Prso doubtful

[gersfem 0]

What are you on about Cammy? I haven't been calling everyone fickel...

 

So saying you want to get rid of your season ticket because your team aren't playing well isn't fickel?

 

Also I don't see the insult, I didn't even call gersfem fickle, I said she came across as fickle - which she does. I was trying to point out to her that maybe she's not acting in true character and should think again.

 

I also pointed out that I was in no position to judge - did you read that? Or were the Cammy filters on?

 

Cammy for someone who goes on and on about personal attacks, why are you personally attacking me?

 

Your post has absolutely no relevance to anything and is completely petty. I've argued with you over a few points on the forum and your nose is obviously well out of joint.

 

Get a grip for god's sake.

 

 

Do you know what calscot you are probably right. I actually wouldn't give my season ticket up for anything in the world.

 

It has taken me years to get back to Ibrox to watch the team i love. That �£1,200 didn't come easy and we have had scrape by to pay for them and all the other tickets that are coming up,we will have to scrape by to pay them aswell.

 

What actually pisses me off is coming onto boards like this and reading post after post about certain players not trying hard enough when in all honesty they haven't been given a chance to prove themselves as yet.

 

Also as i have says in another post that there has been to much hype going round about PLG. If people honestly believe we are going to win the league, UEFA CUP , CIS cup then i think they are they are seriously going to have to a backward step and look seriously to what is actually happeing at our club

[calscot 0]

Well, its the thrid time I've seen you imply someone on here is 'fickel'

 

I don't recall that, but when a person changes their mind quickly, the word "fickle" comes to mind. It doesn't have to be an insult, usually I would use it to point out that someone is being inconsistent and while that is not a crime, it does tend to water down any of their arguments or convictions.

 

Basically it is a challenge that says, "if you want me to take you seriously, you have to show me how you are being consistent."

 

Nope - its called freedom of choice

 

Freedom of choice does not exclude fickleness and in fact by definition fickle people use freedom of choice more than others...

 

Maybe Gersfem (along with others) have given it serious thought. Maybe they are p155ed of working like c*nts to save up enough money to go and watch Rangers to contiunally be served up dross. Maybe, like most working class families, the �£1000 pounds they spend annually, could be put to 'better use' for the family. Maybe they can no longer afford the �£34 pounds for OF tickets, �£350 pounds for same day trip to Molde, �£25 pounds for games in Edinburgh, 3 away games on the trot. Some might try actually trying to follow Rangers - pay the money we pay, have the hassle we have from Police, Stewards etc - yoiu don't get that from your �£100 package from Sentanta.

 

That could all be true and gersfem just needed to say that. That's why I said she was coming across as fickle as that was the interpretation of the information she gave. I did not call her fickle as I don't know the whole story. I'm a forum reader, not a mind reader.

 

 

So you are in no position to judge, but you just had to reply and call gersfem 'fickel'

 

I didn't call her fickle, I said she came across fickle. Cammy, I am 100% positive that if it was me instead of gersfem writing that post, you would be replying calling me a fickle fan.

 

I said it sounded fickle because it did. Maybe by hearing that gersfem could challenge it and use that to clarify her decision to herself.

 

It does have relevance - as for my nose being out of joint, why would it be? It appears that it is your nose that is out of joint, I haven't and wouldn't call supporters of this club fickel or lecture them on how best to follow Rangers.

 

So you don't write the CammyF rants then? Haven't you just been lecturing me on what I can say and what I can't even though you never read my words properly?

 

You seem to think fickle is a terrible accusation, even when it isn't an accusation.

 

My nose probably is out of joint not surprising when I get a petty, personal attack.

 

 

Why? Because I don't agree with you. Sorry, from now on, I'll not disagree with anything you say oh worthy master - I now 'have a grip'...

Cammy F

 

Pot calling kettle. I actually like it when people disagree with me, as long as they are open minded to other opinions and like to debate things rationally and with reasoned arguments. I've had many good debates with people which is why I'm here.

 

But that's not your style Cammy, and you've admitted that no-one can change your mind on a subject no matter how good their argument and it shows. You argue subjectively and to win at all costs which is why I find you difficult.

 

You always seem to have an agenda which is why instead of discussing the fickle point you went straight on a personal attack and accused me of thinking EVERYONE was fickle except me.

 

Yeah, Cammy, you're the voice of reason...

[CammyF 6,891]

I don't recall that, but when a person changes their mind quickly, the word "fickle" comes to mind. It doesn't have to be an insult, usually I would use it to point out that someone is being inconsistent and while that is not a crime, it does tend to water down any of their arguments or convictions.

 

Basically it is a challenge that says, "if you want me to take you seriously, you have to show me how you are being consistent."

