Slightly concerned about feedback from Green's NI trip

[GovanAllan 0]

Not necassarily saying we are going to struggle but surely it would be naive for any club to ignore the possiblity of gaining new fans outwith the traditional avenues?

 

Don't know if you go to Ibrox Max but if I look around where I sit its like the bloody UN, and I think you'll find thats because unlike the Mhob across town we ARE an all inclusive club who welcome everbody even tho we are portrayed as just Protestant bigots. So OO baggage or not we are getting a broad fan base to come and support Rangers.

 

And never mind the amount of kids now I feel like I'm still at work when I go to Ibrox these days.

 

All my kids go to Ibrox they also love a parade, do they know what it means? No they can learn that for themselves when their older if they want, they just love the bands and the colours and the whole spectacle of it and have a great day out. I think you've been buying into the media propaganda that all people who attend a walk are knuckle-dragging bigots and should be looked down on as if they have a pair of horns sticking out their head.

[andy steel 0]

This is the issue. If someone from Northern Ireland asks Rangers to launch an orange strip, it is not because it is a nice colour.

 

Those of you claiming it's just a colour must know nothing about Ulster history, which is odd considering 'heritage' has featured heavily so far.

 

Those of you claiming handwringers are scared of offending other fans are ignoring the fact that to import elements of Ulster history - which is what this is doing, Scottish Orangeism has always been marginal and without the perceived Rangers 'connection' would have died out years ago - sends out no message of positivity or inclusivism. It's odd to imagine that buying into the culture of one of Europe's least impressive societies to make money/support a cause improves Rangers...if 10,000 Kosovan refugees from Knightswood decide to buy season tickets, do we launch a strip in the colours of the KLA?

 

Those of you struggling to contain your righteous anger and claims of timposter-ism might care to ponder that for at least one fan, Rangers stand for all this is best in Scotland. There's absolutely no way - none - to include Orangeism in that definition. Link us to the OO, Charles, and you diminish Rangers in my eyes. It was hard to swallow when that epitome of British capitalism, David Murray, was at the helm, and if I hadn't had my head in the sand I would have been even less comfy in my seat.

 

To many on this thread that will mean nothing. As one poster, in a fit of ecumenicalism, pointed out, those who would feel mega-uncomfy with an orange top wouldn't be missed. Good to know that we're a broad church as long as you toe the line.

 

Anyway, we've been here before and the overall result is usually that more fans like Orangey stuff than find it a regressive expression of social and personal alienation. The Orangey crowd always win out, so no need to get too grumpy.

[der Berliner 3,257]

On another note, and as opposed to our "neighbours" from beyond the Clyde, Rangers have shed quite a bit of their "sectarian" baggage over these last 20odd years. Nonetheless, the media still reports on us as if we were still in the deepest warzone, each muttering is analyzed, each drunken halfwit singing the odd TBB-line is being presented as a massive problem amongst the whole support. And nigh any time a report on us is done about us over here (or anywhere in the world, AFAIK), they feel the dire need to mention "our religious" background as well as that of the Hooped Horrors'. And to the oblivious audience, this looks like we're still neck-deep into this. Which - correct me if I am wrong - generally is not the case.

 

Now, there is no doubt that an orange jersey would be a smash hit with some (large) sections of the support, so business-wise it sure makes sense. But IMHO it would also fill up the ammunition for those press hacks who want to paint us being still bigotted and/or sectarian, press hacks who so far had to cling on the odd silly incident here and there. I am not sure whether that is actually required or a great idea. These thousands of people going to Ibrox do not do this out of defiance or as a show of faith untowards our grand enemies from beyond the Clyde. Their religion, I would hazard to guess, is Rangers FC.

 

If there's need for an orange-themed jersey, it should be stated clearly that it is the "SFL-shirt" as well as a "tribute to the support of the Ulster Bears" - who, no-one can deny, make up a distinct percentage of our support. That said, Rangers show the colours of all "home-nations" when flying the Union Jack over Ibrox. (Is there something alike over at the Scumhut?)

 

EDIT: I really like the all-black 3rds, BTW.

Edited September 29, 2012 by der Berliner
spelling

[Anchorman 0]

Those of you claiming handwringers are scared of offending other fans are ignoring the fact that to import elements of Ulster history - which is what this is doing, Scottish Orangeism has always been marginal and without the perceived Rangers 'connection' would have died out years ago - sends out no message of positivity or inclusivism.

 

Very eloquently put and all that, but "those of us" that you seem to be aiming at are still left with the same question after digesting the contents of your very admirable response. Who the fuck are we trying to win over here and send out "positivity messages" to? Who is waiting to join or ranks if we get our PR right? You my friend are also very naive in my eyes despite your academia.

[der Berliner 3,257]

Very eloquently put and all that, but "those of us" that you seem to be aiming at are still left with the same question after digesting the contents of your very admirable response. Who the fuck are we trying to win over here and send out "positivity messages" to? Who is waiting to join or ranks if we get our PR right? You my friend are also very naive in my eyes despite your academia.

