Frankie

It's the blind leading the blind here...!

That's just the site forum address mate. Need an actual image of the error. Press 'Print Screen' then save the copied image and upload it if possible. Cheers!

Can you guys post a screenshot of the error you are experiencing?

Absolutely mate. I think I've been quite clear in what questions need to be asked so any proposed letter should follow that format. It may well be the fa groups don't want to use it (or have their own letter already) but would certainly be good to have one single communication with all groups' names on it.

You'll understand that (as it stands) it wouldn't make for good strategic sense to make it publicly available beforehand. However, I see no reason for it and any committee response to be published after the fact.

Have today been in contact with our fan groups & online community with regard to a proposed joint letter to the Justice Committee. Proposed letter is fantastic stuff and it cannot be under-estimated how important a joint communication would be in terms of putting our supporters' opinions across on this issue.

Welcome Allan!

I wouldn't be so confident. Our government seems intent on making legal decisions for other countries on the hoof.

MB: I don't doubt this is political grandstanding of the worst kind. However, because of that, there will be pressure for this Bill to deliver results (in the short term at least). Does this mean groups like the Green Brigade with their banners of hate will finally be dealt with? No, it means daft wee 15 year old Joe Bloggs on Facebook, half-p!ssed on cheap cider as his parents neglect him will be made scapegoat. This isn't a serious attempt to address an exaggerated social disease. This is paying lip service to the sensationalist media ( I can't even say tabloid here) who criticise one minute then count their pennies the next. There is something shameful here. But it need not be a secret if we act together to expose it.

Surprised no-one wants to discuss this issue on here.

Pity - plenty more fish in the sea hopefully.

Now online folks - please forward this onto your respective representatives. Please note we'll also be producing a template letter which we'd like our fan groups to jointly sign and send to the Justice Committee and First Minister.

Working fine here mate.

Appendix 1 - Further reading: 1. http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/s4/bills/01-offbehfoot/index.htm 2. http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/s4/committees/justice/or-11/ju11-0102.htm#Col5'>http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/s4/committees/justice/or-11/ju11-0102.htm#Col5 3. http://tinyurl.com/6hxse8l 4. http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/s4/committees/justice/papers-11/jup11-02.pdf 5. http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/vli/visitingHolyrood/chamberTickets.htm#comm 6. http://tinyurl.com/6g7kbx2 Appendix 2 – Justice Committee details Justice committee website is available here: http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/s4/committees/justice/ - Roderick Campbell MSP (SNP – North East Fife): Roderick.Campbell.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - John Finnie MSP (SNP – Highlands and Islands): John.Finnie.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - Christine Grahame MSP (SNP – Midlothian South): Christine.Grahame.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - Colin Keir MSP (SNP – Edinburgh Western): Colin.Keir.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - James Kelly MSP (Scottish Labour – Rutherglen): James.Kelly.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - John Lamont MSP (Conservative – Berwickshire): John.Lamont.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - Alison McInnes MSP (Liberal – North East Scotland): Alison.McInnes.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - Graeme Pearson MSP (Scottish Labour – South Scotland): Graeme.Pearson.msp@scottish.parliament.uk - Humza Yousaf MSP (SNP – Glasgow): Humza.Yousaf.msp@scottish.parliament.uk

Conclusion: Finally, to get a better idea of what is driving all this political posturing, one may examine a freely available document regarding the Strathclyde Police Authority’s intention to change the way the charge their member clubs for their policing requirements.6 Late last season I’m sure we all remember a variety of high profile police figures calling for a plethora of different ways to treat Old Firm games in particular – from outright bans on the matches to bizarre scheduling suggestions. Indeed, it was only last week that the traditional Ne’er Day derby was moved forward from a Public Holiday to a mid-week evening. A coincidence? I think not. It is quite incredible then that just as the Government push through flawed new laws, the very people tasked with preventing such crimes look to increase their costs to the detriment of our safety. It is up to us to expose such hypocrisy before this Orwellian nightmare becomes a distinct reality. Politics, money and control – perhaps this could be the Scottish Government’s own Secret Shame?