 

Wrong again, you claimed I was fickle due to the fact that you 'assumed' I want short term wins over long term success. That is despite the fact that I have, for 4 years, continually asked David Murray to divert all available funds to Youth Development. Very fickle and short-termism you'll agree

 

You then assumed that Gersfem was fickle for a one-off rant about handing back her ticket - something she is perfectly entitled to do. Maybe it is what you or I would do, but hey, some of us have a different opinion.

 

Cammy, I am 100% positive that if it was me instead of gersfem writing that post, you would be replying calling me a fickle fan.

 

Bullshit - I have never, and will never dictate to anyone how best to support Rangers. We have all differing views, opinions etc, we are all entitled to them. If a fan wants to hand back theire ticket, what business it of mine?

 

So you don't write the CammyF rants then?

 

I use my rants to portray my opinion on Rangers and other events. Do I expect everyone to agree with them? Do I fook, in fact, I would worry if most people did as I class myself as 'way-out there'. I also publish them to provoke debate and encourage people to rip them apart as they see fit.

 

Haven't you just been lecturing me on what I can say and what I can't even though you never read my words properly?

 

Nope, never lecutured you - just don't expect me (or anyone else) to sit back whilst you assume the worst in other people. I encourage debate on my threads, you seem to oppose debate and don't like other replying if they don't agree with you - or assume that they are fickle or that their noses are out of joint.

 

Pot calling kettle. I actually like it when people disagree with me, as long as they are open minded to other opinions and like to debate things rationally and with reasoned arguments. I've had many good debates with people which is why I'm here.

So you are selective in your liking of people who disagree with you. I'm not, anyone is free to disagree with me, everyone is free to have a differing opinion from me, they are also free to say so on the forum without me calling them fickle, or that their nose is out of joint or that they aren't 'reasoned and rational.

 

But that's not your style Cammy, and you've admitted that no-one can change your mind on a subject no matter how good their argument and it shows. You argue subjectively and to win at all costs which is why I find you difficult.

 

This isn't a compitition Calscot, there are no winners and losers whilst debating the merits of a football club. As for changing my opinion, I have on many subjects including Rangers signing Catholics, David Murray, songs that we sing etc, etc. The reason I changed my mind, listening and reading posts by fellow supporters. Very closed-minded of me. As for being difficult, so what, and why should I be any different? If you find me difficult, you expect me to change just for your sake? Jeez...

 

You always seem to have an agenda which is why instead of discussing the fickle point you went straight on a personal attack and accused me of thinking EVERYONE was fickle except me.

 

The only agenda I have is to ensure that Rangers Football Club are the best they can be - make no apologies for that, I am afraid

 

Yeah, Cammy, you're the voice of reason...

Never have and never will claim that I am - just one voice amoungst 10000000's

 

Cammy F

[calscot 0]

Do you know what calscot you are probably right. I actually wouldn't give my season ticket up for anything in the world.

 

To be honest I'd have been very surprised if you did. So were you being sarcastic? That would make sense.

 

It has taken me years to get back to Ibrox to watch the team i love. That �£1,200 didn't come easy and we have had scrape by to pay for them and all the other tickets that are coming up,we will have to scrape by to pay them aswell.

 

yes they are expensive and not always very good value for money, but I'm sure you weighed it all up before you bought them.

 

What actually pisses me off is coming onto boards like this and reading post after post about certain players not trying hard enough when in all honesty they haven't been given a chance to prove themselves as yet.

 

But that's what the board is for and to be fair if some of the players were trying their best, then their best is just not good enough. If that team was trying then we definitely need a new team. I would hope they are better than that and it was a combination of Hibs on fire, too many of our players off form at the same time and few not used to trying their best in every game.

 

They also have a chance to prove themselves every time they walk on the park.

 

Also as i have says in another post that there has been to much hype going round about PLG. If people honestly believe we are going to win the league, UEFA CUP , CIS cup then i think they are they are seriously going to have to a backward step and look seriously to what is actually happeing at our club

 

Belief in winning everything is the Rangers way no matter who the manager is. I still think we have a chance in all competitions, but I know it will take time although time is starting to run out...

 

I was hoping that we'd have improved from the first few games and the Hibs game was not the type of performance I expected from our new manager - ever.

 

We still have to give him time but some people are starting to suspect he underestimated the Scottish league and some of his signings are not yet performing to even an SPL level - the trouble is we have no replacements for the likes of Svensson.

 

Ultimately we have no choice but to be patient for moment.

[CammyF 6,891]

And if anyone has retained interest in the thread, and it's original topic, Clement is out of the OF game on Saturday and Prso is struggling to be fit - source is Radio Snyde and Evening Times.

 

Cammy F

[calscot 0]

Wrong again, you claimed I was fickle due to the fact that you 'assumed' I want short term wins over long term success. That is despite the fact that I have, for 4 years, continually asked David Murray to divert all available funds to Youth Development. Very fickle and short-termism you'll agree

 

 

Exactly, that's why you sound fickle when you sound like you are not prepared to wait for the present young team to develop, maybe your are but you didn't sound it. I may have mis-assumed a meaning from your post but I can only interpret what I read, like I said I'm a forum reader not a mind reader.

