Pacific Quay Musings?

[JohnMc 2,468]

I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks the BBC is "irrelevant" clearly doesn't work in the media. The BBC is far from irrelevant, indeed I'd venture it has more influence and reach now than at anytime since the mid-1980s. 

 

I think much of this 'confusion' comes from falling ratings for BBC1 and indeed the main ITV channels and the changing way people view and interact with television in particular. There is no doubt that BBC television attracts fewer viewers than it did even 10 years ago, however that's far from the full story. Staying with television the BBC is still a formidable ratings puller. Programmes like Blue Planet and Strictly pulled in in excess of 13 million viewers last year. Nothing on Netflix, Amazon or You Tube comes close to that in the UK. The BBC news and sports programmes also rate highly with viewers. This year the highest rated TV programme in the UK was the England v Sweden match in Russia, an astonishing 20 million people watched it live. 

 

TV viewing is changing, however the BBC is far better prepared for this than some seem to think. The BBC iPlayer is an excellent 'on-demand' facility and is widely available and used. The BBC are also now releasing series on the iPlayer in one go, rather than one episode at a time. 

 

It's also worth pointing out that in Scotland we have only two stations catering for a specific local audience; BBC Scotland and STV (Border too although it is largely based in Carlisle and Cumbria). As such BBC Reporting Scotland out performs all other local and regional BBC TV news programmes, as does Scotland Today on STV. For 'local' news they are most certainly not 'irrelevant'. Viewing figures for the always dreadful 'Still Game' are staggering. The finale episode attracted 1.8 million viewers in Scotland, nearly 36% of the population. That's the kind of figures countries that only have one TV channel get!

 

Looking at radio, an area the BBC still excels at, Scotland remains an outlier. 21% of the population of Scotland listen to Radio Scotland every week, on average listening to 6.9 hours a week. When you add in national BBC radio stations BBC radio has 45% of the market in Scotland. The other 55% is split between national commercial radio and local commercial radio stations. Radio Scot;and has the largest audience of any station broadcasting only in Scotland (so compared to Clyde, Westsound, Forth etc) and both BBC Radio 1 and 2 are the biggest in terms of overall listenership in Scotland. Radio has been largely unaffected by the internet. Most people still listen on an AM/FM device, with growing use of DAB sets as they become more common in cars. BBC radio in Scotland is very influential, to pretend otherwise is folly. 

 

The real reason dismissing the BBC as irrelevant or a dinosaur is a mistake though is their website. The BBC website is a monstrous success. As of last month it is the 5th most used site in the UK and the most used website actually based in the UK (Google, Amazon, Facebook and You Tube are more visited). It is the go-to website for news and sport in the UK. The BBC's ability to 'cross-platform' is largely unrivalled, the 'red-button', their  phone apps, digital channels and their website are enormously valuable and influential. By October last year the BBC website was getting over 6 billion page views a month, up around 1 billion on 12 months before. 

 

The BBC has many, many faults, but understanding and adapting to the changes in media and media consumption isn't one of them. It is highly unlikely they will become 'irrelevant' in our lifetime. Their unique funding, market share and charter almost guarantees relevancy. 

 

 

[DMAA 3,603]

27 minutes ago, craig said:

Why didn't that happen when Fergie or Redknapp ban BBC then ?  They sent alternative reporters....

That’s a good question Craig and one the club have hopefully raised with them. However i think it’s that they chose to be inconsistent those instances rather than stick to their principles. 

[DMAA 3,603]

15 minutes ago, JohnMc said:

I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks the BBC is "irrelevant" clearly doesn't work in the media. The BBC is far from irrelevant, indeed I'd venture it has more influence and reach now than at anytime since the mid-1980s. 

 

I think much of this 'confusion' comes from falling ratings for BBC1 and indeed the main ITV channels and the changing way people view and interact with television in particular. There is no doubt that BBC television attracts fewer viewers than it did even 10 years ago, however that's far from the full story. Staying with television the BBC is still a formidable ratings puller. Programmes like Blue Planet and Strictly pulled in in excess of 13 million viewers last year. Nothing on Netflix, Amazon or You Tube comes close to that in the UK. The BBC news and sports programmes also rate highly with viewers. This year the highest rated TV programme in the UK was the England v Sweden match in Russia, an astonishing 20 million people watched it live. 

