maineflyer

Hey girls, no offence to either protaganist but has become very very very petty.

I'll go further and say that unless the planning and preparation are improved, this proposal may have entirely the opposite effect from that intended.

This hasn't turned out to be a very edifying thread. I keep reading these things in the hope that I'll come across some comment that appears to be genuinely informed and which might help me to understand what the hell is going on. So far it's a fairly fruitless exercise. What I personally take from all this is that no one actually knows more than would keep the cold wind off a gnat's arse. I've wanted protests years before any supporter ever heard of Donald Muir but these "protests" currently being proposed could just as easily be targeting the people who are keeping us afloat. I'm not suggesting for a moment that Lloyds are our saviours but when you think about it, all that bank did was lend some money unwisely - hardly a standout amongst the banking community these last few years. Now the perception of risk has changed and they are exercising their interest in mitigating that risk by recovering their debt. What's to protest about there? I'd do it in a heartbeat if it was my money. Little is said any more about how we got in this God awful mess or who was responsible for the years of mis-management. Perhaps it would be possible to take seriously some of these supporters groups and their new-found energies if they had been prepared to open their mouths in similar protest twelve years ago when the financial destruction of Rangers FC was first set in motion. There is talk of putting pressure on Donald Muir when his actual role in this process seems anything but certain. And it's now the emerging party line that we should protest against Lloyds bank, not because the big bad banker has actually done anything wrong but because they've had the audacity not to include said supporters organisations in their deliberations. The Creator Himself would be hard pressed to account for the irony of it all. Why all the focus on Donald Muir? He's there to do a job and whatever that job actually is, I expect he'll work hard to get it done. If there is anyone who should be under pressure to communicate more effectively, it's our Chairman who has a responsibility to the both the shareholders and the supporters. What increasingly comes across is that these proposed protests are an expression of ill-directed frustration on the part of certain organisations, rather than something the ordinary fan might reasonably expect to benefit the club.

By which time you will already have committed your ST money and denied yourself any option not to renew, until spring 2011 ..... by which time in turn, it probably won't matter what you choose to do because we will either be totally fukked or have been rescued.

I can understand someone renewing their ST on some matter of principle but to propose doing so simply on the basis of always having done so before is fairly Jurassic. It's either admitting not actually having any reason for renewing or being unwilling to admit the true nature of the reasons you do

Freudian slip?

For a change, I wouldn't rush to argue with you on that one. I've long thought that was indeed the place to dump 15 tons of cattle slurry.

Murray has other priorities mate, he left any interest in Rangers behind long ago.... Murray steps in to save historic wine merchant David Murray: Has previously bought a vineyard in France. BRIAN DONNELLY 0 commentsPublished on 4 Feb 2010 Rangers owner Sir David Murray yesterday revealed he has bought what is thought to be the oldest surviving wine merchant in Scotland. The tycoon, who made his fortune from the steel industry before buying one half of the Old Firm, purchased Cockburns of Leith for an undisclosed sum after it went into administration last week. Analysts hope the football club ownerââ?¬â?¢s purchase of the 200-year-old business will boost the countryââ?¬â?¢s fine wine trade, which has been severely hit by the economic downturn. Founded in 1796 and based in Abbeyhill, Edinburgh, Cockburns has supplied famous customers including Sir Walter Scott, King George IV and Charles Dickens. Sir David, who reportedly bought a French vineyard four years ago, said: ââ?¬Å?Iââ?¬â?¢m delighted. It is the finest brand there is. We will develop the brand into an area where we see tremendous growth for us. ââ?¬Å?We are supplying to restaurateurs who want continuity with their wine lists. ââ?¬Å?What we are going to do is use the Cockburn banner and use it in different ways as well.ââ?¬Â While impressive, Cockburns cellar provides no surprises to connoisseur Sir David, who admits his personal favourite is usually a Burgundy. ââ?¬Å?I donââ?¬â?¢t think there are many wines that Iââ?¬â?¢ve not sampled. Across the businesses we have a range of about 500 products,ââ?¬Â he said. ââ?¬Å?We have bought the business, the trade records, some of the stock and weââ?¬â?¢ve taken the staff on, along with the name. ââ?¬Å?We are not competing with the bulk buyers. Typical customers for us would maybe buy from three or four suppliers so his wine list remains with the same brands so that the client can buy the same product when he visits the restaurant on a regular basis. ââ?¬Å?It is a very old, established Scottish business. It would have no doubt gone to somebody from outside who may have run the business down. ââ?¬Å?As much as it is progressive for us, it is defensive as well. Somebody could have used it as a template to attack our existing business. ââ?¬Å?This is our third acquisition of a wine business; we bought Edinburgh Wine Importers and TM Robertson.ââ?¬Â The latter was also saved from relocation to England. Ian McPhail, formerly of Cockburns Wholesale, has been recruited by (Edinburgh) Wine Importers to run the specialised division of the company. Billy Bell, Wine Importersââ?¬â?¢ managing director, said it would be ââ?¬Å?business as usual for Cockburnsââ?¬â?¢s customers after the uncertainty of the past week. In 2006, it was reported Sir David paid Ã?£3 million for Domaine Jessiaume, a vineyard in the village of Santenay at the foot of the CÃ?´te de Beaune wine region in Burgundy just a month after he bought Edinburgh Wine Importers for Ã?£1.1m. In 2005, he bought ChÃ?¢teau Routas, a 630-acre wine estate and five-acre truffle bed in Coteaux Varois, Provence, for a reported Ã?£5.5m. A spokesman for administrators Ernst and Young said that ââ?¬Å?the brand name, customer listings, book debts and certain stock of Cockburns have been sold to Edinburgh Wine Importers, a drinks wholesaler owned by Sir David Murray, the chairman of Murray International Holdings Ltdââ?¬Â. The company was placed into administration after being hit by the economic downturn and suffering from a declining order book. Edinburgh Wine Importers, based in Livingston, is now a leading independent wine supplier to the Scottish trade. The company, which was founded in 1975, was acquired by Sir David in 2006.

