Danny

I'd much rather have Wilson in the team from now on, period. Bougherra's mind has been elsewhere since last May. And it's been evidence in his displays. Wilson, otoh, is focused and sharp, and must be completely appalled to have lost his well earned place.

No, I'm saying the last time we had players of class was during the Advocaat era. Can't you read what's actually there rather than putting a critical spin on it? I didn't imply anything of the sort. All I said was the last time we had players of class was during the Advocaat era. What in the name of all that is holy moves you to misinterpret in such a way? I think anyone, to quote Totti, 'with half a brain' knows we will never spend like that again. Doesn't mean we'll never have players of class again. Yet more attempts at imbuing my comments with more than was actually there. I have nothing against you Calscott, but you've wildly misread a single sentence and taken meaning which wasn't there. You're not just looking between the lines here, you appear to be splitting the sheet of paper. Couldn't agree more. This is the problem. All I ever said was the last time we had players of class was the Advocaat era, and we have been declining ever since. I never said this was avoidable, nor did I 'advocate' big spending again. I called a spade a spade and you've turned it into a JCB.

I could ask you the same given you're banging on about Premiership clubs - 2 minutes ago you were trying to compare past economic climates with this one. What you'll bring into the debate next is anyone's guess. I feel you've missed my point entirely and are making your own, to quote your own word, erroneous arguments which don't address it. I also see you're doing the same with Andy Steel. You appear to be trying to weave a way around our points, dismissing what we've said and making new unrelated points which don't pour cold water on what we've said. All I said was the last time we had class was Advocaat. At no point did I say that overspending was acceptable - but that said, most clubs do it. You're the one screaming at me regarding points you seem to be attributing to me.

Thought I'd start a nice wee negative thread Without any doubt, there are some players in our team who are currently somewhat below their abilities, guys who are so gigantically out of form that it's worth a bit of a sob. Whether the formation is wrong, the morale is on the floor, the finances in disarray...these professionals being paid at least 10K a week are not doing the business in the way we know they can. Who are they? Lafferty: The biggest offender this season so far. I had lunar hopes for this guy after his emergence particularly in the 2-2 draw against Hearts at Ibrox last season, when he enjoyed a rare foray in the striker position and simply ran riot. Held the ball up with ease, beat men like they weren't there, scored a clinical goal, and looked every inch a 3.5M striker. His injury at half time was tragic, and his absence a major reason we conceded 2 in the second half - because instead of him holding the ball up at the Hearts end, they started pressing our backline and we caved in. This match showed what he could do, as did his display this season for Norn Iron, ironically again forced off during half time with an injury. For us? Abysmal - a shell of his capacity. Whether it's being played mostly out of position on the sideline as a pseudo winger, or some psychological effect of the divegate ban I don't entirely know, but Lafferty is quite some way off the potential we saw in him fleetingly last year. Thomson: I didn't buy into the Kevin Thomson Future Captain and Demigod Hype like many supporters did, but I do know that his pre-injury displays far outway his current contributions by a 14 tonne weight. The fact his name is almost never mentioned in tv commentary, the fact that his only meaningful impact on games seems to be rash tackles and yellow cards and the fact he makes no creative spark tick on the pitch at all suggests his injury may just have permanently damaged him like Mols' did. This is not to say the 2 players are comparible, but pre-injury Thomson, while over-rated imo, was still substantially better than the anonymous makeweight masquerading under his name these days. Miller: Without an open play goal since the Dead Sea merely had a bad cold, Miller is really struggling for inspiration, form and composure. He was never the most classy of strikers, but seemed to have the backbone to take the big chances when they came. Look at Parkhead and Easter Road last season. He seemed the perfect man to fill the lone striker boots of Cousin in the CL - especially in light of his national displays in the same position. But that match for Scotland against Holland where he did everything but score seems to have been the catalyst for his latest bout of meagre form. He is quite an inconsistent chap Miller - when he's good he's really great, but when he's not on fire he struggles with his entire game. Wasn't able to get a goal in the CL, struggling in the SPL, and generally below what we know he can do. Davis: Nothing new here, is fantastic between July and November, average at best between November and March, then hits form after that till the end of the season. Same old Davis. Bougherra: What's become of the second half of last season's fantastic defender? This season he's poor at the back, getting caught out all the time, failing to cover gaps and generally looking thoroughly uninterested. He admits himself he was slow to start last year, admitting he didn't click till January, but after that till the summer he was, I concede, fantastic. This year, beginning with his appalling displays at the Emirates, he's been a shell of his old self, so much so Wilson must be gutted to have been dropped in favour of him. Weir: Understandable this one, and maybe a bit unfair on the part of yours truly, but Weir has been absolutely horrible this year. I considered him our best stopper last year, in light of a consistent overall season. But this year he's been completely dire - getting way to close to strikers half the time, letting them turn him easily, before fouling them. Yeah, he has a football brain, but I think the body gave up by about the end of last year. Sorry to use the excuse, but he's too old and shouldn't be playing anymore. Because he's not good enough now. Naismith: We were all delighted at his emergence in the summer, but since the season's got going in earnest I have to say what serious contribution has Naismith made? He's looked promising in glimpses, patchy periods of hope, but overall he's made next to no impact this season. He is absolutely not the boy wonder we hoped we'd see when he had a very good pre-season. There's potential there, but I'm not seeing much of it being realised at the moment. Rothen: Whatever happened to this guy!? After a virtuoso display in Germany where he looked every inch the left sided Beckham label he's been lumbered with, he has faded into nothing. And not even faded - he seemed to receive all the blame for our defeat in Unirea because he's the only guy who featured that night who hasn't featured for a single minute since then. Swine flu? He denies it - just a cold he says. Rothen has been bizarrely cast out from first team affairs, while we know he's capable of much more than he's been given the chance to show. You don't play 15 times for a strong French national side if you're not much cop. Comments/agreements/angry objections welcome

