ascender 352 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Yes, Miller has improved and became a key player, but unfortunately he's playing in the SPL at a club who are now operating under a very strict wage system. I guess what's frustrating is that this wasn't resolved earlier so we could have got more of a fee for him. I don't think our financial position will have changed much in the last 12 months in terms of the sort of offer we were able to make, so I don't understand why its come down to this. If it was all about the money for him, then he could have gone earlier, but of course, there is the argument that he wouldn't have got such a lucrative deal if he hadn't been a regular for us this season, so maybe that's where you might expect/hope some more loyalty from his side? We don't know his personal situation either, but even with a short playing career, its not like footballers don't have more than enough time to prepare for life after retiring as a player. Given the wages he's picked up, is it too hard to think that a player might want to carry on playing at a lower wage with a club where he's happy, playing in Europe & winning trophies? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I see it from a monetarist viewpoint (Accountant in me...) I fail to see why he should show loyalty to the club before he should show loyalty to the future of his family. Clubs very, very rarely show loyalty to their players. It is a business so they shouldnt have to. In the same vein, it is also a business for players, so why should they show loyalty which wont be reciprocated ? He was being offered a one year deal for less money - compare and contrast to Bursaspor offering him a 2.5 yr deal on MORE money - why should he feel he should have to stay at Rangers ? He gets paid to do a job and since he returned he has done that job well for the most part. Why does he now owe Rangers anything ? Mike, whilst he may not have got as lucrative a deal as he has were he not a regular this season that does not escape the fact that he HAS been a regular and HAS been playing well (mostly) and HAS been scoring a plethora of goals. The argument about getting a lucrative deal IF this or IF that happened is nothing more than hypothetical. Simply, there is another club who value his services higher than Rangers do. It is a financially rewarding contract to the player and he is well within his rights to accept it. I just cant see why he should show loyalty to the club when they obviously dont value his services as high as Bursaspor (yes, admittedly, it isnt necessarily a "valuing of services" but financial constraint that has meant we cant offer as much as Bursa - but that is hardly the player's fault and, in fact, our financial instability could also be justification for leaving itself). 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmck 117 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) I see it from a monetarist viewpoint (Accountant in me...) I fail to see why he should show loyalty to the club before he should show loyalty to the future of his family. I fail to see why you or anyone other than kenny miller should try to see it from anything but the club's point of view or a fan's point view though. His family already has a good future unless he's spendrift. Not that his family should matter to us. Why any of that would even cross the mind of anyone is utterly beyond me. I'm not interested in how well he can justifying leaving - he either stays and bangs in the goals or goes and become irrelevant. His motives, whether they're good or not, is just a non issue for me. I just don't know why anyone would want to put themselves in kenny miller's shoes other than in the sense that it would be an opportunity to play for rangers. eta: The only reason I'm going on about this is because I find myself saying all this to my mum the other day, and I thought "What the fecking feck am I justifying kenny miller's decision making to my maw for?" This is just a merry dance of spin to avoid us either disliking him or into criticising the club for not keeping him. Edited January 19, 2011 by bmck 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 I fail to see why you or anyone other than kenny miller should try to see it from anything but the club's point of view or a fan's point view though. His family already has a good future unless he's spendrift. Not that his family should matter to us. Why any of that would even cross the mind of anyone is utterly beyond me. I'm not interested in how well he can justifying leaving - he either stays and bangs in the goals or goes and become irrelevant. His motives, whether they're good or not, is just a non issue for me. I just don't know why anyone would want to put themselves in kenny miller's shoes other than in the sense that it would be an opportunity to play for rangers. eta: The only reason I'm going on about this is because I find myself saying all this to my mum the other day, and I thought "What the fecking feck am I justifying kenny miller's decision making to my maw for?" This is just a merry dance of spin to avoid us either disliking him or into criticising the club for not keeping him. But if you dont want to see it from his point of view then why should anyone see it from the clubs point of view ? In fact, lets just look at it from the clubs point of view. They cant afford to offer him more than they have. It is less than he currently is on. So the club would have known that he was likely to leave. As has been spouted all too often, he has no loyalty. So, from the clubs point of view, why did they simply not try to shunt him earlier for a higher fee ? And if he goes and becomes irrelevant - then what is the point in discussing it at all ? From my own perspective I am not trying to spin anything into liking or disliking his decision. I would prefer him to stay as he is in the best form of his career and could be pivotal to us winning the league or not. But I can see why he, or ANYONE for that matter, would want to go and get that last big contract elsewhere. You say it is "an opportunity to play for Rangers" - that is all well and good for you or I because we are lifelong fans of the club - but Kenny Miller, and thousands like him, are NOT Rangers fans and therefore the "opportunity to play for Rangers" will only get spouted out when they sign for us, or extend a contract - the reality is that all they really want (the VAST majority of players, not just Kenny Miller) is as much money as they can grab in a short(ish) career. If a lifelong fan of the club like Kris Boyd can leave for a sub-standard English team having rejected an IMPROVED contract at Rangers.... then what chance did the club have of retaining a non-Ger such as Miller on REDUCED wages ? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zappa 0 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 If a lifelong fan of the club like Kris Boyd can leave for a sub-standard English team having rejected an IMPROVED contract at Rangers.... then what chance did the club have of retaining a non-Ger such as Miller on REDUCED wages ? This is a great point! Personally, I think Boyd moved not for money, but because he wasn't happy here despite being a Rangers fan and there's a multitude of possible reasons for that. Miller on the other hand, seems to have been quite happy here, but it appears that he's chosen to move away primarily because of money. Remember, Boyd turned down a similarly lucrative move to play for Shotta's team in Turkey, so it wasn't all about money. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ascender 352 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 From the money side I completely understand his decision Craig. Its just that in a privileged position such as his, where money isn't such a pressure, you'd have hoped other things would come in to consideration. He's had a very unsettled career and seems to be in the form of his life at the moment as well as actually enjoying it, but who knows what's swayed his decision. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmck 117 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 You say it is "an opportunity to play for Rangers" - that is all well and good for you or I because we are lifelong fans of the club - but Kenny Miller, and thousands like him, are NOT Rangers fans and therefore the "opportunity to play for Rangers" will only get spouted out when they sign for us, or extend a contract - the reality is that all they really want (the VAST majority of players, not just Kenny Miller) is as much money as they can grab in a short(ish) career. There is no 'the' reality, though. There's always reality as it suits someone. While that may be their reality, it's not mine or any Rangers fan's. Shouldn't we be judging as Rangers fans? Shouldn't we expect, just as par for the course that when somone gets offered a wage that isn't derisory they should sign it? And when I say expect, I don't mean that we think that it's likely to happen, just that it ought to happen. To look at it from their perspective as someone who doesn't support the club etc is just to swap the interest of someone most interested in money for someone most interested in Rangers - that is a footballer's for a Rangers fan's. It seems nuts to me. If you said 'Kenny Miller will, because he's most interested in money, leave decent money at Rangers and go where the most money is' then I couldn't disagree, but it seems you're saying 'Kenny Miller should leave decent money at Rangers to pursue more elsewhere' and I just can't understand that sentiment from anyone other than Kenny Miller or someone who doesn't support Rangers. You only need to take it to more extreme versions to test it - if Brian Laudrup left us to goto Celtic for an extra ten grand a week we should all just think 'Aye, fair enough, he has to think about his family'. There's a world of difference between what you expect will happen, as a rational human being, and what you expect should happen, as a Rangers supporter. Once the Rangers fans just accept that it's all just about money, and look at it completely from the player's point of view, there'll be no benchmark of what's expected when you play for Rangers and all the standards, that are hardly ever but are sometimes in special and worthwhile ways met, will mean nothing. There'll be no way to distinguish between genuine servants of the club who met its highest ideals and rich journeymen money obssessed players because we'll already have aligned our standards with latter's. In a nutshell, from Kenny Miller's perspective people who only want Good Money instead of Ridiculously Good Money to play for Rangers are idiots or naive. I'm not going to align myself with that perspective. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluedell 5,356 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 There is no 'the' reality, though. There's always reality as it suits someone. While that may be their reality, it's not mine or any Rangers fan's. Shouldn't we be judging as Rangers fans? Shouldn't we expect, just as par for the course that when somone gets offered a wage that isn't derisory they should sign it? And when I say expect, I don't mean that we think that it's likely to happen, just that it ought to happen. To look at it from their perspective as someone who doesn't support the club etc is just to swap the interest of someone most interested in money for someone most interested in Rangers - that is a footballer's for a Rangers fan's. It seems nuts to me. If you said 'Kenny Miller will, because he's most interested in money, leave decent money at Rangers and go where the most money is' then I couldn't disagree, but it seems you're saying 'Kenny Miller should leave decent money at Rangers to pursue more elsewhere' and I just can't understand that sentiment from anyone other than Kenny Miller or someone who doesn't support Rangers. You only need to take it to more extreme versions to test it - if Brian Laudrup left us to goto Celtic for an extra ten grand a week we should all just think 'Aye, fair enough, he has to think about his family'. There's a world of difference between what you expect will happen, as a rational human being, and what you expect should happen, as a Rangers supporter. Once the Rangers fans just accept that it's all just about money, and look at it completely from the player's point of view, there'll be no benchmark of what's expected when you play for Rangers and all the standards, that are hardly ever but are sometimes in special and worthwhile ways met, will mean nothing. There'll be no way to distinguish between genuine servants of the club who met its highest ideals and rich journeymen money obssessed players because we'll already have aligned our standards with latter's. In a nutshell, from Kenny Miller's perspective people who only want Good Money instead of Ridiculously Good Money to play for Rangers are idiots or naive. I'm not going to align myself with that perspective. I don't get where you are coming from on any of that. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmck 117 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) I don't get where you are coming from on any of that. I'm not really sure how to respond as you've not said what you don't understand or "Are you saying this?" or anything. But anyway, I don't think we should be making any effort to see it from Kenny Miller's point of view. The only person doing that should be Kenny Miller. We should be demanding they love the jersey, even though we know in our hearts most won't. That's my point. If you start just accepting journey men money grabbing footballer's perspective on playing for Rangers as conventional wisdom, it's a bad road. I think the day we start thinking players of Kenny Miller's quality should be anything but honoured to play for Rangers is quite bad, even when we know in the modern world it's the sad reality most of the time. I dunno what's difficult to get in the idea that we should have sympathy for KM's motives when they align with the good of Rangers and he is interested in the good of Rangers, and none when they don't. Edited January 19, 2011 by bmck 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 2,499 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 The majority of professional footballers are mercenaries who need to learn a thing or two about loyalty. Sorry Gav i totally agree with your feelings,but loyalty is written on the back of pound notes these days. As BD says if i could double my wages at another company I would be out the door before they could say goodbye. Miller is doing what he thinks is the best option for him and he will have to live with that decision be it a good or a bad one. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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