Recommended questions: 1. Will there be minutes kept of all meetings? Why not? They should be public record. Are we being told or consulted? As taxpayers we are footing the bill for this expensive issue. 2. Just recently, after the Scottish elections, two young people lost their lives by knife attack. Yet this Government has chosen to rush through an ill-conceived and badly thought out Bill on offensive singing at football matches. Do you not agree, given the severity of the consequences of both issues, that this Government is showing a grossly misguided sense of priority in bringing forward its legislation? Is sectarian singing at football matches a more grievous matter than knife crime and two people being murdered? 3. As discussed, last week, on Tuesday the 14th, each and every member of the Justice Committee unanimously expressed – on record – grave concerns about the rushed nature of this legislation. Normally as far as I can gather, any legislation on Criminal Law takes 18 months to 2 years to pass through Parliament. Why, on such a contentious and important issue is the Government disregarding past good practice in matters of Criminal Law legislation? 4. Before the Bill was presented, I couldn’t access any information whatsoever about it. Furthermore, in my opinion, ‘Stakeholders’ were invited to this event as an afterthought - perhaps it was an afterthought after the Justice Committee’s meeting on Tuesday last. We are being asked to give our consideration on proposed legislation that we have no knowledge of – which should be regarded as being at the least shoddy, and at the most, something that belongs in a dictatorial state. There has been – as we are all aware - a synopsis of it available on Internet forums (via an email from Margo McDonald MSP). Why did the Government choose to leak the information in this way? Why haven’t one of the key stakeholders here - the fans - not been consulted and why were we not provided with a copy of the proposed Bill before the tardy invitation? Why has this Government decided to ride rough shod over past good practice? 5. Will the final Bill clearly define what the terms “offensive” and “sectarian” and “anti-religious” mean in a legal context? Who is left to decide? Is it a matter of how many people complain about perceived offence? 6. Why does it not also define “open support for terrorist organisations and activity?” 7. During past government-funded investigations into sectarianism in football the role of the media and their associated responsibilities was discussed. Are there plans to involve them again given the often inaccurate and sensationalist nature of their ongoing coverage? 8. Will the Government be issuing comprehensive guidance on the Bill so that Crown Office, the Police, the fans and the general public will be clear over what constitutes offensive behaviour or sectarian intent?

It is clear then that there are serious doubts with regard to the hasty judicial and legal process being followed here. Therefore, it is incumbent on every Rangers supporter concerned by this farcical issue to ask the direct questions of those involved. To that end, I was astounded when I found out earlier in the week that the official Rangers fans group (the Rangers Supporters Assembly) were not initially invited to the Stakeholder Meeting held for the people directly affected by the Bill in Edinburgh on its presentation day. In actual fact, only the actions of a concerned citizen made them aware of the event. Meanwhile, the independent (though government backed) Rangers Supporters Trust were also only informed late on. Yet less involved groups such as the 'Orange Order' and 'Cairde na hÃ?â?°ireann' were sent invites. Rather bizarre given the wording of the draft Bill. To my knowledge no internet site administrators/owners were invited nor have been consulted at any stage. It seems what we have then is a hastily constructed and inherently flawed legislation which will affect many football supporters in Scotland and beyond. The aims of the people behind the concept remain unclear and the Law Society and acting QC's are doubtful whether or not anyone charged under the proposed law would ever stand trial. Nevertheless, while political own goals have already been scored this Bill will progress and will be passed. It is up to us to ensure we do not lose our opportunity to affect it. Therefore, it is more important than ever for the Rangers support – and particularly our fan groups – to work together, united as one, to lobby as effectively as possible. Indeed, the Justice Committee has already made their ‘Call for Evidence’ where we can write to them to submit our feelings on record.3 It is fair to say a unified letter from our fan groups (as well as associated websites) would put across a strong message. [As well as the ‘Call for Evidence’, there is also a public meeting scheduled for this coming Tuesday4 of which you can attend (and book tickets for).5] As ever, Gersnet is keen to assist our fan-base in any way possible. As such – after consulting an expert in such legislation - we can recommend the following questions (below – in bold) to be asked when you contact both the committee and/or your own MSP (see Appendix B). Please be polite, succinct and ask for a prompt reply given the unseemly pace at which this issue is moving.

http://www.gersnetonline.co.uk/2010/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=416:gersnet-investigation-into-sectarianism-bill-sham&catid=1:articles&Itemid=67 As we’ve covered on our @GersnetOnline Twitter account over the last few weeks the SNP’s new ‘Sectarianism’ Bill was introduced to the Scottish Parliament yesterday (Friday). I’ve not used its full name (you can find that below) as I wanted to use the one word you won’t actually find anywhere in the draft legislation as no-one (5 years and millions of pounds of public money down the line) can define what this is or what terms are actually covered by it – the real secret shame indeed. Onto the Bill1 itself and while any reasonable person would agree further debate and discussion is certainly required to rid our national game (and society) of this scourge; any reasonable person would also agree the rushed and flawed way this Bill has been progressed is not the way to go about doing so. Indeed, everyone from the Moderator of the Church of Scotland, to the Catholic Church, to the Law Society and even the Justice committee charged with ensuring the draft Bill is suitable to be passed (in the next two weeks incredibly) have said as much. Let’s look at the initial comments from the Justice Committee:

Will have a full article on this asap. Was planning on publishing it tonight but something tells me it would have been lost in the hullabaloo over Whyte's interview tomorrow.

Yes - wide-ranging and exciting stuff. Let's see if it all comes off though. PS: Russell appointment confirmed by club.

That's what it means but I didn't randomly pick that number. Watch this space.

Welcome to Rangers, Gordon Smith. Looks like Ali Russell will be joining you upstairs. Am also told Bougherra will be sold as bids are about to be made for Cuellar and Bartley. May be up to seven new players signed. Exciting stuff if it comes off!

That's true. I wonder who will win?

Not sure about McNee but Traynor was definitely banned by Souness.

Did you? What's yer tag? Find it hard to keep up with who is who on there!