pete

I have to admit I find it absurd that players bring their kids on to the park. What is the reason behind it apart from "look what Papa has done" I hope they ban it . It is total feel good bullshit that the kids have nothing to do with. Let them pick up some handicapped children to parade around with.

Can I ask if Trialist 4 for the 20's is the same person as trialist 4 for the 17's?

Forever the optimist!

At least Wales had a couple of good games. Portugal are in the final and have done totally nothing. Yesterday they did not even break sweat. I hope they get pumped in the final for been crap and also sooooo obnoxious.

Spanish law is crazy in some situations. The pickpockets of Barcelona are renowned. The law states if they have not stolen over 400 euro's then there is a mandatory fine of 26 euro's. The pickpockets happily accept their fine and move on to the next customer.

If you have an electronic system it may also be possible for supporters with season tickets who can't attend to put their seat open to be sold as an on the day ticket. I am not sure if that is possible but I would rather see the club getting money for my seat as it lying empty.

Craig your wife is doing better than you on the predictions and you call yourself a ram. More like a lamb to the slaughter!

Let me be clear. I am saying nothing as fact as it is my opinion and I am not in a position to say anything as fact. If i said that RBR wanted club 1872 to fail then I apologise. Am I correct in saying he voted against the motion to go forward at the time of the vote? It would seem reading from the C1872 statement the people that resigned did not bring any of their complaints up within the group. That was the place to try and iron out any grievances they had. I agree with BD(I think) that statement should have come from the RF board and not C1872. I will say though I don't see that the time span to the release of a statement in reaction to the newspaper article as incorrect. A normal way of working (in my opinion) would have been to keep things internal and inform it's members via an E-mail and via their website. Statements in newspapers are certainly not the correct way to inform members of the resignations For the rest it is just your opinion and mine. I can imagine that mistakes have been made but this is a learning curve for all involved. I can't be bothered getting into a " You can't say this because it could be that" kind of argument. I think most are in agreement that fan unity is a fantastic step. Whether it should it have been delayed is a matter of opinion. I personally think it would have caused more problems and I think it is now a moot point. All that it brings now is a feel good factor of "I told you so" If things do go wrong. It is now better to move on and accept that the wheels are in motion. For the rest I will agree to disagree with you on the subject as I feel I have been going round in circles.

I didn't mean to insinuate that you wanted it to fail and I don't think I have said that. You wanted it delayed. What would that have brought? Personally I think it would only have brought more indecision. When you are standing on the high diving plank then mostly suspending an immediate dive means you will be going back down the stairs. While small things may have been sorted out the main thrust of support may have been lost. The boards had the backing of 90% of members it would have been crazy not to take the plunge and wait. How long should they have waited? Personally I think that would of only have brought a loss of support.

Sorry Craig but club 1872 is being set up. That was the wish of 90% of members of both organisations. The fact that a small portion of the remaining 10% are shit stirring doesn't mean everything is a shambles as is being made out. It is obvious some people have an agenda to make it look like that.It was always likely that mistakes would be made if they have been made. I am not sure why you think RBR's prophetic insight is correct as the people that matter, namely the RF\RST boards seem to think that the building bricks are being put nicely in place. I suppose it is who and what a person wants to believe they will back.

Some players feel the club they leave should have a fee for them. Actually shows he has a loyalty to the club that brought him on. Unlucky for us but not a bad personality character really.

RANGERS will have to stump up for Finnish youngster Serge Atakayi after the winger signed a new one-year deal BEFORE jetting in to Glasgow for a trial. The 17-year old Congo-born player agreed a contract extension with Finnish club FF Jaro just before heading to Murray Park. Atakayi, who can play on either flank, has already spent a week on trial with English Premier League champions Leicester City earlier this year and has had three trial spells with Fulham. Rangers moved quickly to bring the youngster, who holds the record of being the youngest player to score in Finnish football, to Scotland having sent scouts to watch him in his last two matches. A statement on the FF Jaro website said: "Serge Atakayi has made an agreement with FF Jaro on a contract extension. "The agreement runs until the end of the period in 2017.

Shit I thought I was finished with this argument. I didn't read between the lines therefore I didn't get your explosion about the Whyte and Green that you have now explained but did not in your original post. Yes we should be careful on what is happening. Did the board of RF have a duty to publish resignation letters? I doubt that but that is my opinion. 3 I would only be guessing to go to deep into that argument and have no idea if it is breaking company rules or not. My opinion is if I asked for a members list and received one I would expect it to be up to date or at least within a couple of months as people are paying monthly. If the director knew that it was wrong when on the board of RF and nothing was done to bring it up to date then maybe it is better he resigned. 4 Your opinion and my opinion and there are always people who don't like change. I don't know anything about these people the same as you probably don't. I got my opinion from reading the letters. You obviously see them in another light. 5 Again it is your opinion and my opinion without inside knowledge, and there is a core of people who are against RF being amalgamated. If the directors are amongst that group I have no idea but it would not be the first time people went onto a board to try and stop change or just to get their meaning across. People also leave a board because they are outvoted and can't accept the majority vote. There are many reasons they could have left for. One thing is certain life will go on without them. 6 RBR stated himself he did not want it to go through at the time it did that he wanted to wait so take that point up with him.