 

TV viewing is changing, however the BBC is far better prepared for this than some seem to think. The BBC iPlayer is an excellent 'on-demand' facility and is widely available and used. The BBC are also now releasing series on the iPlayer in one go, rather than one episode at a time. 

 

It's also worth pointing out that in Scotland we have only two stations catering for a specific local audience; BBC Scotland and STV (Border too although it is largely based in Carlisle and Cumbria). As such BBC Reporting Scotland out performs all other local and regional BBC TV news programmes, as does Scotland Today on STV. For 'local' news they are most certainly not 'irrelevant'. Viewing figures for the always dreadful 'Still Game' are staggering. The finale episode attracted 1.8 million viewers in Scotland, nearly 36% of the population. That's the kind of figures countries that only have one TV channel get!

 

Looking at radio, an area the BBC still excels at, Scotland remains an outlier. 21% of the population of Scotland listen to Radio Scotland every week, on average listening to 6.9 hours a week. When you add in national BBC radio stations BBC radio has 45% of the market in Scotland. The other 55% is split between national commercial radio and local commercial radio stations. Radio Scot;and has the largest audience of any station broadcasting only in Scotland (so compared to Clyde, Westsound, Forth etc) and both BBC Radio 1 and 2 are the biggest in terms of overall listenership in Scotland. Radio has been largely unaffected by the internet. Most people still listen on an AM/FM device, with growing use of DAB sets as they become more common in cars. BBC radio in Scotland is very influential, to pretend otherwise is folly. 

 

The real reason dismissing the BBC as irrelevant or a dinosaur is a mistake though is their website. The BBC website is a monstrous success. As of last month it is the 5th most used site in the UK and the most used website actually based in the UK (Google, Amazon, Facebook and You Tube are more visited). It is the go-to website for news and sport in the UK. The BBC's ability to 'cross-platform' is largely unrivalled, the 'red-button', their  phone apps, digital channels and their website are enormously valuable and influential. By October last year the BBC website was getting over 6 billion page views a month, up around 1 billion on 12 months before. 

 

The BBC has many, many faults, but understanding and adapting to the changes in media and media consumption isn't one of them. It is highly unlikely they will become 'irrelevant' in our lifetime. Their unique funding, market share and charter almost guarantees relevancy. 

 

 

Thanks for that John. The BBC absolutely dominates the radio, it must have an exclusive rights deal for football, so some of the comments about the BBC coverage being irrelevant are way off the mark. 

 

The BBC Sport website/app is also very good and by a country mile the most popular place for Scottish football fans to check on the football and get updates. It’s been a big disappointment for Rangers fans since we stopped getting proper game updates on there. 

[Gaffer 1,665]

18 minutes ago, JohnMc said:

I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks the BBC is "irrelevant" clearly doesn't work in the media. The BBC is far from irrelevant, indeed I'd venture it has more influence and reach now than at anytime since the mid-1980s. 

 

I think much of this 'confusion' comes from falling ratings for BBC1 and indeed the main ITV channels and the changing way people view and interact with television in particular. There is no doubt that BBC television attracts fewer viewers than it did even 10 years ago, however that's far from the full story. Staying with television the BBC is still a formidable ratings puller. Programmes like Blue Planet and Strictly pulled in in excess of 13 million viewers last year. Nothing on Netflix, Amazon or You Tube comes close to that in the UK. The BBC news and sports programmes also rate highly with viewers. This year the highest rated TV programme in the UK was the England v Sweden match in Russia, an astonishing 20 million people watched it live. 

 

TV viewing is changing, however the BBC is far better prepared for this than some seem to think. The BBC iPlayer is an excellent 'on-demand' facility and is widely available and used. The BBC are also now releasing series on the iPlayer in one go, rather than one episode at a time. 

 

It's also worth pointing out that in Scotland we have only two stations catering for a specific local audience; BBC Scotland and STV (Border too although it is largely based in Carlisle and Cumbria). As such BBC Reporting Scotland out performs all other local and regional BBC TV news programmes, as does Scotland Today on STV. For 'local' news they are most certainly not 'irrelevant'. Viewing figures for the always dreadful 'Still Game' are staggering. The finale episode attracted 1.8 million viewers in Scotland, nearly 36% of the population. That's the kind of figures countries that only have one TV channel get!

