Proposal for a membership scheme

[Fury 0]

I'm sorry but I think this confuses share ownership and a membership scheme once again.

 

Unless the Club ceases to be a plc, the only way to gain "control" is to buy sufficient shares, ergo the current battle amongst the investors. RST raised £250k when the chips were down, very commendable but doesn't look at what is needed.

 

If you started with a blank sheet of paper, then the German model is what most fans would go for, I'm sure; sadly we don't have a blank sheet of paper.

 

But a large membership base would be powerful and influential and could gain Board seats depending on the size of the membership; ultimately the legal structure of the Club might change but I don't see that happening any time soon.

 

SDM could have given the fans his shares for £1 but the fans didn't have £30M to invest (of course neither did CW, but that is another story).

 

Masterton & Co wrote off all their debt which is why the fans now own Dunfermline; but the bigger the Club the harder it would be to make that happen, can't see people like CG doing that any time soon, can you? Of course Craig Whyte promised..............

 

Agreed. I think the two things should be kept separate. Many fans have no interest in fan ownership or building up a shareholding but would still want their voice to be heard and to be a member of the club.

[Zappa 0]

I love the concept of a membership scheme, but the basic proposal for initial circulation needs to be further developed than what you've posted in the OP Brahim. Tannochsidebear's contribution in post #21 demonstrated this perfectly.

 

Personally, I don't see the point in circulating a half-baked proposal around the different forums because a lot of fans like the idea of a membership scheme, but they want to see a thorough, well thought-out and 100% viable plan.

 

To be frank with you on another aspect of this too Brahim, I don't think you're the right man to start and/or lead the charge for such a membership scheme. The reason I say that, is that ideally, a well planned membership scheme would at the very least get the public blessing of the RST and threads about the scheme would be allowed to stay on FF for promotion and discussion. That's never going to happen with your name involved though and you know that all too well.

 

It's all fine and well to say let's put the past to bed and move forward together for the good of the club, but the bad blood between you and some of the people in the RST combined with the whole John Bennett saga will mean a membership proposal with your name involved is never going to last longer than a few minutes on FF. That's an unacceptable handicap for any such scheme.

Edited August 15, 2013 by Zappa

[BrahimHemdani 1]

Agreed. I think the two things should be kept separate. Many fans have no interest in fan ownership or building up a shareholding but would still want their voice to be heard and to be a member of the club.

 

Exactly so.

[chilledbear 16]

After posting the Proposal on FF and see it pulled after about 15 minutes, I would probably agree with Zappa.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

I love the concept of a membership scheme, but the basic proposal for initial circulation needs to be further developed than what you've posted in the OP Brahim. Tannochsidebear's contribution in post #21 demonstrated this perfectly.

 

Personally, I don't see the point in circulating a half-baked proposal around the different forums because a lot of fans like the idea of a membership scheme, but they want to see a thorough, well thought-out and 100% viable plan.

 

To be frank with you on another aspect of this too Brahim, I don't think you're the right man to start and/or lead the charge for such a membership scheme. The reason I say that, is that ideally, a well planned membership scheme would at the very least get the public blessing of the RST and threads about the scheme would be allowed to stay on FF for promotion and discussion. That's never going to happen with your name involved though and you know that all too well.

 

It's all fine and well to say let's put the past to bed and move forward together for the good of the club, but the bad blood between you and some of the people in the RST combined with the whole John Bennett saga will mean a membership proposal with your name involved is never going to last longer than a few minutes on FF. That's an unacceptable handicap for any such scheme.

 

Thank you for your frank comments.

 

The OP wasn't meant to be a fully fledged proposal, if it was this wouldn't have been the place to launch it. It was a broad outline of some ideas and there have been many useful comments including those from TB, which I acknowledged in terms of the fees etc and amended the OP accordingly. However I think you could have made your point without referring to it as

half-baked

, which is quite derogatory.

 

I am not sure I agree with you about needing the

public blessing of the RST

(when what you really mean, at least in relation to FF, is the public blessing of Mr Dingwall).

 

I am certainly prepared to move on for the good of the Club and find it deeply regrettable that apparently others are not like minded. If an idea has merit, then surely a major forum should allow it to be discussed, regardless of any enmity towards the proposer, anything else only weakens that forum IMHO.

 

However, I don't see that that means that I can't propose a membership scheme and am comforted by the fact that 20 people (including your good self) have thanked me for the OP, which is a very high number for this forum, as I'm sure you will agree.

Edited August 15, 2013 by BrahimHemdani
to include Zappa!