Davis: he seems to have the same season for us every year - bright for the first few months, has a stinking lull in the late autumn winter early spring, then hits form again as spring deepens. Thomson: I never bought into the hype surrounding him, but even I am aghast at how catastrophically abysmal he's been since returning this season. Whittaker: Seemed to reach his career peak during the run to Manchester, and since then has been going backwards in every sense. The only notes of optimism I have are: McGregor has been sensational this season - negative being the inevitable vultures. Emergence of Wilson who must feel utterly downhearted at being ditched for Bougherra. Edu's still to come back. Lafferty is capable of much better than what he's shown, but must also be played as a second striker and not a winger. Beyond these I am struggling.

He was the manager of Rangers for a while after that till he went too far and stuck those fingers up.

Quite honestly, the source of the lavish spending isn't the point, nor is the fact that it put us in debt. My simple point was that his squad was the last time we had class in our team, and we've been declining ever since. If we're not allowed to compare our current squad and club with past ones because of different economic climates, then I guess discussion on the entire subject is null and void.

I find this a staggeringly insulting comment. Walter Smith has spent somewhere between �£30M & �£40M on players in his second spell. I'll address this point when you've addressed the one regarding Smith's quite comparible spending with Advocaat's, and how it fits your argument.

The quality of our squad has been declining since Advocaat departed. It's been a decade long degradation - from having the likes of de Boer, GVB, Mols and even Amoruso, to the current lot of total workmen. There has been no overhaul, just painting over cracks. The overhaul this club needs is new ownership, but that seems far off.

Only if it's well conceived. PLG was change. That wasn't good.

Did these players get us to the last 16 of the CL or not? That's the only claim I made. Presumably you have facts, figures, numbers, and evidence to back this up? I can't really be bothered arguing with you if this is the tone you're going to continue to take.

I don't have a short memory, but I do remember that the only time he got cash to spend was from the sale of Boumsong, and he brought in Wattereus, Buffel, Ferguson, Kyrgiakos - guys who helped us get to the last 16 of the CL. Eck did give us dark days. But he had so little cash. Walter doesn't have that excuse. And Scotland didn't qualify because Zambrotta dived. It's also very easy to call Birmingham the biggest club in the then Championship when it suits your argument to do so.