 

Looking at radio, an area the BBC still excels at, Scotland remains an outlier. 21% of the population of Scotland listen to Radio Scotland every week, on average listening to 6.9 hours a week. When you add in national BBC radio stations BBC radio has 45% of the market in Scotland. The other 55% is split between national commercial radio and local commercial radio stations. Radio Scot;and has the largest audience of any station broadcasting only in Scotland (so compared to Clyde, Westsound, Forth etc) and both BBC Radio 1 and 2 are the biggest in terms of overall listenership in Scotland. Radio has been largely unaffected by the internet. Most people still listen on an AM/FM device, with growing use of DAB sets as they become more common in cars. BBC radio in Scotland is very influential, to pretend otherwise is folly. 

 

The real reason dismissing the BBC as irrelevant or a dinosaur is a mistake though is their website. The BBC website is a monstrous success. As of last month it is the 5th most used site in the UK and the most used website actually based in the UK (Google, Amazon, Facebook and You Tube are more visited). It is the go-to website for news and sport in the UK. The BBC's ability to 'cross-platform' is largely unrivalled, the 'red-button', their  phone apps, digital channels and their website are enormously valuable and influential. By October last year the BBC website was getting over 6 billion page views a month, up around 1 billion on 12 months before. 

 

The BBC has many, many faults, but understanding and adapting to the changes in media and media consumption isn't one of them. It is highly unlikely they will become 'irrelevant' in our lifetime. Their unique funding, market share and charter almost guarantees relevancy. 

 

 

I'm delighted not to be in the media, but that does not prevent me from understanding some facts myself.  I take some of your points John, but we're not (not intentionally anyway) dismissing the BBC in other areas (as Strictly and Still game may be popular for you and many others), but as far as Scottish football is concerned, it is largely irrelevant.  Each day their viewing figures are absolutely insignificant as over 40m tweets/views and 6m Facebook references discuss Scottish football and receive a much broader worldwide audience.  And that doesn't even include the many other forums, blogs and podcasts.  The BBC can only dream of that spread of readership and exposure.

 

And finally, we have to look at the demographics.  The younger generation are not influenced by BBC's coverage of Scottish football.  They don't listen to it on radio, they don't watch their Scottish football programmes (as you'll know), and they certainly don't read about it on their website.  I'd call that an irrelevance.

[Frankie 8,150]

Some really good posts on this thread - from both sides of the debate.

 

It would be really interesting if the better points were collated and sent to BBC Scotland and other relevant parties for comment.  We know the answer from BBC but we really should be applying a bit more pressure.

[trublusince1982 243]

40 minutes ago, JohnMc said:

I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks the BBC is "irrelevant" clearly doesn't work in the media. The BBC is far from irrelevant, indeed I'd venture it has more influence and reach now than at anytime since the mid-1980s. 

 

I think much of this 'confusion' comes from falling ratings for BBC1 and indeed the main ITV channels and the changing way people view and interact with television in particular. There is no doubt that BBC television attracts fewer viewers than it did even 10 years ago, however that's far from the full story. Staying with television the BBC is still a formidable ratings puller. Programmes like Blue Planet and Strictly pulled in in excess of 13 million viewers last year. Nothing on Netflix, Amazon or You Tube comes close to that in the UK. The BBC news and sports programmes also rate highly with viewers. This year the highest rated TV programme in the UK was the England v Sweden match in Russia, an astonishing 20 million people watched it live. 

 

TV viewing is changing, however the BBC is far better prepared for this than some seem to think. The BBC iPlayer is an excellent 'on-demand' facility and is widely available and used. The BBC are also now releasing series on the iPlayer in one go, rather than one episode at a time. 

 

It's also worth pointing out that in Scotland we have only two stations catering for a specific local audience; BBC Scotland and STV (Border too although it is largely based in Carlisle and Cumbria). As such BBC Reporting Scotland out performs all other local and regional BBC TV news programmes, as does Scotland Today on STV. For 'local' news they are most certainly not 'irrelevant'. Viewing figures for the always dreadful 'Still Game' are staggering. The finale episode attracted 1.8 million viewers in Scotland, nearly 36% of the population. That's the kind of figures countries that only have one TV channel get!

