Walterbear

Staggering. I could almost get s not proven fraud verdict but how he got off with the companies act charge is mind boggling.

He seems well connected in US money circles (going by previous media reports) but trying to attract investment during the HMRC years has been virtually impossible other than through rich supporters (without whom we would be in much more serious trouble). Hats off to them!

Could be a combo of ST money, King bringing forward his financial commitments, offloading as many of current squad as possible. Maybe the other Directors have made commitments in respect of ongoing operational costs. The players we are being linked with seem to be the type we need from a physical perspective. If we land 3 or 4 in this mould I doubt we will be getting kicked off the park by the Tims.

The Mexican Pena. Looks a player. Clips on YouTube. Pretty physical and knows where the net is. No small amount of skill

Just trying not to get carried away. Folk can come up with long lists if they want. Id be more inclined to think along the lines of 2 or 3 priority positions. Centre half, centre midfield, goal scoring forward.

If the EBT case goes against the old company / Murray then it is a judgement against Murray. Murray is a key witness in the criminal case against Whyte in front of a jury. The fraud case may then be compromised. Therefore they will probably let that run its course before announcing their judgement. . Think about it - the EBT case was months ago. They have obviously made their mind up already and are waiting for something. The old company which owned Ibrox and Auchenhowie has not been liquidated yet. If Whyte bought these assets fraudulently they still belong to oldco. Oldco may well owe the taxman 90m. That is the problem. HMRC may be easier to deal with but they won't just go away much as we wish they would. If Whyte never legally owned the assets neither he or D&P on his behalf could sell them. That's the plain logic. Need to keep feet on terra firma hence my concern about endless lists of players we appear to be buying.

The EBT judgement will not be far off (once the Whyte case is done with) and I wouldn't be surprised if we lose it and HMRC insist BDO go after auchenhowie and Ibrox. If Whyte is guilty of fraud then these assets may still sit with the old company in liquidation. Point is I don't see where all the money is coming from as we may need to buy these assets back. There are still a couple of nasty surprises in the offing so might want to keep our feet on the ground. PC may need to keep more of the squad than he wants. Sorry to be a depressing sod.

They absolutely hate us. I was as shocked as anyone at the level of vitriol 5 years ago but perhaps it was always there and they needed an excuse. I do not see it going away ever. Solution is focus 110% on activities that help us beat them on the park, ignore them (except libel/slander) and f*** them. Rebuild our own story based on success. No quick fix. As long as we are rubbish on the park it actually makes us an easier target. Win on the park and we can put their bile down to envy.

How does that statement from 1872 help weeblue? I'll bet many thousands of Rangers fans have the DR on their iPhones or access their URL. DELETE IT NOW. That would be far more effective a message. Given Scottish football depend on BT sport and sky sport money and the most televised team is Rangers I would suggest a more appropriate action would be for 1872 to work with the club, compile evidence and have a meeting with the executives of those organisations to explain exactly what the problem is , why it hurts decent fans, and what steps they want to see to improve the situation. I would hazard a guess they don't see what we are seeing. I'll be blunt - I think the 1872 statement is pretty lazy and ineffective and adds to the problem. If I were a 1872 shareholder that lack of professionalism would be my concern. I'm not a shareholder but I have a right to a view because the actions of 1872 in response to this constant bile affect all Rangers fans. This whole scenario is again a symptom of how fractured our club and support can be. The statement is just another shot from the hip. I hate to say it but the Tims know what they are doing in terms of fan voices and what you might call 'corporate' messages but it takes hard work and a professional approach. I know one thing that all of this will get easier if we win football matches and as I said any effort not dedicated to that goal either on the pitch, in the boardroom, in the commercial dept, in the fans groups is a waste of effort. The statement from 1872 is not a statement that takes us anywhere. In fact it keeps us in a negative spiral.

Boabie we've a million things to fix. Mudslinging with these cretins isn't one of them. It's just more bad publicity. It reflects and magnifies their stupid comments. Their employers will now think they're doing a good job because they are getting attention. That's their game. everythimg comes down to getting results on the pitch and every minute spent on activities that doesn't help that goal is a waste of time and effort. Rather than spend hours writing and agreeing and publishing this it would be better if they challenged the club on how to improve revenue streams from our own media channels or how to expand our fan base with positive interaction with kids or whatever. This is just negative. These emotive statements have to stop. Challenge in fact, libel, slander but ffs rolling around in the gutter with Sutton and Jackson is mental.

I agree. Ban them and ignore them is all that is required. Spend more energy building our own mobile and online channels with real news and real information. If we don't care about their opinions (which apparently we don't) then why keep complaining about them? This appears to be 1872 defence Ning a role for itself. I actually find it quite cringeworthy that we concern ourselves with what Sutton and Jackson think - unless of course they libel or slander us. Would be better investing time and effort working out why Rangers TV doesn't work or advise the club on what kind of online experience with apps and websites that fans want.

Made me laugh on a sad morning ?

We may have one advantage if we start training early but on pure quality terms we are very unlikely to get to the group stages (even with a couple of signings). However getting the name back in Europe is the objective so would be a bonus to be in that final qualification round (mysteriously called the play off). We need to be realistic this next year. Within 10 points of the mhanks and a group qualification would be exceptional

The youngsters have done well in difficult circumstances. Well done to the coaching staff. Barjonas looks the real deal. As these lads develop physically and with game knowledge the future looks promising if we can keep the production belt going and as others say bring in a bit of quality and toughness. 2 or 3 years we may have something.

