what is happening, the signing of this standard added to the current squad will limit our spending ability over the next few years leaving us in a poor position. Basically the foundations are weak therefore the building will sink.Or if you prefer the spine is crooked so the body will not stand up under pressure If your asking me do i think this squad as it stands will win the league this coming season? I would say it will be close and we would most likely need to buy our way out come january. The squad as it stands is weaker than last season and severely lacking in both quality and strength.Do i think the signings of eustace and halliday and a right back will make a difference? it will help secure the championship but nothing more.Do I expect more signings than that this window? no. It looks like we will bring in 3/4 short term loans. The manager will make a difference on last year but i still dont think any manager can change the mentality of some of these players far enough. Law will continue to shy away and the likes of miller will remain past it and so on. Can the youth we have come in and make a huge difference? 50/50 at best. But this is a completely different argument than the standard of signing being good enough to build foundations around.

or a 4-5-1

You are taking a guys opinion and asking us for the sake of your arguement to take it as fact , you fail to factor in what Mark Warburton has said repeatedly and you mis represent what the original poster has said on numerous things . He never compared our signing policy to that of Hibs or Hearts , what he did do was point out the mistakes we mmade whilst highlighting how a team made up of youths and free transfers romped the league by a country mile . He uses this as an reasoning on why our signings are suitable for the here and now and in reasoning why their is no reason to worry As for those on trial and not signing or signing , surely even through your blinkered views its better to give these guys a proper trial period than the way we used to do things , which was that if they could stand and run around a pitch once or twice they were given a contract whether it suited the team or not . The trial is not the problem you miss understand its the standard of signing under debate and the market level we are shopping at. He agian reasons that they are good enough because it one makes finacial sense and two they are good enough to win the championship. I argue both these reasons are wrong. You say the 3 players we signed will not be good enough for the SPFL ,thats your opinon , how you know this as fact escapes me , you say its not sensible to sign these guys up for 3 years yet you also say its not right so sign free transfers , I think you are a wee bit confused as to what you want, the commercial or sporting interest of a free transfer is something that every club in the world now utilise as is the loan market , why we should bve any different is beyon me. I clearly say on the odd transfer this works not as a signing strategy . The chances of finding 7/8 players at the current recruitment level that will be good enough for our future plans is nonsense. If what you assert was true nobody would need to spend any cash we could just all sign free transfers and hit the same hieghts. [b]You again mistake opinion and fact. This is a debating site it is all opinion or an individuals understanding of facts as they are presented.Nobody can read the future. Opinions are formed from weighing the available information against historical data. Freebie signings in the majority will not be good enough. Common sense alone tells us the chances of building a team for near on zero that will be good enough to play in front of 50,000 never mind a rangers crowd is extremely unlikely if not daft. I also explain further reasoning again on common sense. When scrapping the bottom of the market financially it does not make financial sense when trying to build foundations for a quality future. This again is obvious. Cheap is cheap for a reason. It can neither be relied on or turned into diamonds with enough regularity to eccourage any belief in its success as a buisness strategy.[/b] You act as if this is a new idea we have already reaped the benefits of cheap freebie signings that we expected to flourish at this level how did it workout? And you end up with the usual dig at King , how many times guys like you need to be told that there is a share issue coming up is beyond me and gets tiresome . This is just pathetic. Are we not allowed to talk about anything to do with king without these usual crap analogies. The guy made a public promise for backing, it has nothing to do with liking the guy or not. Its to do with the facts as they are presented. How many times do you need to be told there is not a share issue coming up at this point or pencilled in for any date. Its still up in the air.How many times do you need to be told we do not need a share issue for them to invest? Again can you answer why it is the best policy for Rangers to wait until a share issue can be arranged while the transfer window closes and we are left with a squad worse than last season? Can you answer how do we build foundations for a better future without cash now? Are we just treading water until then? when do you think is the best time to start building and sorting the problems? six months from now? 12 months? or right now? I have made my opinion clear. The time is now the excuses for waiting hold no water whatsoever. Like I said your post is just a ramble of your opinions which contradict themselves , we have a management team that knows what they are looking for but you know better , why you didnt get the job is something we will all just have to live with I guess . The debate is not whether warburton knows what he is doing it is on whether we are giving him the tools needed to succeed and meet the levels targeted. but good try at deflection since i miss understand can you clear one thing up for me. I state that the current transfer levels being freebies and very very cheap acquisitions(£200k) is not good enough to attain our goals of large continuous crowds and european qualification within the next 3 years. So am i wrong in stating you must therefore believe one of two things? 1. the sigings level as it stands is good enough to achieve stated goals. 2. you do not know enough to form an opinion either way if its two that means you don't know enough to form an opinion but you know enough to know someone elses opinion is wrong. very clever think the difference between me and you is I try to form my opinions on the here and now, while you want to include the promised land that is always just around the next corner.