I'll agree with that!

Well it looks to me like they sorted it out as C1872 is now a fact. Did they have to write an essay on how they were going to achieve that goal. The methods on how they were going to do it were possibly decided after they got the go ahead. You are making a mountain out of a molehill imho. And again the boards had a right to appoint a working party without an election. If you don't like it take your money back out or stop paying in to it. Its as easy as that.

What power? It is a working party. So you think this working party marched up to the boards of the RF\RST and said we are taking over? It was well known before the RF board election that it would go over to C1872, so yes they knew they would be handing over power at some stage. The RST\RF boards keep power until a C1872 board has been elected that is where you are missing the point I think. I would imagine if the boards were not still in control all directors would have resigned with a Tsunami of complaint and indeed there would be no point in them being there. The boards must have put the working party in place and therefore the directors must have played a part in that decision.

Yes they will have to put report back to the two boards before anything is decided I would imagine. The 2 boards will have to rubber stamp all decisions I would imagine.

Boards are elected to make decisions. I guess both boards together decided to take the route of a working party. They have the right to make that decision without putting it to a members vote. Maybe they should also put it to the members who has to set the coffee before the meetings start. 90+% of members from both organisations(IIRR) gave the green light for to go further in setting up an amalgamated supporters group. Maybe you misunderstood what the vote was about. If you feel aggrieved that you had no say in electing a working party then you should have put yourself up for election to get on the board. Then you would have had your say. I will say it once more the boards of the RF\RST had the right to make a decision on choosing a working party of people they thought were capable. It would have been crazy to put that up for open election as people who have no experience could have been chosen. I will bow out now as I need to do some work and I feel I am hitting my head against a brick wall.

As I said before the boards of the RF\RST have the right to elect a WP. Expecting them to be open for general election is crazy(Sorry it is) The WP also has no responsibility on keeping members informed of what they are doing. The WP has a responsibility to keep the boards of the RF\RST up to date on all they are doing and it is both boards of the separate organisations to keep their members up to date. Once all has been amalgamated and seen to be up and running then the boards of the RF\RST will become redundant and elections should take place. Don't forget 90+% of members gave the green light for the wheels to be put in motion so I don't really see where you think it is all so wrong.

Should a working party be voted on by all the members? Personally I doubt that. The RF\RST board members were voted on to take decisions like that and I guess they chose people who were fit for that purpose. You are saying it is a shambles but do you have insight into the work the WP has done? As for the decrease in membership, I would say that was to be expected as some people would be against the new group. I remember people burning their scarves when we signed a catholic and saying Ibrox would be empty. After the dust settles people will be signing on to club 1872 and the other organizations will be forgotten or at least become history. As for club 1872 being an idea from the club is doubtful as that idea has been around as far as I can remember. The working group or the club cannot dictate the road that will be taken in the future that will be an elected board voted on by the members. You are saying things should not have been rushed through but you are wanting the WP to rush through with their work. As for members disappearing I have saw you in regular contact with Christine so it did not look like she was hiding. Fury has also given answers on the forums. As for e-mail addresses I have no idea I have never used any.

Just a couple of questions. Was the working party not answerable to the boards of RF and RST? Has there been regular feedback from the WP to both boards? Who gave the green light for the launch of club 1872? Surely that was a decision of the RF and RST board members as there is no way a WP could sanction this. If it was the RF\RST boards then there must have been a majority vote in both board rooms to go ahead and the directors would have been a part of that vote. I will agree if the WP made these decisions on their own then the directors do have a case

Craig sorry this is crap. What has Craig Whyte and Charles Green got to do with it? You also say in your first post it is easy to read between the lines. If you do that you are reading what you want to read. It was surely known to the directors that their role at RF would be a decreasing responsibility. A huge majority voted to go down a new road and a group was set up to achieve that purpose. The self interest accusations came firstly from the directors who resigned. The members list seems to be a huge issue with them but surely it is the members list that RF have been using and was passed on from the RF board that these members were a part of. Or was a made up list passed on to the working group? These resignations seem to me to be of people who are reserved in accepting change and losing their control which they knew would happen. It is obvious there was a small minority out to scuttle this from the beginning and it would seem to me they are picking up every stick they can to push between the cogwheels of change. RBR admits he has been against it from the start so it is no surprise he is running with the baton of the old group. The one thing I agree with is that there should be open elections as soon as possible but who decides the time span for this. Only the working group have an insight into how far down the road they are of presenting a stable and good running supporters group. If they hand over the reigns with only half the work done they will be murdered for not doing their job properly. Everyone knew there would and will be teething problems and you get whispering shadows and unsatisfied people in every club that is a way of life.

You are ready to support anything coming from that corner of course.

You are correct it is 3 there is no 3\4 play-off.

Is there no 3\4 place play- off? If not then indeed 3