maineflyer 0 Posted January 20, 2009 Author Share Posted January 20, 2009 PS Do loads of people on here support the protester that came on with a Palestinian flag during our game against an Israeli team? Bougherra's armband is making a similar point. Can't believe where this thread has gone but some of the predictable nonsense being spouted is ridiculous. About as inappropriate as Bougherra involving Rangers in his proposed protest. But surely the invader was an oppressed victim showing support for still more oppressed victims and therefore cannot be condemned for his behaviour, which was obviously a result of his humanity and compassions, nurtured despite his apparent victimhood. I say 'apparent' because, like the Irish tricolour, the Palestinian flag shows his moral credentials are unquestionable. I mean, if it wasn't for the flag you might be tempted to think he was just another ned twat with a grudge and desperate for recognition. Religion, an alternative to rational thought that has been used by bastards down the ages to manipulate the vulnerable and ensure the control of wealth and power. If people could marry intelligence with confidence, all organised religion would end tomorrow. perhaps Bougherra would be better advised to devote some of his energies to protesting those Paelstinians who have sacrificed the peace and prosperity of their people for thirty years in order to maintain their revenge culture against the Israelis. Hamas have almost no friends left in the Middle East outside Syria and Iran. Most arabs I've met recently despise what Hamas are doing as much as they despise the Israelis. The Egyptians I spoke to last week were openly blaming Hamas for bringing upon their population the inevitable Israeli destruction. Israel pulls the trigger, Iran lines up the targets, Hamas makes sure they get hit. People in the West wring their hands and indulge their emotions. And so it goes on. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert 17 Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 PS Do loads of people on here support the protester that came on with a Palestinian flag during our game against an Israeli team? Bougherra's armband is making a similar point. It is? The point being made with a combination of an image of the Pope on a T-Shirt, uninvited entry to a football field and a Palestinian flag? A point so confused as to be meaningless other than to mark the pitch invader out as nothing more than an idiotic arsehole? This is similar to mourning the violent death of 1200+ people by wearing a simple black armband? I disagree. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert 17 Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 Religion, an alternative to rational thought that has been used by bastards down the ages to manipulate the vulnerable and ensure the control of wealth and power. If people could marry intelligence with confidence, all organised religion would end tomorrow. On this point we are in complete agreement. :cheers: 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
calscot 0 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 It is? The point being made with a combination of an image of the Pope on a T-Shirt, uninvited entry to a football field and a Palestinian flag? A point so confused as to be meaningless other than to mark the pitch invader out as nothing more than an idiotic arsehole? This is similar to mourning the violent death of 1200+ people by wearing a simple black armband? I disagree. Seems to me they are both publicly highlighting the plight of Palestinians... Not saying their motives aren't different, but then who is going to be the judge of motives? You? How can you tell who is just an arse and who isn't? Is it not better just to keep it all out of football? What if our opposition has a Jewish player who then wants to do something to mourn the deaths of Israelis? Or supposing he sees Bougherra as a Hamas supporter? Does it not open up a can of worms? Will Bougherra wear an armand every time a Muslim is killed in Afghanistan by a British soldier? Should Novo wear one every time a Catholic is killed in NI? Just where is the line? Bougherra has, probably unwittingly, turned it into a contentious religious and political statement, and I don't think he should use his position at Rangers to promote that to millions of people. At the end of the day, I'm not sure if I care about arm bands, but to stick to my original point, I do NOT admire anyone who mourns ONLY the deaths of people of the same religion as them - which is what Bougherra implied. There is no excuse. It just doesn't agree with my set of morals and values and it is my opinion that it is this type of thinking that leads to religious oriented violence and it's basically what the Palestinian/Israeli problem is all about. Nothing anyone has said has countered this in the slightest. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 At the end of the day, I'm not sure if I care about arm bands, but to stick to my original point, I do NOT admire anyone who mourns ONLY the deaths of people of the same religion as them - which is what Bougherra implied. There is no excuse. It just doesn't agree with my set of morals and values and it is my opinion that it is this type of thinking that leads to religious oriented violence and it's basically what the Palestinian/Israeli problem is all about. No Calscot, the Palestinian/Israeli problem isn't about religious oriented violence, it's about the following:- After World War I, the League of Nations approved the British Mandate of Palestine with the intent of creating a "national home for the Jewish people." In 1947, the United Nations approved the partition of Palestine into two states, one Jewish and one Arab. On May 14, 1948 the state of Israel declared independence and this was followed by a war with the surrounding Arab states, which refused to accept the plan. The Israelis were subsequently victorious in a series of wars confirming their independence and expanding the borders of the Jewish state beyond those in the UN Partition Plan. Since then, Israel has been in conflict with many of the neighboring Arab countries, resulting in several major wars and decades of violence that continue to this day. Since its foundation, Israel's boundaries and the State's right to exist have been subject to dispute, especially among its Arab neighbors and their many Palestinian refugees. If you speak to Israeli people, most of them will tell you that they're fighting against an enemy which denies their right to exist, which is actually a twisting of the truth, since it's the right of the 'state' of Israel to exist which is disputed as well as it's defined borders in a reality where it does exist as a state. It's made out as if it's they as people who are deemed to have no right to exist by their neighbors though, which is not the case at all other than some extremists which both sides actually have their share of (look into the subject of Israel's far right opinions).... 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,195 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Guys, I dont want to cut short what is so obviously a hot topic of the moment. But might I suggest that if you want to get into the politics/religion/geographical etc elements of Israel/Palestine/Gaza etc then you create a new thread in the Bluenose Lounge. This thread was in reference to Bougherra's personal "statement" and the merits, or otherwise, of it. It is difficult to separate the two, I appreciate that - but I feel that we are losing sight of what the intent of this topic was. The intent from the OP (maineflyer), and correct me if I am wrong, was simply whether Bougherra should be making such a statement or not. Getting into the details of the current conflict and its historical content should be undertaken by way of its own separate thread. Trust this meets with all your approval 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Craig, if the OP doesn't mind, why not just move the whole thread to the lounge? People can't be expected not to comment with their opinions etc, whether the discussion goes a bit OT or not... I guess if you move it to the lounge it wouldn't get as much traffic though... 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert 17 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Is it not better just to keep it all out of football? Only if you think all marks of respect for non-football related deaths should be kept out of football. If so, then fair enough. I'd still disagree though. ;-) 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maineflyer 0 Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 Craig, if the OP doesn't mind, why not just move the whole thread to the lounge? People can't be expected not to comment with their opinions etc, whether the discussion goes a bit OT or not... I guess if you move it to the lounge it wouldn't get as much traffic though... The OP thinks he might just delete the whole thread. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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