 

I doubt that we are aiming to win someone over. I would assume that we simple go forward in time. Which, BTW, does not mean that we should "forget" the past, or "our" past. The point is how people "see" their Rangers. To some it is a football club, to some it is a loyalist/protestant institution or safe-haven, to some it is both ... you name it. IMHO we adopted the loyalist and protestant stance during a certain stage of our history, not least to do with what the Hooped Horrors did as well. It essentially created and sustained the Old Firm "glory" for nearly a century. IMHO though, it is time to make certain that the days of making a football game a semi-political feast are gone now. Make certain, that the songs we sing nowadays - be it BMG or The Sash or Derry's Walls - are more to do with creating a rousing atmosphere than making an anti-Celtic or pro-Protestant Ulster statement. I would assume (and hope) that most Bears joining in these days are doing it for the banter rather than anything else. And I would also hope that people stop utilizing this football club for their own "agendas", be their politically or religiously motivated, or both.

[Max Rebo's Big Blue Nose 0]

Listen guys. Thanks for a great debate regarding Rangers and orange strip. There have been some great posts on either side of the debate and that's a tribute to this forum as it wouldn't be allowed on other forums ie. Rangers State Media.

 

Anyway... maybe 2 bottles of red supplied by Mr Wolfblass may have clouded my posts somewhat and I was probably OTT. (sorry anyone?) It's just somehting that I felt strongly about and personally I wish we would tap into other aspects of our history as opposed to going down the orange route. But hey...

[Anchorman 0]

I doubt that we are aiming to win someone over. I would assume that we simple go forward in time. Which, BTW, does not mean that we should "forget" the past, or "our" past. The point is how people "see" their Rangers. To some it is a football club, to some it is a loyalist/protestant institution or safe-haven, to some it is both ... you name it. IMHO we adopted the loyalist and protestant stance during a certain stage of our history, not least to do with what the Hooped Horrors did as well. It essentially created and sustained the Old Firm "glory" for nearly a century. IMHO though, it is time to make certain that the days of making a football game a semi-political feast are gone now. Make certain, that the songs we sing nowadays - be it BMG or The Sash or Derry's Walls - are more to do with creating a rousing atmosphere than making an anti-Celtic or pro-Protestant Ulster statement. I would assume (and hope) that most Bears joining in these days are doing it for the banter rather than anything else. And I would also hope that people stop utilizing this football club for their own "agendas", be their politically or religiously motivated, or both.

 

Not too much I can disagree with there. If we choose to do (or not) anything as a fanbase it should always be on our terms. I'm sick to the back teeth of comments around PR etc etc and how others perceive us. Outside of our own support we are hated and anyone who can't see that is blind. Surely to God the last year has proved that. All the 'PR' in the world isn't going to change that. All it will lead to is more and more of us pandering to their whims in an unachievable quest to be liked.

[Anchorman 0]

Listen guys. Thanks for a great debate regarding Rangers and orange strip. There have been some great posts on either side of the debate and that's a tribute to this forum as it wouldn't be allowed on other forums ie. Rangers State Media.

 

Anyway... maybe 2 bottles of red supplied by Mr Wolfblass may have clouded my posts somewhat and I was probably OTT. (sorry anyone?) It's just somehting that I felt strongly about and personally I wish we would tap into other aspects of our history as opposed to going down the orange route. But hey...

 

Mine was Coors and Pinot mate, and my grumpy sore head today is linked to the very same. Good lively debate though as you say. Still say you are bonkers though :-) !

[Max Rebo's Big Blue Nose 0]

Mine was Coors and Pinot mate, and my grumpy sore head today is linked to the very same. Good lively debate though as you say. Still say you are bonkers though :-) !

 

That's one thing I will agree on. I am slightly bonkers

[simplythebest 0]

This is the issue. If someone from Northern Ireland asks Rangers to launch an orange strip, it is not because it is a nice colour.

 

Those of you claiming it's just a colour must know nothing about Ulster history, which is odd considering 'heritage' has featured heavily so far.

 

Those of you claiming handwringers are scared of offending other fans are ignoring the fact that to import elements of Ulster history - which is what this is doing, Scottish Orangeism has always been marginal and without the perceived Rangers 'connection' would have died out years ago - sends out no message of positivity or inclusivism. It's odd to imagine that buying into the culture of one of Europe's least impressive societies to make money/support a cause improves Rangers...if 10,000 Kosovan refugees from Knightswood decide to buy season tickets, do we launch a strip in the colours of the KLA?

 

Those of you struggling to contain your righteous anger and claims of timposter-ism might care to ponder that for at least one fan, Rangers stand for all this is best in Scotland. There's absolutely no way - none - to include Orangeism in that definition. Link us to the OO, Charles, and you diminish Rangers in my eyes. It was hard to swallow when that epitome of British capitalism, David Murray, was at the helm, and if I hadn't had my head in the sand I would have been even less comfy in my seat.

 

To many on this thread that will mean nothing. As one poster, in a fit of ecumenicalism, pointed out, those who would feel mega-uncomfy with an orange top wouldn't be missed. Good to know that we're a broad church as long as you toe the line.

 

Anyway, we've been here before and the overall result is usually that more fans like Orangey stuff than find it a regressive expression of social and personal alienation. The Orangey crowd always win out, so no need to get too grumpy.

I said anyone who really sees the issue as something to not go back to Ibrox over won't be missed. While I don't agree with the general point either it was that aspect that riled me, after six months of the club's very existence being in doubt I can't believe anyone would think like that over the colour of a strip.