I have read it. Its full of holes that ignore actions and comments from those involved while trying to fit actions to a pre conceived outcome. It screams of being unable to face reality while making the excuse of "its okay because it will be enough to pass the present test so lets not worry about tomorrows". While not understanding that setting foundations for a better future takes more than just doing enough to win the championship. I also clearly answer why it would make sense to buy high quality players for the league we are in now. think you should read mine again it clearly answers each statement posed and questions asked by the rm poster.

we are not signing players for the championship as the players have said themselves ,that's why they are getting 3+ year deals. They are players for promotion and europe, they are also for the cup runs this year. Any money spent is with future resale in mind and also should be of a standard to play next year if we go up. There is absolutely no reason to not sign them now if the money and players are available. We would still make returns if being prudent while setting better quality foundations and increasing commercial incomes. We have no idea why those on trial have not signed yet they could be weighing up offers or negotiating contracts or wanting more money than we can offer but are willing to wait and see what other offers they get. That or the players might not be of the standard warburton ideally wants but maybe the best on offer today until other interests are clarified. Nobody knows. measuring ourselves or signings against the standard hearts or hibs have/had is quite frankly a disgrace. we should not be shopping in the same market as them with the same outlooks or wanting to be anyway shape or form on a comparable standard. We should always demand the best we can get not just enough to get by on the short term. Next season we lose another 3 or 4 players and now have 3 signings contracted for 3 years that are unlikely to be anywhere good enough to challenge them or qualify for group stage europe(where the money is). That's not sensible its short termism at best. Every other team out-with(historically) the old firm have for years followed this same transfer policy ,why would we be able to achieve better with the same? All this transfer policy will bring is a standard achieved by the likes of aberdeen and the rest of the no marks who fail to qualify for europe every year how is it financially sensible to rely on freebie players that do not attract either the commercial or sporting interest that bigger names would? When building for a better future being cheap is not financially sensible. All we will have to do is once again start from scratch. It looks to me along with what the board has said that we are going to go with what we have and come january if we are not winning and the majority of st money is cleared we will then spend to ensure promotion. pretty much the definition of only aiming to do enough. That's not building its scrapping by for the time being. Would explain why we are loaning players and not spending any significant amount right now, the season ticket money doesn't clear all at once it is spread out past the window so we wont do anything major till jan and only if necessary . KIng has absolutely no excuse along with the others for not putting money in now as promised. Doesn't need to be as much as the quoted 5 million. According to king if players can be identified he will stump up, well then no excuse get it done.

he plays def mid all the time it is his position. He plays there for england too. Were he thinks is his best position is irrelevant. Your going to hate this year then. Warburton will play players in different positions how do you think he manages with a small squad?

just me and those in charge.

His best performances come in that position. It gives him the space to utilise the ball better. For me his main attribute is making himself available and spreading the play. Hes better with the game in front of him. He has played more attacking through the middle but I think he is more of a threat when he has time to pick the pass. That and we are crying out for someone to take the ball from the defence and make things happen. What position did he say he sees himself playing?

in your magic fairy world why is it you think we are using loans instead of buying? Everyone a moron?

our talent that just got beat by spurs reserves? If we stick to what we can seemingly afford then will continue to regress while our finances shrink. we need to grow our revenue streams, that means in the short term we must come up with ways to encourage the support to grow.The club first has to make money to then spend it, its obvious that is the only way, the investment we expected for whatever reason is obviously not there, or we would be signing players good enough. Signing freebie players of the current standard will never cut it, thats not progress is stagnation. Until we have money to spend on transfers that are of a calibre likely to encourage large consistent crowds we must utilise other teams who can afford surplus better than our players. Welcome to the financial reality of our situation.