Will mainstream media report on sectarian singing by British troops?

[ian1964 10,462]

Bouncy bouncy

 

The list is endless mate

[aweebluesoandso 290]

The list is endless mate

 

They won't be happy till they eradicate us and our club from the world, like i say Fascists.

[BlueMazza 0]

Clearly songs like Penny Arcade are not facist, neither is the bouncy. How anyone can find insult in the words 'na' repeated is beyond me. But there ARE other ones which are controversial and those are what we should focus on,

 

(The whole hokey cokey uproar was incredible )

[ian1964 10,462]

Clearly songs like Penny Arcade are not facist, neither is the bouncy. How anyone can find insult in the words 'na' repeated is beyond me. But there ARE other ones which are controversial and those are what we should focus on,

 

(The whole hokey cokey uproar was incredible )

 

What you are saying is correct,however the point Rangers fans are making is every song sung by Rangers fans is attacked by the BHEASTS and at the same time the BHEASTS spew out their bile and nothing is done. I don't like the add ons either,but it is a one way street when it comes to the mHedia, I mean they are even trying to accuse soldiers of singing sectarian songs!,it's no wonder some Rangers fans feel they should continue their songs,it's not right and it doesn't help, but until parity is shown it will continue.

[BlueMazza 0]

What you are saying is correct,however the point Rangers fans are making is every song sung by Rangers fans is attacked by the BHEASTS and at the same time the BHEASTS spew out their bile and nothing is done. I don't like the add ons either,but it is a one way street when it comes to the mHedia, I mean they are even trying to accuse soldiers of singing sectarian songs!,it's no wonder some Rangers fans feel they should continue their songs,it's not right and it doesn't help, but until parity is shown it will continue.

 

But parity won't be shown as long as it continues! That's already been proven. Clean up our act and then we really can point the figure and make a point.

It's pretty childish really to sing songs just because someone else doesn't get in trouble for it! Bloody hell, I even tell my son it's not ok for him to swear just because others are doing it.

[The Real PapaBear 0]

http://player.stv.tv/programmes/champions-league-extra-time/

 

from 30.50 to 31.14 "The Boys of the Old Brigade" can clearly be heard being chanted by a sizeable section of the crowd. This is on a CL night in front of a worldwide audience, mind.

 

And yet?

Nothing from Channel 4.

Not a word from Sky News.

BBC? Quiet as a mouse

Alex Thomson? Dude's become a Trappist monk it would seem.

SFA? Tumbleweed.

[Super_Ally 0]

But parity won't be shown as long as it continues! That's already been proven. Clean up our act and then we really can point the figure and make a point.

It's pretty childish really to sing songs just because someone else doesn't get in trouble for it! Bloody hell, I even tell my son it's not ok for him to swear just because others are doing it.

 

Equally I dont think theres anything to suggest that if we make enough concessions they will stop asking for them.

 

We've dropped most genuinely offensive songs so now they target other songs they dont like but aren't in anyway offensive e.g. penny arcade and the bouncy.

 

If there was never anything sung about NI, the orange order, the YCV at Ibrox I think you are deluded to think that would be the end of it. They would attack us anyway and ignore more offensive behaviour elsewhere as they do now.

[craig 5,199]

Equally I dont think theres anything to suggest that if we make enough concessions they will stop asking for them.

 

We've dropped most genuinely offensive songs so now they target other songs they dont like but aren't in anyway offensive e.g. penny arcade and the bouncy.

 

If there was never anything sung about NI, the orange order, the YCV at Ibrox I think you are deluded to think that would be the end of it. They would attack us anyway and ignore more offensive behaviour elsewhere as they do now.

 

Maybe so, but it is far easier to attack from a position of strength. Right now we can point the finger at them and say "they are signing bad songs" and they will point right back and say "theirs are worse".

 

If we eradicated anything that could actually be offensive (ignoring their faux offense) then we say "what songs would they be ?" - right now we make it easy for them to deflect back to us. That, I think, is the point.

[Super_Ally 0]

Maybe so, but it is far easier to attack from a position of strength. Right now we can point the finger at them and say "they are signing bad songs" and they will point right back and say "theirs are worse".

 

If we eradicated anything that could actually be offensive (ignoring their faux offense) then we say "what songs would they be ?" - right now we make it easy for them to deflect back to us. That, I think, is the point.

 

I can see that logic. That's how it should be. But it's not. There's only one teem under the microscope. Event few were squeaky clean and tried to get the press/government to go after other, genuinely offensive fans we'd be accused of whataboutery.

 

This isn't about cleaning up fan behaviour or sectarianism. It's about neutering Rangers under he pretence of sectarianism or whatever else.