[Zappa 0]

Thank you for your frank comments.

 

The OP wasn't meant to be a fully fledged proposal, if it was this wouldn't have been the place to launch it.

 

A fully fledged proposal is what's required though, but I agree with UCF2008 and Fury that now is not the time to launch one and I agree with you that this isn't the place to launch it. A full membership proposal needs to be launched by the club AFTER the current boardroom (and ownership?) shambles is sorted out. It would ideally be launched by the club on the official site and through all of the club's official channels, including the hugely popular @RFC_Official twitter account.

 

It was a broad outline of some ideas and there have been many useful comments including those from TB, which I acknowledged in terms of the fees etc and amended the OP accordingly. However I think you could have made your point without referring to it as "half-baked" which is quite derogatory.

 

I didn't intend to be derogatory though, I only meant to be truthful. In my 5 years on Gersnet I've seen various people post proposals just like your OP a dozen times, maybe more and some of them have even been more detailed. I just expect better from a man with your experience and knowledge of these things, especially given that you've previously worked with Supporters Direct and closely with other fan power organisations.

 

I am not sure I agree with you about needing the "public blessing of the RST" (when what you really mean, at least in relation to FF, is the public blessing of Mr Dingwall).

 

No that's not what I meant at all. You can dress it up any way you like Alan, but a membership scheme proposal needs the public blessing of ALL fan groups and forums, so that's why the only viable way for one to be initiated is through the club & it's official fan liaison channels and only once there's people running the club who the fans trust.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

I didn't intend to be derogatory though, I only meant to be truthful. In my 5 years on Gersnet I've seen various people post proposals just like your OP a dozen times, maybe more and some of them have even been more detailed. I just expect better from a man with your experience and knowledge of these things, especially given that you've previously worked with Supporters Direct and closely with other fan power organisations.

 

The OP came out of rbr's original thread highlighting AB's article, a one hour meeting with AB and some batting back and forward of the text and I can only repeat that it wasn't meant to be anything more than testing the waters in very general terms. One of the reasons why I referred to next season was that it would take a lot of time to get it right and in one of the posts I did suggest that a working party be set up to take it forward. Another reason that I alluded to was that hopefully some stability would have returned to the board room by then.

 

A fully worked up proposal would require weeks if not months of work and rightly or wrongly we thought that this might be a good time to start the ball rolling.

 

Thank you for your confidence in my experience; certainly I could help to produce a working document or at least certain aspects of it beginning with a constitution and regardless of your comments would be more than happy to help but I am getting the message loud and clear.

 

 

the only viable way for one to be initiated is through the club & it's official fan liaison channels and only once there's people running the club who the fans trust.

 

I absolutley agree with that and I did refer to various channels e.g. web site, programmes, magazines, supporters clubs, Assembly, Asscoiation, Trust, NARSA etc etc, as a means to do it at little or no cost to the Club.

[Zappa 0]

Thank you for your confidence in my experience; certainly I could help to produce a working document or at least certain aspects of it beginning with a constitution and regardless of your comments would be more than happy to help but I am getting the message loud and clear.

 

Don't take my word for it Alan. I've given you my opinion that I don't think you're the right man to lead the charge for a membership scheme, but I could be completely wrong. Indeed, I often AM completely wrong and not afraid or too proud to admit it when it occurs either.

 

Still, I stand by my point and it's not for selfish reasons because I certainly couldn't organise a membership scheme myself. I've made the point for the good of any such scheme because to my mind, there's certain names amongst our support which if involved with the organisation of a membership scheme, could be detrimental to it by association. The fact that you claimed to have been intimidated and even threatened following the John Bennett saga last year, should tell you that perhaps your name is on that list, albeit not necessarily at the top of it.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

The fact that you claimed to have been intimidated and even threatened following the John Bennett saga last year, should tell you that perhaps your name is on that list, albeit not necessarily at the top of it.

 

The threats etc were all published on web sites and Police records would show both

intimidated and even threatened

to be true but glad to know I'm not TOP of the list

 

Hopefully publishing a germ of an idea for the benefit of fans and club alike won't push me to the top.

[Zappa 0]

Hopefully publishing a germ of an idea for the benefit of fans and club alike won't push me to the top.

 

I wouldn't think so BH.

 

Let's get back to the actual discussion about a membership scheme because I've taken it off on a tangent which I maybe shouldn't have.

 

Apologies if I came across as derogatory or overly negative because it really wasn't my intention. As I said in my very first sentence in post #52, I love the concept of a membership scheme.