 

Looking at radio, an area the BBC still excels at, Scotland remains an outlier. 21% of the population of Scotland listen to Radio Scotland every week, on average listening to 6.9 hours a week. When you add in national BBC radio stations BBC radio has 45% of the market in Scotland. The other 55% is split between national commercial radio and local commercial radio stations. Radio Scot;and has the largest audience of any station broadcasting only in Scotland (so compared to Clyde, Westsound, Forth etc) and both BBC Radio 1 and 2 are the biggest in terms of overall listenership in Scotland. Radio has been largely unaffected by the internet. Most people still listen on an AM/FM device, with growing use of DAB sets as they become more common in cars. BBC radio in Scotland is very influential, to pretend otherwise is folly. 

 

The real reason dismissing the BBC as irrelevant or a dinosaur is a mistake though is their website. The BBC website is a monstrous success. As of last month it is the 5th most used site in the UK and the most used website actually based in the UK (Google, Amazon, Facebook and You Tube are more visited). It is the go-to website for news and sport in the UK. The BBC's ability to 'cross-platform' is largely unrivalled, the 'red-button', their  phone apps, digital channels and their website are enormously valuable and influential. By October last year the BBC website was getting over 6 billion page views a month, up around 1 billion on 12 months before. 

 

The BBC has many, many faults, but understanding and adapting to the changes in media and media consumption isn't one of them. It is highly unlikely they will become 'irrelevant' in our lifetime. Their unique funding, market share and charter almost guarantees relevancy. 

 

 

many great points but just one point of context. The bbc news portal being 5th is a drop in their performance showing a declining market share and sees them below facebook and youtube. Two places the club has a growing influence.

[DMAA 3,603]

31 minutes ago, trublusince1982 said:

sees them below facebook and youtube. Two places the club has a growing influence.

Youtube is absolutely huge with young people. They are completely addicted to it. Sad to see to be honest, but the club should be doing as much as possible to put quality Rangers content on there. Great place to win fans.

[cooponthewing 1,139]

1 hour ago, DMAA said:

Thanks for that John. The BBC absolutely dominates the radio, it must have an exclusive rights deal for football, so some of the comments about the BBC coverage being irrelevant are way off the mark. 

 

The BBC Sport website/app is also very good and by a country mile the most popular place for Scottish football fans to check on the football and get updates. It’s been a big disappointment for Rangers fans since we stopped getting proper game updates on there. 

TalkSPORT have rights to the English  football. On both channels. It’s only this backwater the BBC have rights for.

Edited August 16, 2018 by cooponthewing

[JohnMc 2,468]

1 hour ago, Gaffer said:

I'm delighted not to be in the media, but that does not prevent me from understanding some facts myself.  I take some of your points John, but we're not (not intentionally anyway) dismissing the BBC in other areas (as Strictly and Still game may be popular for you and many others), but as far as Scottish football is concerned, it is largely irrelevant.  Each day their viewing figures are absolutely insignificant as over 40m tweets/views and 6m Facebook references discuss Scottish football and receive a much broader worldwide audience.  And that doesn't even include the many other forums, blogs and podcasts.  The BBC can only dream of that spread of readership and exposure.

 

And finally, we have to look at the demographics.  The younger generation are not influenced by BBC's coverage of Scottish football.  They don't listen to it on radio, they don't watch their Scottish football programmes (as you'll know), and they certainly don't read about it on their website.  I'd call that an irrelevance.

Where are you seeing evidence that the "younger generation" aren't influenced by the BBC? Is that your observation or is there any empirical evidence for it? What do you class as younger? Under 30, under 25, under 16?

 

Follow Follow is largely seen as the most influential 'website' in Scottish football. Alexa ranks them as number one, even above Rangers own website as well as all other club or fan based sites. Yet Follow Follow has around a very respectable 39,000 followers on Twitter, RangersMedia has around 33,000. Yet BBC Sportsound has over 80,000 and its Facebook page has over 286,000 followers. BBC Sportsound dwarfs the Daily Record Sport and Radio Clyde's Super Scoreboard, only STV Sport gets close. The only people with more 'influence' on social media in Scottish football are the clubs themselves. I've not seen stats for the BBC sport website Scotland pages, I'm not sure if they're published, but I'd be surprised if they aren't higher than any other Scottish football centric website.  

 

For what it's worth I work on the fringes of the media, I take an interest in what happens in the media and what might happen in the future. I'm not an expert, I don't have a crystal ball and I get stuff really wrong sometimes.  

 

So places like Gersnet, FF, Rangersmedia have been around for a while now, other clubs have their versions too. They have influence, ideas are shared, opinions informed, news and gossip exchanged. But because they have influence doesn't mean an established, traditional programme, like BBC Sportsound, doesn't. It's not either or, it's degrees of. 

