maineflyer

What's wrong with the BNP. I'd as soon not vote for them as not voting for the other parties. Keep an open mind - democracy for all, as long as it suits those already in power.

That'll make you a novice compared with some of the old-fartism on here!:grin: Good to know you .... and welcome

rbr is right, never post links to these sites, always copy and paste the contents.

I'm not sure anyone is making a bid for the club. Surely this will be a simple sharesale between two individuals, one selling one buying. Effectively, the company won't change hands, only control of it.

It's a dubious democracy at best and seems to rely on co-option rather than elections. But much more importantly, it's utterly ineffective.... or as they say in the land of plain speaking, it's been fucking useless since day one and has steadily gone downhill since then.

I've absolutely no problem with you taking that view. I couldn't give a monkeys about the actual song, I'm no vocalist and you'd do well even to get me to hum along quietly in the background. My protest has always related to the apathy and apparent disinterest of the modern Rangers fan - and especially the sense of embarrassment I often get from younger fans that seems to infer everything before Murray dinosaur land. Well it wasn't perfect but it wasn't so bad either. It's probably obvious but I'm hugely irritated by the likes of the RST and its many pontificates achieving nothing. It's almost worse that ignorance or apathy when your activists turn out to be fucking useless - well useless if you judge performance by results. Singing the TBB seemed to be the antithesis of the awful RST talking/squabbling shop. That's all. We do need to move on, of course we do. But not out of guilt or embarrassment. We need to get our heads up, be proud of our heritage however it might not sit well with today's pc world, and find our future as a club and as a people defined by our past. We'll never find that future unless we first find some common identity. At the moment we still seem to be on the downslope, denying our old identity with nothing at all to gather around instead. I've read lots of tweets and other forums saying they genuinely want to find a new way forward but there is also a universal view that Mark Dingwall simply cannot be part of it, a measure if it was needed of the surprising depth of resentment that individual has created and probably a hint of how harmful his smothering of the RST has been. It won't suit everyone to believe one person could be both the barrier and the gate to progress but that's what I'm reading. And there's no point wanting change without being prepared to address whatever is stopping it - the trouble is that Dingwall's removal has to be voluntary, no one can actually make it happen unless he agrees. For that reason I'm currently doubtful the current mess can be improved.

Not a chance while they control the fucking media. If no one prints it or broadcasts it, how exactly will it become public.

In Article 6 and Article 11 in the Maineflyer Regulations it entitles me to shoot anyone wearing green and white hoops who walks up my driveway. It doesn't necessarily mean it's right or lawful. Edit - OK, it doesn't mean it's lawful.

Of course it's a trap. The whole campaign is a trap. All I'm saying is that there will be people with knives in their chest, on either side, due to the passions being stoked by an irresponsible media. While McGolliwog, Spiers, Muirhead and the rest are shit stirring, and while more reasonable journalists are riding the bandwagon, there WILL be consequences of an entirely more personal and tragic nature for ordinary people. But there will be no summit about that eh?

I know this, if we step up to the plate and don't commit ourselves wholeheartedly then we really will be fucked.

On the contrary, I think they're rattled by the directness of Bain's accusation.