I was definitely one of those who underestimated how good Sevilla are. I proposed them as being a top 15 European side while now I have to say they're comfortably in the top 10. They are a fantastic, fantastic team blessed with an abundance of world class players who truly play as a team. They're very much the modern form of the great Mendieta Valencia side who humbled us back in '99. So in this sense, being outclassed by a team of this quality is excusable. The problem for me is that it felt like an insult to their stadium and fans last night that such appalling footballers as us were their guests. It's not just that we're not good enough to handle Sevilla - hell, Real Madrid struggled to do so and lost at the same ground. The problem for me, wherever it happens to stem from, is that our club as a whole is out of its depth against any half competent team, whether it is a European side or a mediocre SPL one. Our excruciating inability to play football, to link up, to dominate possession, to look at ease on the ball, to comfortably defend, to pass and move, to create several good chances...against all but the worst teams is beyond the pale. I'm not even attributing blame anywhere, mainly as I'm unsure where it would exist, I just feel helpless and incredulous seeing how below average as a team we have become. Even in Eck's day we had guys like Kygiakos, Buffel, Ferguson, Lovenkrands and Prso who all looked a class above and at their level in the CL - we simply have no one of the quality of what these guys were, and for a club of the supposed grand nature of Rangers, it's unforgiveable. Last night made a bad team look atrocious - and a world class team look like Gods. Until we get money, this is as good as it gets. And that's sickening.

Used to think that by the end of Eck's reign, but then look what he did with Scotland, then he got Birmingham promoted, and now they're comfortably mid table in the best league on earth. He doesn't seem to be so bad after all tbh. He also didn't have a quarter the money to spend that Walter's had.

Are we even playing this final match for pride? It's so bizarre to be going into match day 6 with nothing to play for. Well, I say nothing - if we were to achieve a pointless miracle and beat them, and Unirea beat VfB, then it's staggeringly the Romanians who win the group. So we do have a say in the outcome. Not that it really matters. Because the way we've played in this tournament, we don't really deserve one. Is this game really just about...pride?

Davis is on his usual mis-season lull between November and March. He's inconsistent and not influencing matches as he usually does at the start and end of a season. As others have said, he gave the ball away more than once and not until we were 2-0 up did he start to exert himself. But I guess you could levy that criticism at more than just him.

All we're seeing is the continued act of political correctness gone insane. It's been perverted since 'Oxford Inspires' decided to change the name of their Christmas Festival to 'Winter' and not 'Christmas' for fear of offending minority religions. This kind of PC has no sense in rationality, and it was only a matter of time before anything deemed 'maybe one person might be slightly bothered by that' in football was clamped down and punished.

Kris Boyd is always linked with some bizarre rich mid table team in some slightly obscure country during and prior to the transfer window. And Birmingham As for would I sell him? I feel an on form Miller and Lafferty offer plenty, but it's the 'on form' part they're struggling with.

Cheers. The minimised version is bearable, but as you say hopefully the final release allows it to be completely disabled.

But no way to fully eliminate it?

Is there any way to get rid of the popup bar at the bottom that is showing up at all times when I'm on this board?

He is a steadying rudder, without doubt. If anyone thinks the manager during a time like this isn't that crucial, look at Liverpool and their troubles - I doubt too many of them feel safe with Benitez steering their ship. Walter is steady and reliable, but, yet, even he has looked beleaguered in recent times - lacking his normal dignity and cracking a little under the pressure at times. He is only human, but in terms of getting through this spell of difficulty, we could have worse.

Anyone know what his wage is?

Amazing what happens when even the best players (and I don't include Bougherra in that) fall out with their team and suffer bad press through their poor conduct. Look at Cassano - he's a guy, on his day, as good as anyone around, yet his regular temperamental problems and falling out with his team mates and managers mean his value has never been especially high. Balotelli is another one - seems he's a prima donna, a bit like Bougherra, and rather than him being courted as a world class striker, he's someone teams are deciding whether or not to 'take a risk' on, which devalues him. And Inter hardly need the cash like we do.

I can accurately ping to Rangers players. I cannot accurately ping to players who can do something with the ball.