Very good post mate, straight to the heart of it.

If only ..... but how many opportunities does he need.

I wish I could say it was unbelievable .... but it's not. For years there have been abundant reasons to protest but Joe Average sat on his hands chanting the mantra "it's not the Rangers way". Now the idea of protest finally seems to be dawning on people as not only acceptable but actually our right - and what do we do - focus on the administration, form sub-committees and raising funds ffs. The support is suddenly full of "look at me's" and "we's", sewing banners and thinking up slick slogans. Vladimir Ilyich never had such toadies - but where were they the last time we protested outside the doors of Ibrox? Or protested outside the BBC offices?

You're bang on the money. Why do they always have to communicate via the public forums? Why can't they all just sit round one table and get organised - THEN come sell these ideas. the way it's being done here this morning is moronic.......... but very, very typical.

He lknows only too well what I'm asking, he just doesn't want to provide the answer.

I also noted that. It's endlessly annoying but, seriously, what else would you expect from these bastards? They always have to find a hook to fix themselves to in every crisis. The bigger the crisis the more desperate they are to latch on - not call ambulance chasers for nothing.

So suddenly you're talking for all Rangers supporters. Get fukking real.

Utter bullshit - go get ready before you start spouting that pish. If you know then say so, if you don't then you shouldn't be posting garbage like this with paypal requests.

Just to be clear, who exactly is "we"?

Once every year comes the one meaningful opportunity to exercise pressure on those running the club (whoever you might believe that actually is)..... and that is to withhold ST money. That's my view and I've written enough articles on the subject for years. You may not agree and perhaps some have different priorities but let's be very clear on two points........... 1. A season ticket is not a badge of honour that somehow makes anyone a "better" or more loyal supporter. 2. It is perfectly possible to buy a ticket for every game on an as-you-go basis, putting even more money into the club's coffers in the process.

It won't add much to this debate but I just like to say that, given the bloody awful state of our club, I think what David Edgar says or who he says it to is the very least of our concerns.

That's very good.

An accountants view. What about the lasting satisfaction from the exposure of blood and bone?:devil:

It's going to take something exceptional to blow away the stench of premature ejaculation coming from our resident oirish infestation and all I'll say on the Robbie Keane transfer (and there will be no apologies) is that I hope he breaks his fukking leg (either one will do) and plays no more than 30 minutes for the soapdodgers. The idea came to me as I listened to saint Hendrick's radio contribution to the bogtrotter's love-in this afternoon..... now there was one ugly bastard but at least he knew how to break a leg properly.

aaaaaaaaaarrggggghhhhh

The scumbags are taking these new players on board for only two games. I hope we can squeeze a result against them at Ibrox and their spending just might have been in vain.

It's not spin, it's just that you seem to be forever talking in riddles. It will no doubt come as a surprise but I doubt if many people read your posts and have the slightest idea what point you're trying to make. Frankly, you're virtually unintelligible ....... but no doubt you'll want to blame that on other people too.