 

Instead of going on the attack you could easily have explained what you really meant and we would probably have been agreeing to agree.

 

You then assumed that Gersfem was fickle for a one-off rant about handing back her ticket - something she is perfectly entitled to do. Maybe it is what you or I would do, but hey, some of us have a different opinion.

 

Ironically Cammy you are assuming my assumptions about Gersfem, and despite me clarifying for you on several occasions your assumptions are still wrong so why are you spreading them?

 

Bullshit - I have never, and will never dictate to anyone how best to support Rangers. We have all differing views, opinions etc, we are all entitled to them. If a fan wants to hand back theire ticket, what business it of mine?

 

And where did I dictate to anyone? I don't see one command in my post. How do you dictate to someone by asking questions and pointing out how things look? And if I do that, what business is that of yours?

 

Am I not entitled to my opinion on anything anyone says in this forum or is it just you?

 

What business is it of yours how often I put the word "fickle" in a post? Do I not have freedom of choice? You definitely seem to think that "fickle" is a heinous insult.

 

I use my rants to portray my opinion on Rangers and other events. Do I expect everyone to agree with them? Do I fook, in fact, I would worry if most people did as I class myself as 'way-out there'. I also publish them to provoke debate and encourage people to rip them apart as they see fit.

 

Except for me eh?

 

Nope, never lecutured you - just don't expect me (or anyone else) to sit back whilst you assume the worst in other people. I encourage debate on my threads, you seem to oppose debate and don't like other replying if they don't agree with you - or assume that they are fickle or that their noses are out of joint.

 

Cammy, should I sit back while you assume the worst in me? Even though I've explained things to you, you continue to use something as fact that is not even true and that you have no way of knowing.

 

You think I oppose debate? Have you read my posts? You seem to be making a whole load of stuff up about me, you think you know me better than myself?

 

If I don't agree with someone, I write about why I think they've got it wrong. I try to back up my arguments with evidence and with explanations of my own thinking which may contain things they haven't thought about. I'm usually polite and put in a lot of reasoning. I think I'm actually quite well known for this on the forum. That, I would say is the nature of debate.

 

I would say your style is completely different.

 

So you are selective in your liking of people who disagree with you. I'm not, anyone is free to disagree with me, everyone is free to have a differing opinion from me, they are also free to say so on the forum without me calling them fickle, or that their nose is out of joint or that they aren't 'reasoned and rational.

 

I'm selective of my liking of people generally. I don't know you enough to say whether I like you or not, but I don't like it where you seem to always turn a debate with me into a fight.

 

Cammy, can you truthfully look back on your original post and say that you entered the debate in good spirit? Have you really been encouraging debate on this thread?

 

This isn't a compitition Calscot,

 

I realise that, but wonder if you do.

 

there are no winners and losers

 

I disagree with you there, and I personally prefer it when it's win-win all round. That's when we've all had a decent debate. It seems to be lose-lose today.

 

whilst debating the merits of a football club. As for changing my opinion, I have on many subjects including Rangers signing Catholics, David Murray, songs that we sing etc, etc. The reason I changed my mind, listening and reading posts by fellow supporters. Very closed-minded of me. As for being difficult, so what, and why should I be any different? If you find me difficult, you expect me to change just for your sake? Jeez...

 

Cammy life is all about changing to help the channels of communication. You can't be difficult and then expect an easy ride from everyone. You don't have to change for me, but if you thought about it, it might be in your interest to do so, we could have some cracking debates...

[calscot 0]

And if anyone has retained interest in the thread, and it's original topic, Clement is out of the OF game on Saturday and Prso is struggling to be fit - source is Radio Snyde and Evening Times.

 

Cammy F

 

Yes, my fault for questioning whether chucking in a season ticket was good for the team.

 

Perhaps a new thread should be started to allow people to avoid the off topic posts?

[craig 5,199]

And if anyone has retained interest in the thread, and it's original topic, Clement is out of the OF game on Saturday and Prso is struggling to be fit - source is Radio Snyde and Evening Times.

 

Cammy F

 

Yeah, any chance we can get this thread back on topic ???

 

Clemnet is a real blow as I feel he would have had the drive, determination and engine to test the Celtic midfield on Saturday - looks like we will have Fergie and Hemdani in there and we know they have struggled in the same team in the past.

 

Hope I am wrong but I fear for our chances on Saturday

[pete 2,499]

WaW what a read ma head is buzz'n. Lets just not forget one thing we all come on here because of our love for Rangers.

 

Clement is long term as Cammy said but Prso will be fit.

 

I would go for a 4 man midfield.

 

Burke-------Hemdani--------Fergie------Rae

 

I think Martin is a luxury we can't afford against the tims.

[stewarty 1,878]

Would rather see Charlie Adam on the left hand side than Rae.