Ticketus loaned him the money which he put in an account which was proof of funds for the deal to purchase the club. Collyer Bristow used this as their 'proof of funds' statement. In itself not illegal to get a loan. Once he is owner however he then gives ticketus the season tickets for 3 years which ticketus sell for more than the loan. In other words by paying the loan back with season tickets (after he has control of the club) he is effectively buying the club using Rangers assets - which is illegal. He had to have the money in the account before Murray sold him the club. Murray and McGill are saying they were not aware he was doing that. Findlay is suggesting Murray knew he had no money therefore did not buy the club fraudulently (the first charge). The second charge relates purely to the ticketus arrangement. NB. The normal business model for ticketus in football is a loan and that is repaid by handing over future ticket rights rather than cash. But to do this to actually buy the club would be illegal.

Thought the thread was about pedros choices. There are no more than 3 or 4 of the current first team who he should keep. It's not as easy as singling out the centre backs. Defence starts at the front.

I think the centre backs have suffered because the full backs can't defend wide positions and so they get caught out of position and outnumbered when Tavernier for example goes AWOL. Part of that problem is because we lose the ball going forward (constantly out tackled from what I can see in midfield, forwards who are amongst the worst in our history etc), full backs not knowing when to go and when they stay (pompously referred to as transition nowadays). Centre back is the easiest position on the park but a nightmare if folk are running at you and it's 2 against 3 or more. The only successful tactic this group can adopt at a higher level would be all out defence (try beating 6 dustbins). Reality is we are crap and the difficulty is identifying which individuals could step up. Probably 3 or 4 at most.

South Americans are a big risk but if he can get one or two he trusts who can harden our team I'd go for that. Be worth it just to sort out Brown and Racist Griffiths (a term he should always be referred by). The young Ghana lad might be worth a punt. If he's one of the better African centre backs he can't be too bad. Doubt krankjar will be his anchor. I think he's got one eye on retirement. I'd actually give Kiernan a chance playing in a proper defence and MOH may be worth a chance in a better team but both may have had their fill. I'd give forester a chance. He has ability if he can screw his head on. Foderingham would not be my No. 1. Dont know why Gilks wasn't number 1. There may be some improvement in McKay but not sure he's cut out for Scottish football. He'd probably do well in Portugal or lower levels in Spain or France. If I could get rid of players top of my list would be Waghorn, Dodoo, Wilson, Hill (age), Halliday, Garner, Krankjar (injury man), senderos, Foderingham (we can get some money for him), Tavernier (he's just a bit crap at defending but might get a few quid), That would allow me to replace the spine. The difficulty here is it is impossible to assess how some may improve with tougher management, a bit more confidence and surrounded by better players. Im pretty confident Waghorn, Dodoo, Wilson, Halliday and Garner would struggle irrespective. I think he said he had a list of 12 so my guess is he wants 12 out and the majority will be those he has seen in recent weeks. Of course god knows how many he will actually be able to get rid of for contractual reasons without giving them free transfers. So I don't see him raising more than 3 or 4m in transfers, maybe he will get 6m from the Board. it's not a lot to challenge the peasants but it should be enough to take a step up. He's in for a tough season but he seems a tough guy. We're not going to have too many 'Rangers men' unfortunately.

They needed the sale. That doesn't make Whyte innocent however. It's like a harbour full of pirates.

Lots of stuff today but what stands out is Collyer Bristow appeared negligent in backing up Whyte by confirming their client had appropriate funds ( this is a big deal for lawyers to do that). Also before Whyte was on the scene the club was being run in a reckless manner as evidenced by the 39 month notice period for Bain (and the EBT gamble). Total lack of corporate governance. It seems Murray put lots of clauses in the contract with Whyte to ensure the club was run properly and that Whyte became accountable for tax debt, stadium, players. It appears that the extent of Whytes reliance on ticketus was concealed fromMurtay by Whyte (and possibly CB) but that Murray and mcgill had advised Whyte it was an option for peaks and troughs. What also stands out is HMRC turned down 10.5m to settle the BTC. Overall impression is 2 groups of shysters trying to do the dirty on each other. I am however delighted all of this is in the public domain. It reenforces Rangers and our fans are the victims.

Collyer Bristow coming out of this pretty badly at the moment. It's a good Twitter feed fs.

It doesn't mean it mate I would agree. But I'd like a lawyer who understands these things to have a look at it because it stinks. Rangers fans cannot be the only ones punished in this disgrace.

Exactly. Would you sign it if you knew the club was being bought using its own money (against company law) and the other good point raised is whether certain directors including LBG directors acted in the best interests of Rangers. The whole thing stinks. This isn't the same as the ManU situation.

If they knew it was coming from ticketus they have questions to answer with respect to company law.

The laws of the game that I am using gaffer ( see below). The straight leg versus blended leg is not referenced at all here incidentally so that is not the deciding factor. The tackle on Miller is a red imo as it is excessive force and endangering an opponent (Miller could have landed on his neck). The elbow is a red (unless you believe Miller ran into Browns elbow and Browns elbow was in a natural position - Charlie Richmond lol) https://www.fifa.com/mm/document/afdeveloping/refereeing/law_12_fouls_misconduct_en_47379.pdf