[ian1964 10,462]

Michael Kelly: Cry foul over sectarianism law

 

Lack of action over the armed forces’ behaviour at Ibrox last week again highlights the flaws in legislation to tackle sectarianism, writes Michael Kelly

 

Strange and disturbing events unfolded at Ibrox last Saturday. It was not the home side’s overwhelming 8- 0 victory over Stenhousemuir that attracted attention. Rather it was the interaction between armed forces personnel and Rangers fans that was the focus of the ipads and smart phones of social media commentators. Over the following 48 hours, videos and photographs of soldiers, sailors and airmen demonstrating with the crowd filled YouTube, Facebook and Twitter.

 

Oddly, that’s where the coverage ended. Images which normally would have been meat and drink to the tabloids and TV news were absent from both. Apart from reports in a number of heavyweight papers, matters went largely unreported until popular outcry led to both the police and the army announcing that inquiries would be undertaken to establish what had transpired.

 

What did happen was fairly clear on YouTube. The armed forces – mainly soldiers – marched into the stadium in a dignified manner behind a pipe band. Then for some reason, instead of marching off again they were allowed to disperse and wander about on the pitch. Most of what happened thereafter was unexceptional. They walked about taking photos of each other and posed with fans. However, a large group of them then congregated at one end of the ground facing supporters singing what the Scottish government would class as criminally sectarian songs. The soldiers jumped up and down in time to the rhythm, waved their arms about and clapped, thereby encouraging the crowd to reprise their chants. There was no definitive evidence that they joined in the singing.

 

There is much to be said in support of institutions like Rangers hosting days to recognise the efforts made by the armed forces in defence of this country. Soldiers are generally popular, the public enjoys showing its support for them and the closer links between the army and the public are the better for society generally. However, this event was a public relations disaster.

 

Unwittingly or not, the army got caught up in events that were clearly both sectarian and political. Given the continued uncertainty in Northern Ireland, one can see how these events will be exploited by disaffected republicans. If British soldiers ever have to go active again in the province, their performance last Saturday will be recalled as evidence of the partiality of the army. The soldiers’ behaviour was so inappropriate for the senior brass present to take action there and then, rather than later to announce an investigation.

 

The other question is: where were the police? In all the coverage there is no evidence of their presence. Normally the police patrol the perimeter of the pitch. None was to be seen. Given the enthusiasm with which the police elsewhere have tried to enforce the Offensive Behaviour at Football Act, their no-show demands an inquiry.

 

It is another example of how this bad act is not being properly enforced. There have been numerous complaints by fans as to police tactics. Rangers fans were walked to and from Annan’s football ground where there had been no evidence of misbehaviour on the way to the town. A similar situation arose when Rangers visited Forres. Motherwell fans complain bitterly about rough policing when their team visited St Mirren Park. Celtic supporters associations are still angry about the way in which the police dealt with an unauthorised march in Glasgow’s Gallowgate. In relation to this, a group of MSPs held a meeting with Scotland’s chief constable at which the police refused to recognise the term “kettling”, insisting that this unpopular method of containment be referred to as “box-cordoning”.

 

Despite this pedantic insistence, the police were unable to confirm how long this practice had been in existence, stating only that it has been used, in one police officer’s words, “for as long as I can remember”.

 

In fact, the whole issue of box-cordoning is shrouded in mystery. Police were unwilling to disclose to the politicians just how and when it is seen as a legitimate tactic. Demonstrators are therefore unable to avoid behaviour that might lead to their being forcibly detained on the streets for long periods of time. Under a Freedom of Information disclosure the police admitted “the use of containment is not recorded in any corporate manner”. So accurate figures as to how often it is used are not available.

 

Even more significantly, the same Freedom of Information response indicates that there is nothing to suggest that either the Cabinet secretary for justice (Kenny MacAskill) or the minister for community safety and legal affairs (Roseanna Cunningham) have discussed box-cordoning with the police. Given the high and adverse profile that containment action has attracted, and given the weight that the Scottish Government has thrown behind the enforcement of the Offensive Behaviour at Football Act, this is a peculiar omission which should be rectified forthwith.

 

This act was ill-conceived in the wake of one minor incident at one football match. It is undemocratic and anti-civil rights. A number of songs sung at football matches are offensive. But in a democracy people have the right to be offensive, especially where part of the offence given is political in nature. It is for this and for other failings in this badly drafted legislation that the Scottish courts are increasingly unwilling to find fans guilty under its terms. Very few at Ibrox last weekend would have been offended by the fans’ behaviour. Does that exempt it from the act? Does its subsequent broadcast which offended many people bring it back with the scope of the act even although the parties offended against were not at the match? No one has given definitive answers to questions like these.

 

All civilised citizens want to see an end to sectarian hatred. The best work being done to transform our society is being carried out by voluntary organisations – organisations that have seen their public funding cut. The way not to change attitudes is through an undemocratic and unworkable act which discriminates against a particular section of society. The government should take this opportunity to revisit the legislation urgently with a view to its repeal.

 

http://www.scotsman.com/news/michael-kelly-cry-foul-over-sectarianism-law-1-3122614