This is turning into farce. We all know songs are sung by crowds as an expression of solidarity but when you think about it, what business is it of UEFA to judge the songs or the singing. What next - marks out of ten for lyrics and melody? A morality version of Eurovision? If public morality has now become the province of football authorities, is it only be judged in terms of the collective voice of crowds. Would Jim Torbet abusing children have led to a ban on Celtic admitting anyone under the age of twelve to watch their games. Or the Catholic church systematically buggering children prevent the participation of catholic coaches or managers throughout Europe? Did the mass murder and ethnic cleansing of Bosnians see UEFA banning the Croatian or Serbian FA's from Euro Championships? Did Franco's systematic brutality of his citizens see Spanish clubs banned while Real Madrid were winning all those European Cups? Is having an owner involved in dubious business deals an afront to UEFA's moral code? Are convicted criminals to be banned from attending football games? Are players convicted of breaking the law to be suspended? Or Ginger haired managers suspended for beating their wife perhaps, where does UEFA stand on wife beating? Surely UEFA is a body to administer the game of football in Europe. Surely we already have governments, legislatures, police and courts to establish codes of behavior and deal with offences against the public interest. Where in the legal framework of any European country does it accommodate UEFA to act as judge and jury on the conduct of it's citizens? UEFA is effectively serving punishment on private companies on the basis that criminal law is being broken on it's premises by individuals who are not employed by it and have no contractual responsibility to it. And UEFA is doing this, not on the evidence of it's own police service interpreting it's own laws, but on the reports of unaccredited and unaccountable individuals and organizations, sometimes with a clear conflict of interest. In this part of the world enormous effort is placed upon ensuring democratic governance. We willingly rush to war in order to assure our democratic rights and award Nobel Prizes to those who foster democracy across the world. The exception appears to be our willingness to stand aside while a footballing authority intercedes in the legal affairs of our citizens and corporate organizations. We demand no democratic credentials of UEFA, there is no accountability required, and no democratic participation by the individuals being judged by it. I have no problem with UEFA judging the conduct of it's constituent clubs and national FA's. I have a huge problem with UEFA stepping outside its footballng perimeter and judging the conduct of private citizens who are not members, employees or owners of those clubs. That, in my estimation, is a matter reserved exclusively to the national and EU courts. If I am to be excluded from attending a football game on the decision of UEFA, where do I seek redress for the constraint of my freedoms? The answer of course is that I don't. I am punished after being judged by a body with no jurisdiction over me and without ever having been convicted of any offence.* This might seem to be a pointless perspective but I think it lies at the heart of the entire madness and is the crack though which personal interest is able to leverage collective behaviour. It's why we go to such enormous lengths to guard our democracies. At least that's how the script is usually written.* The rise of the sporting authorities, their growing wealth and political influence, and their impact on nations and citizens alike is not limited to football either. Perhaps the best example of why someone urgently needs to stand on UEFA's toes is the mind boggling corruption of the Olympic movement. In the history of western society and with the possible exception of the catholic church and FIFA, has there ever been a less accountable organization that wielded more power and influence than the IOC? If this is the template that UEFA is now embracing then it is perhaps no surprise that it has little interest in respecting the rights of people like you and me. We all realize there are indeed issues to be dealt with but every one of us needs to think seriously about the deeper and more insidious game being played by those who are in a position to threaten something altogether more offensive than the songs being sung at football matches.

It's getting very dirty now. Someone is going to get very hurt because of this.

At last. I can't find words to express the relief I feel at reading that post. Thank you TB and those other RSC reps.

You know Dutchy, I wonder if any of us appreciates just how far that particular web stretches. It's not Celtic and it's not the Irish thing, it's not religious and it sure as hell isn't a racial matter. It's not even unique to Scotland. These are just convenient vehicles for a catholic cult determined to lever itself into positions of power within society. Spurred by a need to address the negativity of the abuse scandals, they seem to have accelerated things recently but in reality this has been the way of that cult for two thousand years and they're exceptionally good at it, and totally dedicated to the political game. I mean, any organisation that can sexually abuse children for hundreds of years in every corner of humanity and still promote itself as a force for good in the world has to be either mad or bad or both .... but it also has to be incredibly adept at gaining and using influence in high places to survive and prosper. It's like a bloody cancer and it's all over us at the moment. I think we're only beginning to see the results of what has been happening in dark corners for a long time.

No point Ian. It's not their guilt that's in doubt, only the willingness of those organisations to do something about it.

And some of them look kinda scary too

The one thing I'd be quite clear about is that Queen's Counsel don't make apparently unguarded and reckless public statements without having thought carefully about the consequences. I would have to believe McBride made a conscious decision to give that interview and a conscious decision to say what he did. Why he did so remains unclear but I'd steer away from assumptions of rash stupidity.

Indeed it has. Shame too many couldn't see past the grammar.

If it did get this far with doubts remaining over funding then the Rangers board should resign immediately for gross incompetence and start finding good lawyers.

Aw come on, it was better than that. The choice of bait, the presentation on the hook, the cast into shallow water and the patience to know that in the end the bait would have to be taken. Sadly, when brought to the bank it turned out to be disappointingly lightweight and had to be thrown back.:fish:

Ha ha the sheer irony of it. That could very well be the perfect Pot calling the Kettle Black statement. You have to love footy forums.:D:D

Sometimes "fuck off" is the only appropriate reply.

No ... they'd simply have something else to shout about.

That's the point though, according to you it's black and white, if 'they' take offence then it's offensive, regardless of the content or intent, and the only way to remove the offence is to stop singing the song. I'm afraid you seem to be the one with the fence wire rubbing your crack.