Podcasts are growing in popularity, as are webcasts and vlogs, but they still make up a very small percentage of the overall media consumed in Scotland. There have been successes in sport Podcasts. Second Captains, out of Dublin, has done very well, with both the Irish Times and RTE (Ireland's BBC) investing and getting associated with them. Indeed their podcast was hosted on the Irish Times website for a while. I'm watching the Heart and Hand podcast, it'll be interesting to see what kind of revenue that could generate. 

 

For me, BBC Scotland and Sportsound in particular remains the most influential 'media' in Scottish football. Their technology, resources and platforms give them a huge advantage on most of the others and they've adapted to digital media pretty well. 

 

In my opinion, but I'd be happy to be proved wrong. 

[Bill 13,717]

3 hours ago, JohnMc said:

I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks the BBC is "irrelevant" clearly doesn't work in the media. The BBC is far from irrelevant, indeed I'd venture it has more influence and reach now than at anytime since the mid-1980s. 

 

I think much of this 'confusion' comes from falling ratings for BBC1 and indeed the main ITV channels and the changing way people view and interact with television in particular. There is no doubt that BBC television attracts fewer viewers than it did even 10 years ago, however that's far from the full story. Staying with television the BBC is still a formidable ratings puller. Programmes like Blue Planet and Strictly pulled in in excess of 13 million viewers last year. Nothing on Netflix, Amazon or You Tube comes close to that in the UK. The BBC news and sports programmes also rate highly with viewers. This year the highest rated TV programme in the UK was the England v Sweden match in Russia, an astonishing 20 million people watched it live. 

 

TV viewing is changing, however the BBC is far better prepared for this than some seem to think. The BBC iPlayer is an excellent 'on-demand' facility and is widely available and used. The BBC are also now releasing series on the iPlayer in one go, rather than one episode at a time. 

 

It's also worth pointing out that in Scotland we have only two stations catering for a specific local audience; BBC Scotland and STV (Border too although it is largely based in Carlisle and Cumbria). As such BBC Reporting Scotland out performs all other local and regional BBC TV news programmes, as does Scotland Today on STV. For 'local' news they are most certainly not 'irrelevant'. Viewing figures for the always dreadful 'Still Game' are staggering. The finale episode attracted 1.8 million viewers in Scotland, nearly 36% of the population. That's the kind of figures countries that only have one TV channel get!

 

Looking at radio, an area the BBC still excels at, Scotland remains an outlier. 21% of the population of Scotland listen to Radio Scotland every week, on average listening to 6.9 hours a week. When you add in national BBC radio stations BBC radio has 45% of the market in Scotland. The other 55% is split between national commercial radio and local commercial radio stations. Radio Scot;and has the largest audience of any station broadcasting only in Scotland (so compared to Clyde, Westsound, Forth etc) and both BBC Radio 1 and 2 are the biggest in terms of overall listenership in Scotland. Radio has been largely unaffected by the internet. Most people still listen on an AM/FM device, with growing use of DAB sets as they become more common in cars. BBC radio in Scotland is very influential, to pretend otherwise is folly. 

 

The real reason dismissing the BBC as irrelevant or a dinosaur is a mistake though is their website. The BBC website is a monstrous success. As of last month it is the 5th most used site in the UK and the most used website actually based in the UK (Google, Amazon, Facebook and You Tube are more visited). It is the go-to website for news and sport in the UK. The BBC's ability to 'cross-platform' is largely unrivalled, the 'red-button', their  phone apps, digital channels and their website are enormously valuable and influential. By October last year the BBC website was getting over 6 billion page views a month, up around 1 billion on 12 months before. 

 

The BBC has many, many faults, but understanding and adapting to the changes in media and media consumption isn't one of them. It is highly unlikely they will become 'irrelevant' in our lifetime. Their unique funding, market share and charter almost guarantees relevancy. 

 

 

Interesting post ... but ...

 

The issue here isn't Still Game or what size of UK audience is attracted to a World Cup game. This is specifically about an increasingly informed Rangers support with an available, more relevant and palatable alternative - and what THEY think about the specific football offering from BBC Scotland, as it concerns Rangers. How many hits  the BBC website gets from the wider public is almost irrelevant.

 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Bill